N7700 Problems with 1.5TB Seagate

[phildog33]

im receiving my N7700s tomorrow and im still not 100% sure..

so just 128kb stripe size
7x 1.5TB drives in RAID 5
ZFS structure

and thats it.. if you want more than 8TBs volume... but the data capacity is less than 8 still?

[tristratos]

The .5 Tb difference is for the other Thecus tasks like nsync/ usb snapshot and stuff.
It always allocates some space for the rest no matter what.. but that is not really of a problem.

The real problem is with 1.5 reallocated sectors...

[tristratos]

So where is Thecus representative ?
Where is Yvon ?

Noone reponded to any of the questions!?

Is Thecus hiding from something ?

T.

[mbusse]

Another Update..

So, last time I posted, I had 5 1.5TB drives in my N7700 in a Raid 5 array. One of the drives was SD1A, and the other 4 were CC1H firmware. I have copied almost 3TB of data to the volume with no problems and it has been several days now. Tonight I decided to remove 3 other 1.5TB drives I had in my computer so I could add 2 of them to the N7700 as spares and would set the other in the drawer to use as a hot swap if ever needed. Now here is the interesting part. I mounted 2 of them in the N7700 in slot 6 and slot 7, I powered on the unit and logged in. I took a look at the drives section and saw a warning next to both drives. The drive in slot 6 is SD1A and is reporting 1717 reallocated sectors, the drive in slot 7 is also SD1A and cannot read the smart info, it just reports N/A for all fields expect the model number. I removed the drive from slot 6 and replaced it with the spare I was going to put in the drawer, it also is reporting warning and reallocated sectors. Now, keep in mind that all 3 of these drives were pulled from a computer and working fine and mounted in the N7700, I did not even add them to the array, just mounted them and they are all getting warnings. At this point I am wondering if there is a problem with the backplane on the N7700. This seems very odd. I will be opening a ticket with Thecus, then look to return the 3 drives to Seagate.
There is no reason why these newly added drives should get the reallocated sectors so quickly. Something just does not feel right here.

[Chrisjsherwood]

The 2 smart warnings I had were in position 2 and 6.

I continue to have the N7700 shutting itself down. Any guidance from Yvon would be helpful.

I still have not entrusted any data to the unit.

Regards Chris

[tristratos]

This is getting rediculus.
n7700 was supposed to be a there to protect our data and all those errors still appear.

It is anything but professional for Thecus not to respond to these error reports.
It's been so long before Yvon or anytone elss from Thecus reponds to these two errors

1) Seagate1.5 Reallocated sectors - Will they ever be fixed or simply return the drives back ? Did Thecus try to resolve the issue at all or consider it a lost case ?

2) Thecus shutting down lock-ups. Why do they appear to Chris !? Is this a known bug ? I have't experienced the error yet but if it does, it might lead to data loss!!

It will be really apreciated if Thecus officialy responds to all these.

T.

[Funkstar]

This thread seems to be going round and round in circles.

Thecus have said they will not officially support the 1.5TB seagate drive as it is quick to show SMART errors. There are no other 1.5TB drives to compare this to, so they are not going to increase their SMART tolerance to avoid this issue until there is.

Thecus could change their software so the SMART errors don't appear as easily, but in doing that they may very well be risking your data. As other have also pointed out several times, this is a consumer drive that was not designed to be used in an Enterprise RAID environment. You might not being using the N7700 in an enterprise, but that doesn't take away from the fact that that is exactly what a 7 drive RAID-5/6 array is built for.

[tristratos]

Funstar,

So why don't they simply officially say that 1.5 Seagate drives are just a LOST case !?
Why do they even include it is some of their docs, even in a note ?!!?!?!?

Notice that they just say "Currently we do not recommend using Seagate 1.5 TB HDD on N7700/N8800 NAS."
WHAT DOES __CURRENTLY__ MEAN ? DO THEY WORK ON IT ? DO THEY EXPECT SEAGATE TO FIX SOMETHING ? WILL IT EVER BE ??????????????????????
SHOULD THE DRIVES BE ENTERPRISE TO WORK ? IF THEY DO WHY DO THEY EVEN REFER TO IT ?

Why do they even keep the _SLIGHTEST_ hint in the air, that they might fix it in the future as Yvon stated??? What does the due to be released 1.5 or 2T drives from other than Seagate vendors have to do with that satement at all !?!?!? (*)

Are 1.5 Seagate drives a lost case or not ?
Do they __intent__ to include any kind of fix or not?
If not, why don't they report it officially ?
All this time they just try to be good to their users and Seagate. THEY better NOT be !!!
Don't you see? Everybody expects a CLEAR answer!

Haven't you noticed that all those people are still buying those drives due to this marketing hype?
It is at least unprofessional for Thecus to _MIS_inform people as well as their resellers for this, because THAT is exactly what the do!!!

Do you still believe that I am wrong ? Check the following !!!
One of their major __OFFICIAL__ resellers in UK scan.co.uk do include 1.5T seagate's in their solutions.
(http://www.scan.co.uk/Product.aspx?W...roductFeatures). Same case with span.com and other resellers in Europe as well as worldwide!!!
And please do NOT blame them for this!! It is THECUS to blame !!! They haven't stated that clearly!!!!! THEY haven't even PREVETED _their_resellers_ from including them in their proposed HDD listings -for their product's sake at least- , What do they fear ?
If _their_ official resellers do that, what _their_ users should do/ understand out of it ? If that isn't mis_information, WHAT IS ?

If that is not due to Markerting I wonder what is it for? If that is not akward user support, I wonder what is !?!?
Why should all those people get into this nightmare situation just to realise that the drives are simply faulty ?

It would have been even more professional to their users to just inform them that 1.5 seagate is just OUT of consideration completely due to those risky SMART reallocation warnings! Don't even inlude them at ALL in your docs and officially inform their users as well as their resellers for this!

(*)
And let me say that I really DO NOT understand what would happen when other 1.5T or 2T drives come out ?
WHY the SMART attitude would change then as Thecus(Yvon) states!?
It's really preposterous!!!
It is either logical to get SMART values right up high even on new drives OR NOT!!
It is either risky to have SMART warnings OR NOT!!!
Isn't that why SMART reports are made for?

Excuse me to say but other than _A_SUSPICIOUS_MARKETING_TRICK_ (from BOTH SEAGATE __and__ THECUS) there is NO middle case and NO excuse at all!!

I don't really shout at Thecus all this time in favour of Seagate. Seagate 1.5 might be faulty after all. Thecus is much more technicaly approved, to verify that these drives are a lost case. Community just waits their notice!!!!

SO __THECUS__ DO NOT HIDE - GET OUT FROM YOUR CAVE AND REPORT IT CLEARLY!!
- Force YOUR_official_ resellers to remove them from the product's proposed HDDs lists
- Inform YOUR users to return their drives BACK as soon as they are allowed to do so!!!
- Prevent YOUR future new owners to get into this akward situation with 1.5 seagates in Thecus n7700

THAT announcement would be really appreciated by the community INSTEAD of including it somewhere in your docs JUST due to this marketing strategy!!

THECUS, don't you see that all this attitude of yours, really hurts your new released products (n7700 and n8800) prespective?

Excuse my long post, But I guess everybody expects Thecus verdict for this!

My 2 cents...

T.

[Jurist]

WHAT DOES __CURRENTLY__ MEAN ? DO THEY WORK ON IT ? DO THEY EXPECT SEAGATE TO FIX SOMETHING ? WILL IT EVER BE ??????????????????????
SHOULD THE DRIVES BE ENTERPRISE TO WORK ? IF THEY DO WHY DO THEY EVEN REFER TO IT ?
<remaining Nerd Rage snipped>

Dude, everyone else gets it; Thecus has not approved that drive, and won't until there's more information. They can't necessarily stop their resellers from installing those drives. Please stop hounding the Thecus rep and repeating the same questions over and over. If the 1.5TB drive doesn't work AFTER Thecus adds it to their supported drive list, then you can continue your rant. Until then, you've made your point (and then some) so please -- take a break! Once you do that, the Thecus rep will come back and answer those questions that haven't been addressed yet.

[Funkstar]

Funstar,

So why don't they simply officially say that 1.5 Seagate drives are just a LOST case !?
Why do they even include it is some of their docs, even in a note ?!!?!?!?

Because the drive isn't a lost case, at least not at the moment. Right now the drive isn't on the officeial supported list, however thay have made some alterations to their firmware to help people use it if they want to go against the recomendations of the compatability list. this may well change with newer updates from Seagate to the drive or after much more testing by Thecus. We all know how long it takes to built and test different configurations with that much storage space, long term testing of the 1.5TB drives isn't going to be quick nor easy.

As for vendors selling units already populated with 1.5TB drives, well, thats up to them. At least that way they can test idividual drives before it ships. Also you have one vendor responsible for the whole unit. If something isn't right that vendor is completely responsible for it while under waranty.

[tristratos]

OK, you tell me to wait...

Till then more and more are having the same problems
http://forums.hexus.net/thecus-care-...ing-disks.html

I know.. eternity is all so close... so wait...
I wish I knew for what and this is where no announcement is up there yet...

T.

[mbusse]

My continued update...

I have owned 10 of the 1.5TB drives since receiving my N7700. Half of them resided in my computer, and the other half were new. Over the weekend I rotated all 10 drives into the N7700. Out of 10 drives 7 are good with no reallocated sectors. I am running a raid 5 array using 5 of the drives, and 2 drives are marked as spares as I am sure I will experience more of the sector reallocation on these 7, thus needed that level of comfort. The other 3 drives have 1717, 65, and 40, reallocated sectors. I will be sending these back to Newegg for replacement.

I did receive a reply from Thecus on my ticket opened for the 1.5TB sector reallocation. The response to my ticket was just a link to the supported drives page which now has a line at the end of the page saying that Thecus does not recommend using the 1.5TB drives in the N7700 or the 8800. I also spoke to Seagate regarding this and was basically told that these are not enterprise drives and thus are only supported in a desktop environment and in a small Raid 0 or 1 array. Personally, I would say that using the 1.5TB will be use at your own risk. I really cannot blame Thecus or Seagate.

Personally I will continue to use the 1.5TB drives until Seagate releases Enterprise 2TB drives. While this has been frustrating, I now understand it better in regards to support, etc.

I still really like the N7700 and am quite happy with my purchase.

I do have a question for Yvon, as I have 2 drives marked as spares, if there is a drive failure in the Raid 5 array, do the spare drives automatically become part of the array thus taking place of the failed drive? Or do I have to manually intervene?

[Thecus - Yvon]

Dear Mbusse,

If we 2 drives been marked as spares, if 1 HDD out of RAID and system would take 1 spare HDD to rebuilding the RAID automatically, also system performance would going down while RAID rebuilding.
Also it is dpend on the RAID type as like RAID5 allow lose 1 HDD only, if during rebuilding process and another HDD out of RAID, this RAID5 would damaged too, if get such condition please provide the CONF.BIN to Thecus HQ http://esupport.thecus.com for us doing something as possible.

[Chrisjsherwood]

To : Thecus Yvon.

Yvon, I am getting abnormal shutdowns most days on N7700, inspection of the log shows:-

::Due to the system has recorded abnormal shut down previously; folder quota synchronization will take place in 10 minutes time. During this period youmay face system performance is going down.
Could you help please

Regards Chris Sherwood

[deanpm]

deleted dbl post

[deanpm]

Since the current N7700 and N8800 FW v2.01.06 do not address SMART info very well on Disk Status, we provide beta FW 2.01.07.4 to change the SMART info.

these are beta so pleae be aware of that fact

http://www.thecus.com/Downloads/beta..._2.01.07.4.bin
http://www.thecus.com/Downloads/beta..._2.01.07.4.txt

http://www.thecus.com/Downloads/beta..._2.01.07.4.bin
http://www.thecus.com/Downloads/beta..._2.01.07.4.txt