Disturbing update to Microsoft's Services Agreement

[Saracen]

No it's not a no, I've already provided the articles that show what services Windows 10 uses even when you're not using them yourself (I.e Windows 10 uses those services independently of the user), if you choose not to read those articles that's up to you, if pleading ignorance and then accusing someone of FUD because you refuse to read the articles they provided then that's your choice, you can only lead a horse to water, you can't make them drink so they saying goes.

EDIT: Not that I'm expecting you to actual read the articles, but just in case you CBA to scroll up the screen to find the links to the articles that give you the names of some of these services that are covered by the MSA, installed by default in Win10, that you seem so desperate to know about then here are links to the two articles again, The Arstechnica Article, and the Rob Seder blog post.

You said it yourself. If Windows is using software to communicate, in the background, without your knowledge, then YOU aren't "using the services". Microsoft is. That might be obnoxious of them, it might be invading your privacy, and it might be spying on you, but I can't see any definition under which it makes the PC owner a "user" of those services.

You, it seems, do think that. Fair enough. But that's why I agreed with you that there was "no point" continuing the debate.

[Corky34]

You, it seems, do think that. Fair enough. But that's why I agreed with you that there was "no point" continuing the debate.

Fair enough, I guess how the Windows 10 EULA and the MSA are interpreted is ultimately one for the lawyers.

[Saracen]

Fair enough, I guess how the Windows 10 EULA and the MSA are interpreted is ultimately one for the lawyers.

Ultimately, yeah.

I'm certainly not in any mood to tackle MS in court, though, so it comes down to either accepting whatever interpretation MS choose to apply, or simply not using relevant MS products or services in the first place. My current stance is I'm not using such services, and have yet to go to Win10. And very much doubt I ever will.

[Splash]

No it's not a no, I've already provided the articles that show what services Windows 10 uses even when you're not using them yourself (I.e Windows 10 uses those services independently of the user), if you choose not to read those articles that's up to you, if pleading ignorance and then accusing someone of FUD because you refuse to read the articles they provided then that's your choice, you can only lead a horse to water, you can't make them drink so the saying goes.

EDIT: Not that I'm expecting you to actual read the articles, but just in case you CBA to scroll up the screen to find the links to the articles that give you the names of some of these services that are covered by the MSA, installed by default in Win10, that you seem so desperate to know about then here are links to the two articles again, The Arstechnica Article, and the Rob Seder blog post.

You'd already provided the links, and I'd already read them. I also see no reference in either of them to an end user using any of the services listed. As Saracen has pointed out, Windows sending data to servers identified as being related to those specific services does *not* constitute an end user using those services. Again, as Saracen has pointed out you seem convinced that it does.


I'm not, as you suggest pleading ignorance. I'm asking you for clarity. So, in the interest of clarity: please indicate from the list of services below (which I took directly from the MSA) which an end user is forced to use (and as such, bound by the terms of the MSA) with Windows 10.

The following products, apps and services are covered by the Microsoft Services Agreement, but may not be available in your market.
Account.microsoft.com
Advertising.microsoft.com
Arrow Launcher
Bing
Bing Apps
Bing Desktop
Bing Dictionary
Bing in the Classroom
Bing Input
Bing Maps
Bing Navigation
Bing Reader
Bing Rewards
Bing Search app
Bing Toolbar
Bing Torque
Bing Translator
Bing Webmaster
Bing Wikipedia Browser
Bing.com
Bingplaces.com
Choice.microsoft.com
Citizen Next
Cortana
Default Homepage and New Tab Page on Microsoft Edge
Device Health App
HealthVault
Groove
Maps App
Microsoft account
Microsoft Family
Microsoft Health
Microsoft Translator
Microsoft Wallpaper
Microsoft XiaoIce
MSN Dial Up
MSN Explorer
MSN Food & Drink
MSN Health & Fitness
MSN Money
MSN News
MSN Premium
MSN Sports
MSN Travel
MSN Weather
MSN.com
Next Lock Screen
Office 365 Consumer
Office 365 Home
Office 365 Personal
Office 365 University
Office Online
Office Store
Office Sway
Office.com
OneDrive
OneDrive.com
OneNote
Onenote.com
Outlook.com
Picturesque Lock Screen
Pix Lock
Skype
Skype in the Classroom
Skype Manager
Skype Qik
Skype WiFi
Skype.com
Smart Search
Snipp3t
Spreadsheet Keyboard
Sway.com
Translator
UrWeather
Windows Live Mail
Windows Live Writer
Windows Movie Maker
Windows Photo Gallery
Xbox and Windows Games published by Microsoft
Xbox Live
Xbox Music
Xbox Music Pass
Xbox Video

[GuidoLS]

You'd already provided the links, and I'd already read them. I also see no reference in either of them to an end user using any of the services listed. As Saracen has pointed out, Windows sending data to servers identified as being related to those specific services does *not* constitute an end user using those services. Again, as Saracen has pointed out you seem convinced that it does.


I'm not, as you suggest pleading ignorance. I'm asking you for clarity. So, in the interest of clarity: please indicate from the list of services below (which I took directly from the MSA) which an end user is forced to use (and as such, bound by the terms of the MSA) with Windows 10.

The following products, apps and services are covered by the Microsoft Services Agreement, but may not be available in your market.
Account.microsoft.com
<snipped a lot of stuff>
Xbox Video

The vast majority of which can be outright removed from the system with NO consequence. The only two I see which either cannot be removed or would cause severe issues are Cortana (which cannot be removed - only disabled, and crippled by removing the voice recorder) and OneDrive, which can be removed, but will break the file system at some point.

(not commentary on the post - continuation)

[Corky34]

You'd already provided the links, and I'd already read them.
Blahh..Blahh.Blahh

As has already been pointed out we disagree, simple.

Lets leave it to the lawyers shall we, unless you really want to waste everyone's time with hours of debating something that ultimately wont be decided until such a time as Microsoft finds themselves in the courts, something that is probably inevitable seeing as they found them selves in a similar situation with the simple inclusion of an Internet browser.