System freeze and blue screens - AN8 Ultra

[Fred-K]

Apologies about the long post but this is a bit of a saga and is taking quite a bit of effort to track down.

I currently have a system based around an AN8 Ultra motherboard. The
system contains the following:

Motherboard:
AN8 Ultra

BIOS Version:
Phoenix 6.00 PG 21/7/2005 Original Version 17 - current version 20

CPU:
Original: Athlon 3500 - New: Athlon X2 4800

Memory brand:
Corsair Original 2x 512MB VS512MB400 Added TWINX20483200C2PT

Memory size:
Varies between 1Gb and 3 Gb depending on what I'm trying to test. Currently the two 1GB units.

Memory configuration:
Has varied between
2 x 512, DIMM 1 and 2 Corsair VS512MB400
2 x 1024 DIMM 3 and 4 Corsair CMX1024-3200C2 (TWINX CP3200C2)
on upgrade. Is now just the TWINX in DIMM's 1 and 2

Graphics card:
Radeon x800 GT

Graphics driver version:
Latest available from ATI website.

Power supply maker:
Unknown

Power supply wattage:
350W

Storage devices:
Seagate 300Gb hard disk

Operating system:
Windows XP Home SP2


Originally the system was equipped with just the two 512 MB memory
modules and had an Athlon 3500+ processor. I upgraded the
processor to a 4800 X2 first (since AMD abandoned socket 939). A week or two later, I added in the TWINX Corsair 1GB memory modules.

Initially I had a number of blue screens which said that there'd been a Machine_Check_Exception. Also there have been a larger number of
occasions when the system has just frozen, requiring a hard reboot. The
system freeze originally occurred both when running Windows and also when
running Knoppix, which indicated a hardware problem.

I originally assumed it was a memory problem as I didn't notice any problems in the time between installing the processor and the extra memory. I contacted the Corsair forum and they suggested upgrading the BIOS and the processor driver, and possibly the chipset driver. They also suggested checking the memory (with MemCheck86)

Initially I ran MemCheck86 from a CD for around 10 hours and it found no faults with the two sets of memory installed. I've also used MemTest for windows and it also has found no memory errors.

I then upgraded the 4800 X2 driver (from the AMD website). When this didn't work I tried upgrading the chipset driver. No improvement.

I then contacted support at abit.co.uk. They figuratively threw up their hands in horror and said that memory shouldn't be mixed (despite the AN8 manual saying that it can). I removed the 512 MB units (leaving the 1GB ones in DIMM 3 & 4). This didn't improve things and also introduced a new problem that the LAN connection kept dropping out and reconnecting every 5 - 10 minutes). I put the two 1GB units in slots 1 and 2 which cured the LAN connection problem but not the system freezes. I then removed the two 1Gb units and reinstalled the two 512Mb ones in DIMM's 1 and 2. This didn't cure it so I removed the two 512Mb units and reinstalled the two 1Gb ones.

I then bit the bullet and upgraded the BIOS (I left it till last because of the possible dire consequences of a failed update).

So far there haven't been any freezes in normal use (touch wood three times and spit) but I have found that it will freeze if I use my USB external hard drives (one a Lacie 160 Gb, the second a brand new WD 500 GB one), which I use primarily for backup purposes. I have a data folder of around 50 GB (currently) which I want to backup (I just copy the whole folder) regularly. I initially wanted to backup to the Lacie as I want to reformat the WD to NTFS (it's been factory set to FAT32), and I don't want to do a format if a freeze is likely to occur part way through it. As I'm running short of space on the Lacie (keeping generations of backup) I now have to delete any failed backup before trying again.

There's no consistency in the freezes, sometimes it will freeze when deleting a failed backup, sometimes part way through a backup (It got as far as 37 Gb once before freezing although it's gone at almost anytime part way through).

There doesn't seem to be any problem with large scale data accesses on the hard disk as I can run the virus checker with no problems (touch wood ...).

Oddly enough, I retried doing a backup using Knoppix (5.1.1) to the Lacie and although it stopped after copying 34 Gb, this was due to it thinking that the disk was full (for some reason Knoppix thinks it only has 125 Gb rather than 150+ usable GB). So I then copied the folder to the WD USB drive using Knoppix and, hallelujah, it worked (i.e. it copied the folder fully). I assumed that there was thus a problem with the Windows USB drivers and did a repair installation with Windows but this hasn't cured the problem in Windows.

Strangely, I've used a set of USB headphones to listen to a 39 minute MP3 without any freeze occurring.
Perhaps there's a problem between the 4800 X2 driver and the Windows USB drivers for external hard drives? Perhaps this only occurs whene there is large scale data transfers taking place as I can view the two USB hard drives both through Win Explorer and with Tree Size.

Have you any suggestions as to what a) the problem might be and b) what I can do to rectify this?

[ABIT Sean]

If I was you I would start by replacing the PSU. 350W is a little low for your new setup.

[Fred-K]

Thanks for getting back.

How would this help as both the USB hard disks have their own power connections i.e. they aren't taking any off the USB connection itself?

[Lvcoyote]

Fred,
You cant even begin to trouble shoot the system until your power supply is adequate enough for what your trying to build. My suggestion would be a PSU with a minimum of 24 amps on the +12v rail, and secondly something around 500 watts.

[Fred-K]

Thanks for the advice. I'll will get another power supply sometime soon. Given the good write-ups they've had, I'll probably go with one of the Corsair ones.

However it does appear as if the problem is circumvented, if not completely solved. I'm not sure why I didn't find these before but there are two relevant posts on abit.care: forums.hexus.net/showthread.php?t=102741&highlight=an8+ultra and forums.hexus.net/showthread.php?t=61035.

They looked a bit like the problem I was getting. Luckily for me the system builder incorporated a PCI USB card in the PC. I plugged all of my USB devices into hubs and plugged them into the PCI card. Result: only one freeze since then, and that was when I forgot and plugged my flash memory into one of the front (non PCI) USB ports. I've managed to transfer around 200Gb of data onto the new USB external hard drives in several separate sessions without problems.
The original blue screens and random freezes seem to have been fixed by upgrading the processor and chipset drivers and upgrading the BIOS (mainly the latter I think). The USB problem seems to have been circumvented by using USB ports plugged into a PCI card only (I haven't had to downgrade USB in the BIOS to 1.1 or disable it altogether).

It looks like there is some conflict between an X2 processor, the nForce4 chipset drivers and Windows USB drivers, this despite it being the latest version of the chipset drivers. The problem didn't occur when transferring data to the USB hard disks under Knoppix. Echoing what one of the posters said on one of the posts referred to above, it seems strange that a chipset could be released with an error like that in it.

Going back to one of the earlier problems, could someone give a view on why the ABIT manual state that "When installing FOUR DIMM modules: Install DIMM modules of the same type and size for slots [DIMM1]+[DIMM2], and slots [DIMM3]+[DIMM4]." (Section 2.3) while the person at tech support says that memory can't be mixed on the board. I bought the TWINX memory because of what the manual says and the recommendation from the Corsair memory configurator. Had the manual stated clearly that memory can't be mixed, I'd have bought a different type of memory. I've now got 1 Gb of apparently unusable (Corsair) memory.

[Fred-K]

The forum management software seems to have taken exception to posting url's. The links are both on the forums.hexus net. 1) has the rest of its address as: showthread.php?t
=102741&highlight=an8+ultra

2) has remainder of its address as showthread.php?t=61035