Does the win on sunday sell on monday idea still work today?

[Knoxville]

Just a thought I had while i was watchin some touring car footage earlier, back in the day it used to hold true, people would watch RS500's/modeo's, cavaliers/calibras and laguna's battle it out in the BTCC and in rallying mini's, early escorts and audi quattro's etc on a sunday afternoon and on moday morning their road going counterparts would see sales change depending on what went on out on the track. I started wondering does it still happen today? Rally and Touring car coverage seems hit and miss all I seem to see today is F1 cars and as Jaguar proved with their ill fated F1 outing it doesn't seem to hit sales up any. Is there anything still in it for car manufacturers to run in these races, it ain't exactly cheap, there've been rumors of both ford and subaru pulling out of the wrc due to budgets and rules changes how long will it go on for?

The only cars I've really noticed recently that have gained a reputation from rallying or infact any form of motorsport recently is the mitsubish lancer and subaru impreza and tbh those cars had already gathered a cult following of their own. Which kinda brings me to my next point, how much technology are we seeing filter down from motorsport these days, race cars used to lead the way in engine tech/suspension and chassis development and you could actually buy cars with this technology built in, quattro's, cosworths, 6R4's, mini coopers, race cars for the road that have earnt themselves a legendary reputation and not just that they were within reach of the working man, what cars do we have today like that? the RS Focus thats now out of production? Ferrari's with flappy paddle gearbox's and carbon fibre this and that? The new toyota supra certainly doesn't have a 3 litre F1 derived V10 now does it? Infact toyota are being quite apprehensive about the car after the results that came back from the latest test beds weren't found to be exactly outstanding, they don't wanna have to part with the cash to develop a new chassis let alone include any racecar tech in it.

I seem to have veered slightly from my original point but I feel the issue's are linked, not only am I beginning to question the future of motorsport as we've known it in the past but also, how long are the big car manufacturers going to continue building high cost halo products like the supra, skyline etc. when the higher powered production cars like the civic type R and the clio 182's of the world are enjoying better sales at half the development cost? Yes these cars feature technology that was pioneered in motorsport but its technology and production methods decades old.

Other than for something to watch on a sunday afternoon do we still need motorsport? And how long is it going to be before more car manufacturers start to notice this and take action?

[Rave]

Well F1 started this, when it became more about cash than technology. Active suspension would be sweet as on a road car, but F1 banned it in the early 90s so it fell out of demand. Same with CVT- Williams gained 2s a lap, but it was banned before they could even do one race with it. I say **** the FIA. GPWC can't come too soon IMO;.

[Konan555]

Ford are more into 'prestige' road models as sales boosters than the used to be. Case in point being the RS Focus, sold at a £4K loss. I think pretty much all of their motorsports departments have gone now, in line with job cuts in the UK. They no longer support Jaguar for racing and Cosworth went over to VAG a while back. Think they shed some of the smaller devisions, like the one that developed motorsport electronics (name anyone?).

[dkmech]

Theres a V10 in an m5. Although its 5L. I am sure theres still innovation coming from f1, but with very restrictive rules it is indeed limited. I am not sure where impreza and lancer would be without rallying. Often a cult following is not enough. As for supras - if there is a gap in the market someone will make them. Look at nissan 350z - seems to be a success.

I am also not sure what ferrari sales would be without F1 and other races.

[5lab]

afaik active suspension which was developed by lotus wasnt actually banned by the fia - instead it was dropped by lotus because of the power (something like 5-10%) that the hydrolic pump drew from the engine..

i dont personally think any f1 innovations drop down to cars these days - car cos have more budget to spend on production cars. some things do benefit the manufacturers though - i mean do you really think the merc maclaran would have such pedigree if they weren't in f1?

on a side note - car co's making fast cars does (imo) bolster their image - i mean look what the vx220 and monaro are doing for vauxhall!

[Knoxville]

Same with CVT- Williams gained 2s a lap, but it was banned before they could even do one race with it.

See it'd be interesting to see tech like that filter down into our performance cars, but it just ain't happening

[Rave]

afaik active suspension which was developed by lotus wasnt actually banned by the fia - instead it was dropped by lotus because of the power (something like 5-10%) that the hydrolic pump drew from the engine..

It was banned at the start of the 1994 season.

[Zak33]

I haven't seen Sales Figures influnence by Motor Sport matey ..not for years.

But Network Q DID used to get a big hit on the Sunday of the rally.....if I had any sports hatches I NEEDED themon the NetQ web site by the weekend of the rally or I'd miss out.

However, now, I only see a benefit in technology, NOT in sales

One exception......

Club Motorsport....but in reverse.....if you WORK for a manufacturer you WANT an older one to race

[Knoxville]

There's not even that much advance in technology though now, and it saddens me tbh

[5lab]

thing is, cvt has been around for donkeys years (daf were doing it in the 60s), and while its theoretically the ultimate gearbox (max power whatever the speed, max economy otherwise) it has failings which is why today it still only has a small share of the auto market - for starters engine revs do not rise with accelleration (sometimes the opposite happens) which can be disconcerting, and imo removes from some of the fun of driving (but surely all autos do that..?)

[Vimeous]

Technology from motorsport has always been an intreguing question.
Pretty much all composite materisla currently used in automotive mass production today have at some point been used or are still being used in the highest levels of motorsport. Indeed without the advances seen in the production of larger and larger pieces of carbon fibre many of our favourite modern high-performance cars would be too heavy and therefore slow to make them feasible.
Cylinder lining materials, the use of magnesuim alloys, carbon brake discs, active suspension (adaptive damping etc), traction control (in all its myriad of forms), advanced aerodynamics (venturi tunnels, underbody dynamics), helmet design, remote car monitoring, ad infinitum.
All these things have appeared in a wide range of motorsports well in advance of any of us seeing them on the road.

Could this all be done without motorsport?
Yes

Is motorsport therefore necessary?
Absolutely.
The competitive nature of motorsport allows any and every idea to tried in the pursuit of competitive advantage. It is a breeding area of innovation in concepts, materials, electronics, dynamics and more. It's the ultimate feasibility and teething trouble testing ground.
These are things a financially tied automotive manufacturer simply cannot invest time or money in. They COULD but never would.

We need motorsport and the more diverse and varied the better!