Forza and DiRT - physics vs grahics trade-off?

[colincliff]

I'm interested in the comparison between Forza 2 and CM DiRT for the xbox 360.
In lots of reviews there seems to be the agreement that the Forza 2 team have used the 360's processing power on the car realism and physics where as the DiRT team have used it to make amazing graphics.

Do any of you clever people think that its possible for a console like the 360 to run a game that has both the gameplay and physics of Forza along with the graphics of DiRT, or will there always be a trade off?

I dont know much about programming games, but it seems like as console mature developers manage to get much more out of the systems than earlier games.

Is it just a case of how much time/money developers are prepared to put into a game, or are we now reaching the limitations of the current consoles?

Any ideas from people in the know.....

[kalniel]

We're nowhere near the limits of the current consoles. Multi-threaded coding is still very immature, and for sure it'll be possible to have the graphics of DiRT with the physics of Forza 2.

It's partly time/money, but it's also about experience with the technology and availability of third party engines - typically it's not cost effective to design whole game engines from scratch for every game so recycling game engines is a big part of it. Indeed some game engines are even re-cycled from previous generation consoles, so it can take a long time for them to take advantage of the hardware, and then for a game to take advantage of the engine in turn.

[Tom Scott]

Colin McCray isn't that far off Forza in terms of physics in my opinion, when you loose traction or hit a slight bump on one side it reacts very well.

[colincliff]

Thats good to know. It seems like we're beginning to get game which really show what the current consoles can do, and it great that these will keep getting better.

I know that good game play is not all about the graphics etc, but it certainly is nice to watch things like Colin McRae and the depth of the racing simulation in forza is also amazing.

I played Rainbow 6 vegas for the first time this week and the gameplay engine in that game is excellent!

[Veles]

I think the main reason why the graphics aren't as good in forza 2 is because it's running at 60fps and it has all those physics calculations going on. But keeping the framerate at 60fps at all times require quite a lot of graphical horses.

[Tom Scott]

Well in all honesty, I find that Colin McCray plays better than Forza in terms of fun. Its awesome ripping through some trees at close to 100mph then handbraking round a slippy gravel hairpin, cocking it up doing 3 rolls and watching bits fly off your car.
The damage modelling on Colin McCray is lightyears ahead of Forza - another thing it does better.

Different games, different styles, different approaches to each game basically. In all honesty I'd actually have to give Colin McCray a better review score than Forza 2. Its just more fun to play than driving round the same tracks with what is always a faster car than that of your AI opponents.

[MadduckUK]

Its just more fun to play than driving round the same tracks with what is always a faster car than that of your AI opponents.

eh? going by that argument forza's single player game is better than sitting in dirt's menu for an hour so forza must be better?

[Tom Scott]

eh? going by that argument forza's single player game is better than sitting in dirt's menu for an hour so forza must be better?

Dirts menus for an hour? Where did you get that one from? The loading times and menus are actually better than most games.

I'm just saying I'm finding the career mode in Forza a tad uncompetitive and boring.

[colincliff]

I think the main reason why the graphics aren't as good in forza 2 is because it's running at 60fps and it has all those physics calculations going on. But keeping the framerate at 60fps at all times require quite a lot of graphical horses.

Thats what i was wondering... whether a console like the 360 could do the frame rate, the physics and also the pretty pretty graphics. Hopefully its just a matter of time and clever developing before all three will exist together.

[Veles]

Dirts menus for an hour? Where did you get that one from? The loading times and menus are actually better than most games.

I'm just saying I'm finding the career mode in Forza a tad uncompetitive and boring.

Thats because you're making it uncompetitive and boring. Thats what duck was getting at I think, you were just comparing two tiny aspects of the game and saying that that makes one better than the other. You can make the game more challenging by giving yourself restraints, like you could put your PI no higher than the top one. You can't blame the game because you decided to use much better cars than the opposition, are you surprised that the rest of the racers get left behind if you have a superior car?

[dannyboy83]

I've not played DIRT so am probably not qualified to comment but...

I thinjk the graphics in Forza 2 are excellent - the only slightly annoying thing is that I find the loading times quite slow.

[Tarffie]

I need to play DiRT. I've had it since Saturday but it's still on my shelf in it's wrapping, not managed to shift Forza 2 out of the disc tray. It's been in there for 12 days now.

[spazman]

I was totally underwhelmed by dirt when i played it at a mates, i had just finished a 3 hour forza session though so i think i was a bit jaded. I'll need to give it another go, anybody got it on the PC as its £15 less than the 360 version, i'd be using a 360 controller with the PC too so no loss of control.

[dannyboy83]

spaz - could you tell me how the 360 pad works with the PC - you got an adaptor, or is it thru bluetooth?

[roorooroo]

I've played both for a while now..Forza 2 is great online..bored me rigid in single player..Dirt is a good old fashioned rally game..(with American accent!)..whatever floats your boat i suppose.

[s_kinton]

spaz - could you tell me how the 360 pad works with the PC - you got an adaptor, or is it thru bluetooth?

Two options:
- Use a wired pad which just plugs into a USB port.
- Use a wireless pad, however, you also need to buy the PC receiver. The receiver is roughly £13.

http://www.play.com/Product.aspx?tit...+PC+Peripheral

The 360 pad is excellent for CM DiRT and games like Lost Planet. Theres no need to set it up, its exactly as it would be on the 360 and that includes rumble.