Is it rude to refer to President-elect Obama as a black?

[Agent]

Black, in my opinion, is along the same lines of nigga.

One hell of a statement there mate.
Perhaps we should rename the MOBO awards to MONWO (Music Of Non White Origin)?

Shouldn't he be referred to as African-American? I keep hearing "first black President" but it feels like it comes across as "bloody hell, he's black, how is he President?".

Then you are interpreting it wrong.
People are talking about the "first black president" because they are proud he has got into the Whitehouse, and rightly so.

On the other hand, "first African-American President" sounds like a proper accomplishment.

You need to keep in mind that it wasn't too long back that Black people (irrelevant of background) were slaves /2nd class citizens in America. If you went back 50 years and told the yanks they would have a black president in 2008, they would have laughed at you. Then probably shot you in the face for even suggesting it.

For this reason, a "Black President" seems far more of "a proper accomplishment" to me, if there is such a thing.

*edit* Immediately after posting, I looked at it another way - what about all the people that are called white? There doesn't seem to be anything wrong with that, and I don't find it rude personally. That would suggest there's nothing wrong with the term black, but it still doesn't sound right.

It doesn't sound right because in true politically correctness style, you're worrying about offending people that are proud to be referred to as black.
People who win, take part and watch the MOBOs, European Federation of Black Women Business Owners, and other such awards are not offended to be referred to as "Black".

There is a very clear line when referring to someone as "black" in a derogatory fashion in most peoples minds. It's just fairly common sense really.

[Richdog]

Been watching some of the Obama coverage on TV lately and noticed that a lot of time he's referred to as black. It's most likely just me, but I started to wonder if it's appropriate?

Black, in my opinion, is along the same lines of nigga.

Are you being serious?

Of course it's acceptable, it is the standard term for someone of that ethnic descent. It is used the world over by blacks and whites alike... how on earth could it be racist in the same way nigga is? It;s extreme political correctness like this that is infecting our country and causing such a hoo-haa with people afraid to use perfectly acceptable terms for risk of "offending" people.

EDIT - What Agent said.

[chuckskull]

I don't see anything wrong with calling him black, he is at the end of the day. Being black is nothing to be ashamed of or try and play down.

I call black people, black. White people, white. Blondes, blonde and gingers, ginger. It's a description of appearance not a definition of; or comment on the person themselves.

[Facct]

I see where the OP is coming from with the argument against 'black' as it is just a label based on skin colour and not ethnic origin, but it is commonly used without offence and black people have adopted it themselves to base their identity around with 'black culture' and 'black music' (terms I hate because again they just separate black people from everyone else and keep difference, and racism, alive).

I think the bigger issue is that Obama is as much white as he is black, so they should drop the whole black angle completely, and say mixed-race! Being mixed race myself, it really annoys me when ANYONE who is non-white is considered black. It's just another version of saying 'coloured', and keeping them at a distance from 'pure' white people.

[Saracen]

As far as I'm concerned, referring to someone as black is or at least should be entirely non-offensive, in just the same way as referring to someone as white is.

In Obama's case, it's also a bit inaccurate, as you could just as accurately refer to him as white. Mind you, just as "black" covers a multitude of skin tones from light brown to very dark brown, so does white cover a range from very pale cream to pink to ruddy. In both cases, they're merely a generic and often inaccurate category.

And, at the end of the day, how much does it matter whether he's black, white, mixed race or ..... a "mutt", because he's half-and-half instead of a pure pedigree.

And before anyone gets all snippy about that "mutt" crack, for anyone that didn't see it, that is the exact word that Obama used of himself, and in that exact context. The context was him speaking about the puppy he's getting the kids. He wants a "rescue" dog, but one of his kids is allergic so they need a hypoallergenic breed, and most rescue dogs are "mutts, just like me".

Why should "black" be an offensive term? Are people with skin tones that fit that designation ashamed of it or something? Do they regard it as a insult? I've never met one that does.

Perhaps we're finally getting to the point where we can use black or white simply as a descriptive word, not a loaded one. After all, why should it mean any more than "young", "old", "Londoner", "Australian", "child", "pensioner", "athlete", "carpenter" and so on?


I don't think anyone can pretend there aren't still some issues about race, or that everything's perfect, but it's not a problem of anything like the scale it was a view decades back, and if a "black" man getting elected as President doesn't underscore that, when barely more than forty years ago he wouldn't have been allowed on a "white" bus doesn't prove that point, I don't know what will.

Race is no longer the issue it was, and the sooner we all get over our hangups about it, the sooner we can all get past caring what colour someone's skin is and just get on with what really matters in life. We're getting there, and this week saw a major step forward.

After that "mutt" remark, do we think Obama would consider it rude to be called "black"? I'd bet he's proud of the fact.

Oh, and just as an aside, if he'd been pure, thoroughbred white, would he have got elected? Dunno, but it'd have been a lot closer. So, at least in that context, it was a positive advantage to him, as it motivated and energised the black vote. No, I'm sure her wouldn't think it was rude. So why should we?

[Saracen]

Oh, and one more thing. If the anthropologists are right and we ALL came from Africa originally, and that includes the Orientals, Caucasians, and absolutely all of us, then aren't we ALL, genetically, from the same roots? It rather suggests that racism is just ever so tiny a bit flippin' stupid, doesn't it?

[Richdog]

I don't think that's a relevant argument tbh... we are what we are now, ethnically and culturally diverse, and people generally fail to remember more than a few generations behind as it is (look how todays youth are barely aware of WWI and WWII. But, in principle, in a perfect Star-Trek-esque world where currency doesn't exist and people work for one common goal then yes... it shouldn't matter.

[TooNice]

I don't think it is. When I say 'black', I mean it inoffensively, and I doubt it would cause offence (to the majority) in a context where it is not used offensively. However, I can understand why some people may not like the fact that he is actually mixed but referred to as 'black'.

But in my opinion, the colour refers to the skin of the person, rather than the origins. Granted that strictly speaking, it means that he should be referred to as 'brown', but I think that people with 'brown' skin colour are often seen as 'black'.. probably even amongst themselves.

Take this example: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/news...ne-chance.html

Does anyone think that the white girl is ever going to be referred as a black, or even brown/mixed-race girl? I reckon there is not much of a chance unless her skin becomes darker as she grows up.

And as far as I know, 'black' is usually used as a more neutral term to 'nigga'. I am sure that both can be used offensively and not, but the later more commonly than the former.

[BUFF]

Italy's PM thought that Obama was "suntanned" ...

[staffsMike]

Italy's PM thought that Obama was "suntanned" ...

[Stewart]

Oh, and one more thing. If the anthropologists are right and we ALL came from Africa originally, and that includes the Orientals, Caucasians, and absolutely all of us, then aren't we ALL, genetically, from the same roots? It rather suggests that racism is just ever so tiny a bit flippin' stupid, doesn't it?

Well, regardless of whether the Out Of Africa hypothesis is correct or not, we are all genetically from the same root anyway, as we are all members of the same species, and will all share a single common ancestor.

Well... apart from those Neanderthal people - lazy, criminal scumbags they are. And don't get me started on Homo heidelbergensis...

[Fraz]

I think the bigger issue is that Obama is as much white as he is black, so they should drop the whole black angle completely, and say mixed-race! Being mixed race myself, it really annoys me when ANYONE who is non-white is considered black. It's just another version of saying 'coloured', and keeping them at a distance from 'pure' white people.

I believe the proper term is dual heritage

The important point is that a person who is half black/half white - such as my half-Jamaican girlfriend - is often discriminated against in the same way as a black person. The half white bit is irrelevant in this sense, so she might as well consider herself black. If she was half Indian she wouldn't refer to herself as black. I've never really come across what you are saying, it's pretty rare for anyone of dual heritage to be lumped into the category of "black" in my experience... but that doesn't count for much.

[staffsMike]

I believe the proper term is dual heritage

The important point is that a person who is half black (such as my girlfriend) is often discriminated against in the same way as a black person. The half white bit is irrelevant in this sense, so she might as well consider herself black.

I think to a certain point a dual heritage (I like that) person has got it even worse as they are a product of what a lot of racists seem to hate most, the thought of interracial relationships.

If anyone saw in the news about the Spanish website willing Lewis Hamilton to crash, get a burst tyre etc.. some of the comments like "Filthy Half Breed" were disgusting.

Makes me sad for our children (should we have them) as they will be dual heritage.

[Agent]

Well, regardless of whether the Out Of Africa hypothesis is correct or not, we are all genetically from the same root anyway, as we are all members of the same species, and will all share a single common ancestor.

Assuming you believe in the non-sense called "evolution".

[staffsMike]

Assuming you believe in the non-sense called "evolution".

Lunatics..

[Stewart]

If anyone saw in the news about the Spanish website willing Lewis Hamilton to crash, get a burst tyre etc..

Mate, there were people on this forum who wanted Hammo to crash, get a burst tyre, etc. You don't need to go to Spain to find these people.

Ade - Well if you don't believe in evolution, then God made us all, in his image... so we are still all the same. Go God! High five! Move the immovable object! Resist that irresistible force! Do nothing while children are sexually abused by Priests! God you rule!