More student protests

[Bugbait]

There’s always the part time option for those with other commitments.

I started in Engineering with 36-40 (Chemistry alternated) contact hours per week then moved to Commerce with a laughable 12 hours (9 one semester). I had ludicrous amounts of free time and since I had a car, didn’t spend much time at University. By the time I finished my course after 3 years the fees had almost doubled. That’s right, almost 100% increase over 3 years with an average inflation below 3% (sorry, too lazy to look up the actual figures). Still paid my fees back once I started working though and didn’t whine about the fact they increased every semester.

I admit, when I was in Engineering it didn’t leave much time for a decent job. However, that doesn’t mean someone else should be paying for me (although the fees I paid were still largely subsidised). After working for a few years I paid the balance in a lump sum to take advantage of the once off 25% discount to clear my university debt.

My parents, being financial comfortable could have paid all my fees in advance but they didn’t. They’ve always tried to instil the sense that anything worth having should be earned. If I wanted a tertiary education then I should pay for it myself.

[redddraggon]

No, history.

Lol, there's no way History is the hardest subject

[jim]

Lol, there's no way History is the hardest subject

Well, I'm just repeating what everybody at my university has said, irrespective of personal opinion.

It's very easy to look and say "Oh Maths is complicated, there's lots of difficult things to understand. History on the other hand, you just write a few lumps of meaningless prose and wander out with a 2:1" I agree that Maths is, at first appearances, a very difficult subject to grasp and understand. But that's not what we're talking about. We're talking about the most difficult degree to take and to succeed in.

It's just your initial opinion ultimately - there are so many more factors to it. For instance, how hard is it to progress from a 2:1 to a first? How much work do you have to do overall?

Believe what you like, but it's not as clear-cut as you think.

[format]

Lol, there's no way History is the hardest subject

It's all relative really though. I have a friend who finds astrophysics pretty easy and is currently in his 5th year at uni. I doubt he'd have a chance if you asked him to explain Shakespeare though.

[TheAnimus]

It's not the student's fault that the country is in trouble though is it? I think that's part of the reason why there is so much agitation. The financial sector caused the trouble, yet they continue on after a huge bailout from the taxpayers purse. They still get huge bonus payouts.

And it's the normal people that suffer for it.

Should they just keep a stiff upper lip and keep quiet about this injustice?

This in a nutshell is the issue. People want to find something to blame for it all, something other than them.

This mess is due to everyone really. Everyone who has debt, everyone who invests money without asking enough questions, when was the last time people asked how their pension was been invested.

To blame it on the financial sector is folly, the financial sector is mearly an indicator of the underlying issues.

And one of them is this culture of people simply spending money that is not theirs. The ironey is this is what all students naturally do, and we need to let them to some degree (hah!) but there is only so much we can afford vs the worth they produce.

[Disturbedguy]

Working in holidays is easier, but hard to find work which exists for such a short time. However I'm sorry to say but the fit in a 12 hour day, boo hoo, welcome to adulthood. Also the fact its to see your daughter is not typical of the average student. Its not representative and frankly the government shouldn't be having to plan for it, and frankly I'll be damned if I'm going to loose some of my hard earned to subsidies someone else so they can have their cake and eat it too.

Andehh didn't complain about it being tough or anything, all he did was list an example as to why SOME students are unable to work while at Uni.

I myself, had lectures or whatever you want to call them 5 days a week but some days I was only in for 3 or so hours so I was able to work weekends and spend time during the week either doing assignments or spending time with my now ex.

Don't get me wrong I know a lot of mates who were studying at uni and haven't got a thing to show for it. One guy spent his first year, studying-ish and just got through to the second, he spent the second year drinking or playing Even and then couldnt understand why he had failed, he did this TWICE, for the same course, at the SAME Uni. - This type of person is clearly just a drain and has been loaned thousands of pounds, which will probably never be paid off, all because he wanted to drink and play a stupid game.

In regards to EMA I think the fact they are scraping EMA is rediculous, why should college students be denied that tiny amount of money. I understand what has been said earlier about getting a job but that isn't always possible.

A prime example of this is my little sister, she suffers from a condition (I think some on Hexus know about this?) which means she will either be completely fine one week and be able to act like a normal kid/ teenager and the next week or even the next day, could be quite ill and sometimes can mean trips to the hospital which would make working and college quite hard, not impossible, but hard, at present her High School have been..a help by getting her setup with home working.

My sister is still to decide whether she wants to college or not due to this condition, however if she chooses to she is lucky as myself and her other brothers and sisters have all agreed that we will pay money into a bank account for her every month or week to esnure she has money to get to college.

Do I think fee hikes are fair? No, but I can understand why it is being done.
Do I think they are needed? Yes

[format]

This in a nutshell is the issue. People want to find something to blame for it all, something other than them.

This mess is due to everyone really. Everyone who has debt, everyone who invests money without asking enough questions, when was the last time people asked how their pension was been invested.

To blame it on the financial sector is folly, the financial sector is mearly an indicator of the underlying issues.

And one of them is this culture of people simply spending money that is not theirs. The ironey is this is what all students naturally do, and we need to let them to some degree (hah!) but there is only so much we can afford vs the worth they produce.

But my point is that the level of student borrowing is minuscule to others. I find it unlikely that anything I did (and for that matter most other students) had anything to do with the financial crisis, because most of us were 21 and under when the damage was done. Irresponsible houseowners and irresponsible lenders are far more to blame than people like myself who spent their teens earning minimum wage and below washing dishes.

I do agree that the current levels of students in our population is unneeded and unsustainable but there are going to be a LOT of prospective students that could greatly contribute to our society that suffer as a result of actions that had nothing to do with them. You can't expect them to be happy about that.

[neonplanet40]

I found both english and history quite challenging. Yet people assume they are easy

[TooNice]

You can't expect them to be happy about that.

Happy, no, but how about being pragmatic? Certainly most of us have been on the receiving end of something that might not be 'fair', yet protesting would serve no purpose other than worsening the situation (or at best, do nothing, since money won't magically appear).

[mcmiller]

Same as always, a false sense of entitlement.

Who are you to decide what people are entitled to?

[Steve]

And one of them is this culture of people simply spending money that is not theirs. The ironey is this is what all students naturally do, and we need to let them to some degree (hah!) but there is only so much we can afford vs the worth they produce.

I'm with you all the way on this.

I have a student loan. In comparison to some it's small, but it's 5 figures. And in my accounts package, it puts a big dent into my assets, such that it'll be a couple of years before I'm in the black. By virtue of its low interest rate, however, I don't have to rush to pay it off, which is nice.

But apart from the student loan from my undergrad years, I don't spend money I don't have. If I buy something on my credit card, which I do a lot, I can always pay it off... and do. I use my interest-free overdraft, of course, because the money that would otherwise be in it is better off sitting somewhere else, so long as I can get at it when needed.

And if I can spend responsibly, I don't understand why scores of others can't.

On the subject of increased uni fees. I'm angry at the Lib Dems for failing to uphold their pledges, but I don't really see what choice they have as part of the coalition, that doesn't mean I aren't entitled to be angry, though.

My fear is that if the average student loan balloons on the scale it looks set to, graduates will have even more against them when it comes to mustering up the deposit for a house and the income to service the mortgage. I'm on the brink of a carrot-stick situation as it is; I pity those just a couple of years behind me (I'm not giving them my money, though).

[Kata]

Well, I'm just repeating what everybody at my university has said, irrespective of personal opinion.

It's very easy to look and say "Oh Maths is complicated, there's lots of difficult things to understand. History on the other hand, you just write a few lumps of meaningless prose and wander out with a 2:1" I agree that Maths is, at first appearances, a very difficult subject to grasp and understand. But that's not what we're talking about. We're talking about the most difficult degree to take and to succeed in.

It's just your initial opinion ultimately - there are so many more factors to it. For instance, how hard is it to progress from a 2:1 to a first? How much work do you have to do overall?

Believe what you like, but it's not as clear-cut as you think.

lol, I was expecting something like Engineering, or Physics....

Which University is this...are the other courses just very rubbish, and History is the hardest by virtue of being the only decent one?

At my University, generally recognised as being pretty good at everything, History was somewhat lower down the list...although Land Economy was seen as bottom of the rung!

[jim]

lol, I was expecting something like Engineering, or Physics....

Which University is this...are the other courses just very rubbish, and History is the hardest by virtue of being the only decent one?

At my University, generally recognised as being pretty good at everything, History was somewhat lower down the list...although Land Economy was seen as bottom of the rung!

It's a top 20 uni in the UK, so it's not a load of rubbish by any stretch of the imagination, but history is certainly pretty tough. All A grades required at A-level (before the days of A*) to even be considered.

The thing is, the amount of time people spend working (if they want to get a good 2:1 or 1st at least) is far in excess of any of the other subjects. That's my experience so far, and according to most of the 3rd years I've spoken to it's their experience as well. It might not be too difficult to pump out something that "will do" but to reach the top marks it takes a huge amount of effort.

[Andeh13]

Working in holidays is easier, but hard to find work which exists for such a short time. However I'm sorry to say but the fit in a 12 hour day, boo hoo, welcome to adulthood. Also the fact its to see your daughter is not typical of the average student. Its not representative and frankly the government shouldn't be having to plan for it, and frankly I'll be damned if I'm going to loose some of my hard earned to subsidies someone else so they can have their cake and eat it too.

Give it a couple of decades or so & when those with solid degrees are working in their respective industries and pumping money into the economy, then we'll see where the subsidies are going!

Not only that, they say/said the average student earns £150,000 more in their lifetime, that's plenty of money being pumped back into the economy to cover the initial costs. Keep in mind its a student loan as well, most students will end up paying off a fair chunk/all of the initial loan/costs...it is after with them for 25 years!

Students are an investment, like all investments there is a long term commitment....but one that WILL pay off in the end!

(Once again I justify my position, I am defending the degrees which are already under subscribed & dropping like flies...the engineering, maths, physics, science degrees (among others). Degrees that WILL pay off in the end...not the studies/ologies/hobby degrees, those are the ones that need to be cut back & priced up.)

[Steve]

Not only that, they say/said the average student earns £150,000 more in their lifetime, that's plenty of money being pumped back into the economy to cover the initial costs.

To me, that seems like a tiny amount of money, when you consider that it's over a lifetime.

[Andeh13]

To me, that seems like a tiny amount of money, when you consider that it's over a lifetime.

It's the first figure that came up from a quick google!