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Thread: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

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    Post [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    Worth watching all 35 minutes of this very informative video regarding Intel's underhand business practices, anti-competitive behaviour, breaking EU anti-trust laws, and how they hurt competition (AMD) in the processor market.

    Intel have been raided numerous times around the globe. They spent $6b (to Dell alone) stifling competition from AMD and then paid AMD $1b in settlement.

    Last edited by Nelly.; 28-07-2017 at 02:11 AM. Reason: Spelling.

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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    I've edited the Youtube channel name out from the title of this (far too spammy and promo) - I won't edit the post as it's an open forum, though I see you're an Intel user yourself, so I'd not take this film with more than a pinch of salt

    Quote Originally Posted by Advice Trinity by Knoxville
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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    I presume this is the historical stuff we knew about before right? In which case I'm not sure what the motivation is to drag it up again. MS were in the past too, and Google have much more recently been found to be more seriously anti-competitive. But I bet a large number (not all) are reading this on a Windows computer and still do their searching on Google.

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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    /\ that... but with tiny little bells... and no tinsel

    Quote Originally Posted by Advice Trinity by Knoxville
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    "If you don't gaffer it, it will gaffer you" | "Belt and braces"

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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    Quote Originally Posted by kalniel View Post
    But I bet a large number (not all) are reading this on a Windows computer and still do their searching on Google.
    on intel chips

    Quote Originally Posted by Advice Trinity by Knoxville
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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    Quote Originally Posted by Zak33 View Post
    on intel chips
    only until I can afford to buy Ryzen. Car insurance didn't help with that

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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    If you look on many places like Reddit a lot of younger PC owners are not really that aware of what Intel did it seems or even to what degree and this video informed them. Its very well researched and covers the periods from the late 60s to the present,including the breaking of licensing agreements by Intel had with AMD in the 80s,and how AMD won almost all of the legal action,and why AMD moved to clean room designs and eventually its own designs.

    It's well researched though as there are even a few things I didn't realise Intel did. I mean they still haven't paid the EU fine yet from 2009 or that Bill Gates actually talked about Intel and their army of lawyers.MS got into more trouble for relatively tamer behaviour TBH!

    Quite a few people probably even are less aware of the spat with Nvidia and how Intel literally locked them out of the chipset business.

    Plus I don't see why people want this to be hidden from the younger enthusiasts,even the contra-revenue with Atom and the financial help on the ultrabook program might have been more obvious but still.

    Many of us are older but in the end younger people should be made aware of what Intel did for decades.

    Also people having a go at Google when Apple has used the dodgy US patent system to try and attack it's competition,which is just as bad when they did it during the 80s too,and all of their patents for desktops GUIs invalidated in the early 90s by the US government as they were abusing them.

    I seem no motivation to hide these things - people need to understand a lot of the most successful tech companies have got there through rather risible behaviour.

    Edit!!

    It's also like when people on the interwebs bring up Trump past dodgy behaviour like a decade ago in threads like his comments about women. I mean it was covered back then,why bother bringing it up now?
    Last edited by CAT-THE-FIFTH; 28-07-2017 at 10:59 AM.


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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    Quote Originally Posted by Zak33 View Post
    /\ that... but with tiny little bells... and no tinsel
    I think you are getting confused with Mac on Worth a Buy!


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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    Go back further and you'll find IBM had a virtual monopoly on main frames until start ups like Digital came along. Microsoft had a pretty dodgy reputation for buying tech companies to kill the products, and when Wordperfect was the Word Processor (and still is as far as I'm concerned) Microsoft changed the hot keys on the fledgling windows system so that the WP ones didnt work, and the altered the APIs to give Word a perceived speed advantage.

    Tech companies are no more immune to dirty tricks than any other industry. The object (and duty) is to add shareholder value.
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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    Quote Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH View Post
    It's also like when people on the interwebs bring up Trump past dodgy behaviour like a decade ago in threads like his comments about women. I mean it was covered back then,why bother bringing it up now?
    Well indeed why? Trump was one of only two candidates running for a hugely influential position and his opponent's past behaviour wasn't ignored either. But I don't see why Intel's historical behaviour is being singled out here when we've already seen several other tech brands have been at least as guilty of the same thing, more seriously, and more recently.

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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    Quote Originally Posted by kalniel View Post
    Well indeed why? Trump was one of only two candidates running for a hugely influential position and his opponent's past behaviour wasn't ignored either. But I don't see why Intel's historical behaviour is being singled out here when we've already seen several other tech brands have been at least as guilty of the same thing, more seriously, and more recently.
    So what?? You could argue that with any politician or anybody - using your absurd logic what Trump said 10 years ago is irrelevant to what he is doing now.

    But you it know isn't the case and the same goes with companies,who are technically considered legal humans FFS in the US!!

    Yet,Intel is a highly influence position in the tech market,as one of the biggest semiconductor companies in the world,so their actions also have an effect on the computing market. This is a tech forum,so in the end what Trump has or has not done is actually less important to this field than what Intel has done.

    Trying to bury stuff since you are scared younger people will be made aware of what Intel has done is ridiculous. You don't seem actually fully grasp that there are loads of much younger enthusiasts and gamers who are not aware of what they did,ie,plenty who are now in their 20s,and this is why on places like Reddit and YT its getting traction.

    YOU need to stop thinking just because YOU as an older person is aware of it loads of people are.

    Yet,its even more hypocracy on your part when you bring up Google and MS,yet seem scared when someone brings up Intel. What about Apple?? People still mock Apple over the patents on curved surfaces,etc even recently here on Hexus.

    Edit!!

    If you have an issue with the chap who made this,he does post on the odd forum - he occasionally posts on OcUK when people had a go at him about one of his previous videos.

    So I am sure,if you want him to give his reasons for posting this you can ask him?

    Second Edit!!

    Have you even watched the video??

    Or have you pre-judged it already??
    Last edited by CAT-THE-FIFTH; 28-07-2017 at 12:16 PM.


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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    IMO, having other companies do it is not a valid reason for burying the past (and let's be honest - the present too e.g. Atom bribery/stock dumping) for one particular company. AdoredTV's channel is largely about processors, therefore Intel, AMD, Nvidia, and he often gets questioned about exactly this, so it's hardly unjustified. And it's all based on fact, with evidence provided, not just rumours or speculation.

    If you already know about it, great, don't bother watching it (though like CAT there were one or two new things I learned from it). If not, it's a very important piece of technology history to know about.

    And I agree with what CAT said - actually watch it before passing judgement, eh? It seems like people are jumping to the conclusion that it's some sort of unsubstantiated fanboy rant, which couldn't be further from the truth.

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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    Quote Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH View Post
    So what?? You could argue that with any politician or anybody - using your absurd logic what Trump said 10 years ago is irrelevant to what he is doing now.

    But you it know isn't the case and the same goes with companies,who are technically considered legal humans FFS in the US!!

    Yet,Intel is a highly influence position in the tech market,as one of the biggest semiconductor companies in the world,so their actions also have an effect on the computing market. This is a tech forum,so in the end what Trump has or has not done is actually less important to this field than what Intel has done.

    Trying to bury stuff since you are scared younger people will be made aware of what Intel has done is ridiculous. You don't seem actually fully grasp that there are loads of much younger enthusiasts and gamers who are not aware of what they did,ie,plenty who are now in their 20s,and this is why on places like Reddit and YT its getting traction.

    YOU need to stop thinking just because YOU as an older person is aware of it loads of people are.

    Yet,its even more hypocracy on your part when you bring up Google and MS,yet seem scared when someone brings up Intel. What about Apple?? People still mock Apple over the patents on curved surfaces,etc even recently here on Hexus.

    Edit!!

    If you have an issue with the chap who made this,he does post on the odd forum - he occasionally posts on OcUK when people had a go at him about one of his previous videos.

    So I am sure,if you want him to give his reasons for posting this you can ask him?

    Second Edit!!

    Have you even watched the video??

    Or have you pre-judged it already??
    Cough - please keep personalities out of it. Kalniel asked a perfectly valid question - you can reply without using perjorative terms like "Your absurd logic" etc. As you know, we deprecate overly aggressive posting styles!

    A simple "Because its one part of a complicated history of modern tech" would have done! . Sometimes less is more!
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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    Quote Originally Posted by peterb View Post
    Cough - please keep personalities out of it. Kalniel asked a perfectly valid question - you can reply without using perjorative terms like "Your absurd logic" etc. As you know, we deprecate overly aggressive posting styles!

    A simple "Because its one part of a complicated history of modern tech" would have done! . Sometimes less is more!
    Just because people do not like what Trump said 10 years ago regarding women it should be brought up now,since he was aiming for POTUS,now they are complaining about it??

    It is silly to then say don't do the same for Intel, who has been the number 1 or 2 ranked semiconductor company for the last couple of decades on a tech forum,and has a huge amount of influence over the consumer market.

    Companies are legal citizens AFAIK in the US also!

    If past history is not important for one its the same for the other??

    Plenty of companies like Apple and MS get criticised over past actions here,so I think is rather weird Intel is getting a free pass here - or are we going to set some kind of time limit on these things,ie,any discussion of dodgy behaviour past two years is not to be allowed on Hexus.

    People need to watch the video,and the chap behind the video is quite easy to contact. In the first few minutes he actually says why he made the video.

    The video is well researched - I don't agree with all his views,but its well researched and its even relevant now due to things like contra-revenue and the Ultrabook fund.

    He was the first person to notice the reason why Ryzen was do so poorly on Rise of the Tombraider under DX12 which virtually the whole tech press had missed(and probably Crystal Dynamics and Nvidia) It was an issue with the Nvidia cards in the game,so either a driver problem or something buggy with the DX12 path for Nvidia cards,and he tested it with cards from both companies,and with later patches/drivers the performance jumped up quite a bit.

    I even mailed him a few quick questions,since I saw some utter weirdness testing the same part under DX12 with a much older Intel CPU,and it was a fairly good discussion about issues with benchmarking the game in general. Even the built-in benchmark has issues under DX12.
    Last edited by CAT-THE-FIFTH; 28-07-2017 at 02:13 PM.


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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    Quote Originally Posted by Zak33
    I've edited the Youtube channel name out from the title of this (far too spammy and promo) - I won't edit the post as it's an open forum, though I see you're an Intel user yourself, so I'd not take this film with more than a pinch of salt
    Fair enough, I won't stop promoting any interesting articles I find from Hexus on other websites, where it permits anyway.

    As for being an Intel user, if I had an AMD CPU and/or GPU at the time of writing this, then people would have come out with the AMD fanboy card.

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    Re: [You Tube] Intel - Anti-Competitive, Anti-Consumer, Anti-Technology

    Intel CPU, AMD GPU. I'd agree that a lot of people aren't aware of what they did, heck i only knew maybe 10% of the vid. Interesting this was released just as AMD are having product launches

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