This is why Elon is the Tesla of our generation...

[TheAnimus]

I was more thinking how Reddit had a front page thing about how evil topgear were to their electric car.... Which when the details came out explained why the Tesla court case held no weight. Musk has a habit of setting a narrative, and far too many internet people believing it is 100% true.

[Noxvayl]

He is his own PR company, got the gift of the gab so to speak. I'm not a stranger to his arrogance...

[Ttaskmaster]

We talking about Musk still, or Clarkson, now?

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

He is his own PR company, got the gift of the gab so to speak. I'm not a stranger to his arrogance...

So a bit like Tony Stark but without the superhero bit? ?

[Biscuit]

We are assuming the hyperloop is going to debut with human transportation... which I think is wrong. I expect them to make these cargo pods first, to sort out teething issues, after which human pods will be included.

Of course news coverage and such won't be the same if we assumed that, so we get the hyperbole as usual. I also suspect the companies competing to bring this technology to market would prefer people to think that as well, who knows they may actually want to go with humans first but I think that is daft.

Actually I have been watching the progress of the hyperloop reasonably closely, so I wasn't presuming it would be humans first at all. This doesn't actually change anything.

I think, "teething issues" is considerably under-estimating the engineering challenge posed here. Break down each elements Peter went through above and consider the amount of engineering and technology that goes into them as individual challenges, and that is still only a tiny fraction of the grand total.

Now consider how exactly are all these engineering costs, that include large ongoing costs, going to result in affordable transport?

The whole project is one big monetary black hole.

Bear in mind that up until this point, they haven't even tested the system in any kind of vacuum, they have just been preparing a maglev train in a tube. So far its been slow and suffered dust/debris issues.
The one in Shanghai that's been running for ~13 years already does ~270MPH. I was on it a few years ago!

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

At least with a Hyperloop you avoid a very big problem - Moose,although I am sure they will endeavour to find a way to clog the tubes still!!

[Xlucine]

I still want to know what happens when a car breaks down. Does the whole line get the emergency stop pulled? Problem with pods, rather than trains, is you need a much higher density of vehicles for sensible throughput - which increases the probability of a failure, and the knock-on effects of said failure.

[Biscuit]

At least with a Hyperloop you avoid a very big problem - Moose,although I am sure they will endeavour to find a way to clog the tubes still!!

Perhaps there's a good reason they haven't chosen Canada as a test site

[Biscuit]

I still want to know what happens when a car breaks down. Does the whole line get the emergency stop pulled? Problem with pods, rather than trains, is you need a much higher density of vehicles for sensible throughput - which increases the probability of a failure, and the knock-on effects of said failure.

Nail... head.

There really isnt any alternative but to switch off the whole loop till the issue is resolved. At best they may be able to continue running at a limp speed but if not, how do you even resolve it?

Send an engineer via helicopter to the nearest service entrance, at which point you either have to de-pressurise the line or send them in with suits. If they cant get it moving then they would have to dismantle that part of the tube to remove the train... if you have to leave the ability to do that, then the engineering a vacuum tube's structural integrity gets a whole lot more complex...

Every single rabbit hole is like this with Hyperloop.

[Noxvayl]

Actually I have been watching the progress of the hyperloop reasonably closely, so I wasn't presuming it would be humans first at all. This doesn't actually change anything.

I think, "teething issues" is considerably under-estimating the engineering challenge posed here. Break down each elements Peter went through above and consider the amount of engineering and technology that goes into them as individual challenges, and that is still only a tiny fraction of the grand total.

Now consider how exactly are all these engineering costs, that include large ongoing costs, going to result in affordable transport?

The whole project is one big monetary black hole.

Bear in mind that up until this point, they haven't even tested the system in any kind of vacuum, they have just been preparing a maglev train in a tube. So far its been slow and suffered dust/debris issues.
The one in Shanghai that's been running for ~13 years already does ~270MPH. I was on it a few years ago!

I'd rather be pumping money into a technology black whole rather than the endless political black hole we send money into currently... Anyway, it is money worth spending for a huge array of reasons most notably our ambition as a species to colonise the solar system. Terrestrial reasons include our lack of space on land, we have to make our transport systems 3D and going into the air is just daft.

[Biscuit]

I'd rather be pumping money into a technology black whole rather than the endless political black hole we send money into currently... Anyway, it is money worth spending for a huge array of reasons most notably our ambition as a species to colonise the solar system. Terrestrial reasons include our lack of space on land, we have to make our transport systems 3D and going into the air is just daft.

I largely agree, at least there is a realistic chance technology will come out of the project that could make maglev trains more accessible, affordable and reliable. Perhaps even self powered with renewable energy.
Depends how stubborn they are...

I'm yet to see a reason plane flight is dafter than hyperloop once all things are considered. If national hyperloop is highly unlikely in our lifetime, international is just dreaming.

[Noxvayl]

I largely agree, at least there is a realistic chance technology will come out of the project that could make maglev trains more accessible, affordable and reliable. Perhaps even self powered with renewable energy.
Depends how stubborn they are...

I'm yet to see a reason plane flight is dafter than hyperloop once all things are considered. If national hyperloop is highly unlikely in our lifetime, international is just dreaming.

Agreed, and I think planes still have their place.

The new launch system the Americans developed for their air craft carrier would be well placed on a runway to save fuel and time for air travel, it would also make ramjets and scramjets much more useful for planes enabling them to go mach 3 and above with ease. No way in hell hyperloop can compete with that.

The likelihood of that happening is slim though, I have more faith in hyperloop as an intercity connect system coming to fruition over another supersonic passenger jet. it is likely that hyperloop will facilitate maglev technology for our ageing underground systems that are in need of an upgrade.

[Biscuit]

Agreed, and I think planes still have their place.

The new launch system the Americans developed for their air craft carrier would be well placed on a runway to save fuel and time for air travel, it would also make ramjets and scramjets much more useful for planes enabling them to go mach 3 and above with ease. No way in hell hyperloop can compete with that.

One of the biggest hurdles with supersonic passenger planes is the sound. I don't know if you have ever heard the sonic boom but they can genuinely be heard across entire counties. This means you need a plane that's capable of flying both sub (for above residential areas) and supersonic for reasonably long distances.

The likelihood of that happening is slim though, I have more faith in hyperloop as an intercity connect system coming to fruition over another supersonic passenger jet. it is likely that hyperloop will facilitate maglev technology for our ageing underground systems that are in need of an upgrade.

If they could develop an upgrade path that fits within the existing limitations of the transport systems, I think more people would step up and take notice.

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

One of the biggest hurdles with supersonic passenger planes is the sound. I don't know if you have ever heard the sonic boom but they can genuinely be heard across entire counties. This means you need a plane that's capable of flying both sub (for above residential areas) and supersonic for reasonably long distances.



If they could develop an upgrade path that fits within the existing limitations of the transport systems, I think more people would step up and take notice.

IIRC,there is research being done by people like NASA into planes shaped specially to reduce the effects if the sonic boom.

However,if Reaction Engines gets SABRE working it wouldn't be such an issue.

[Biscuit]

IIRC,there is research being done by people like NASA into planes shaped specially to reduce the effects if the sonic boom.

Yeah I have seen some of these things, but there always seems to be a trade off. The more they change the shape for the Sonic boom, the lower the top speed is

However,if Reaction Engines gets SABRE working it wouldn't be such an issue.

Another big if

[Noxvayl]

Oh yes I've heard sonic booms before, we don't have air speed restrictions for South African airshows, much like you get here for coastal ones where the speed is higher due to the show being over the water.

The best solution I've come across is the vertical supersonic version where the waves are much less likely to reach the ground, and if they do it will be significantly less problematic. However, I'm of the opinion these noise restrictions are daft. Simpler rules can easily be enforced where you are allowed to go supersonic at certain altitudes and over certain spaces like the massive deserts (both sand and snow) around the world.