So long and thanks for all the fish

[Top_gun]

The toxicity is clear to see on this thread.

[philehidiot]

You simply have no idea on my level of thinking. At the end of the day, Northern Brexiters are politically isolated and having difficulties in understanding how the world works. They simply have a protectionist attitude to the real world. That isn't too difficult to work out.

Your level of thinking? I am assuming this is unattainable to mere mortals such as myself. I obviously have no idea. Please, sir, bestow upon me the greatness of your mind. Mine's full of naked ladies and hatred and I just can't compete.

Northern Brexiteers have difficulty in understanding how the world works?!

Seriously?

The arrogance!

And you are calling others closed minded. Can you not see why you get these reactions!? My reactions are not based on any political viewpoint, they're based on the cold, impartial analysis of your statements. Because I'm saying you're behaving in a way that is arrogant and hypocritical, it doesn't mean I disagree with your politics. You have no idea what my politics are as I've purposely kept them to myself. I can argue either side of the EU case quite happily which is essential if you actually want to understand why people say what they say.

You're just as guilty of the very thing you're projecting onto others and blind to it in yourself.

When did you last have a proper discussion on these issues with a closed minded Northerner to find out why they think what they think? Or have you just decided they must all be idiots based on them not agreeing with your enlightened self / based on second hand information? As I said above - assume people are rational until proven otherwise by directly finding out why they think what they think. There may be a very rational reason... how about this... Northern Brexiteer comes from fishing family, family hands down boat from father to son and son finds it's 50 years old and just needs replacing. Family takes out large loan to buy new boat as fishing is going well. EU destroys our fishing industry. Fisherman can't sell fishing boat for anything more than a pittance as there's a supply and demand issue. Can't make money. Now in huge debt with nothing to pay it off with except house. Sells house. Family moves into rented accommodation. Due to demand from immigrant workers from Eastern Europe, rented accommodation prices rocket (they really have in the north - a £400/month place is now £700/month and that's the slum areas). Due to largish bank balance from selling house, not entitled to help. Has no transferrable skills and everyone else is in the same boat. Burns through all the money he's earned in his life and ends up with nothing in reserve and on welfare. Look at that story from the fisherman's point of view and tell me you wouldn't come to the conclusion that the EU has put you in that situation. From self sufficient to nothing. There are other factors but this person is too busy worrying about where the next meal is coming from to debate politics. Go and TALK to the people you so hate and find out why they think what they think. Then you might be able to logically defeat arguments by treating people as equals, rather than saying you're just on another level to everyone else and we should all just believe you. Whilst you're talking to them, you might be able to change their minds. My insulting them and saying they're beneath you, you've no chance and that is one reason why the remain side of the debate was so crushed. You don't change minds by being pretentious, arrogant and insulting. People will not want to deal with you.

If you "suspect" (I do love how you're decrying an entire portion of the country based on your suspicion and gut feelings rather than direct evidence) that the northerners ALL think that, why don't you go up and look? Ask if they do think that and then ask why, then maybe go and look at the evidence they give you for yourself. Or you could just imply they're all bigots based on your suspicions. See how far that gets you. You might be the brightest person in the room but it means nothing when no one listens to you because you've pushed them all away. Being bright does not make anyone superior and there is no correlation between intelligence and wisdom.

Interestingly, the last person I had a discussion with about immigrants and sponging was a Pakistani taxi driver in Leeds who was furious about immigrants getting houses paid for by the state but unsure as he and his friends owned the houses they were living in. The council was paying very good rates on rent and wasn't sure if he'd prefer them to leave and their income to drop or to stay and keep "sponging" off his taxes. When did you last talk to someone who was directly involved with the situation to come to your conclusions? When did I last speak to remainers, you ask, my examples being about leavers? Saturday - went out for drinks with one to get their perspective on things and then spent a few more hours discussing Boris with people with different views.

As for defending the mod team - I got a PM from them regarding this thread. I stated I was defending no one but calling it how I see it and that if I'd thought they'd been unfair, I'd have said so too. I think their reaction is a sound reaction to the flame war you're bent on starting with arrogant and ignorant, hypocritical statements based on gut feeling and making blanket, insulting assessments which will include people on this forum. You state you're better, you have yet to demonstrate this.

My personal opinion is that this thread should be shut down because the statements being made are inflammatory and just going to create more of the very problems which are causing people to take the hump.

My personal opinion is that if you have such a negative view of this forum, the people on it and don't feel you're getting a fair hearing, you should just leave. Before you do, copy and paste your statements, change the name and then show them to your friends and ask if this person is being unreasonable or hypocritical.

You won't like the answer.

[g8ina]

Jeez, that didnt take long.