Catalyst: Panel, Centre and AI

[SHISH]

Much appreciate your time and trouble m8.
Have had to get my son to switch the ac on at home as one of the duals was up to 65C and starting to sulk. 8500DV has apparently gorn orf as it`s still 72F oop north after midnight. I`m already in air conditioned splendour but the borrowed lappie is still burning my nether regions Bloody great Dell 2.8Ghz P4 but it has got ATI onboard.
Must admit, I was getting a bit fed up with the standard replies and links to the knowledge base which I`ve been through with a fine tooth comb for several months.

[yamangman]

Well, I have to use Catalyst 4.6 for a lot of my software to function adequately. Who knows, maybe when I do need to update, i'll find a 3rd party frontend with the features I want, or hell, might even write my own. I don't want an app that loads the frontend into startup, or takes 5 minutes to launch when I want to change res, or sits in my taskbar, or crashes unexpectedly, or is ugly, or has corporate logos and images plastered all over it. Infact, a much simpler solution would be an nVidia card for my next purchase, somthing that'll work in linux with less hassel (admittedly not much less)

[exAndrzej]

...the only way I could get MMC...

OK

We have checked this with the team in Toronto

The guys are now trying various combinations of hardwware, software and driver to see what conditions need to happen for this kind of issue to occur

It is a fact that you will not be able to use SP drivers on your AIW after 5.7 - though there should be no issue with 5.6 drivers because nothing was changed retrospectively

i.e. if you were to do a completely clean install - and put all of the latest drivers on with Cat 5.6... then it should be OK

One question... is it the case that you are just not willing to run teh NSP drivers in Cat 5.7 - or is it the case that your system simply refuses to take them ?

[SHISH]

I`m quite happy to run any drivers that work properly. I`m on Win XP SP2 with all the updates and the hardware has all drivers installed.
As soon as I load NSP drivers instead of SP and the video/audio goes via the bus, it goes jerky and unsychronised or even loses audio altogether and there is a problem with the scheduler on the last 2 sets 5.6/5.7 and MMC TV. No problems at all if I use the SP drivers and such things as channel switching are more or less instant instead of delayed.
The rig in use at the mo is an Asus A7M266-D dual with mobile Bartons at 2.3Ghz. and 1Gb of 3200 ram. Runs an 8500DV AIW with Cat 5.7/MMC 9.08 without problems and now has the 9800Pro AIW.
AGP in use of course, built in sound (CMedia), one of two 64bit slots in use for 1Ghz network card, one of three 32bit slots for Highpoint 454 raid5 card (4 channelx4 Maxtor 200Gb) and another for the Asus 4 port USB2 card.
The card runs flawlessly with up to Cat 5.6 and MMC 9.08 as long as I force install the SP WDM drivers but having now cleaned everything out, I can`t repeat what I did with 5.7 nor can I get 5.6 to work again.
Just look around the various forums and you`ll see a stack of complaints about exactly the same problem with unsynched audio and jerky video plus freezing and scheduler problems. The worst bit, which eems to have hopefully gone away was where you couldn`t even kill the TV after it froze up on you by any means except the main power switch.
Just tell the Canucks to give us the option of running the SP WDM if we want cos the 9800Pro AIW still supports audio via the external plugs and that works whereas the audio/video via the bus causes lots of people problems.

[Zak33]

Andrzej

you rock. You really do. We appreciate you going out of your way to help. You really rate amongst the coolest people ever.

Cheers matey

[exAndrzej]

...you really rate...

BJ in the post to you my friend

[SHISH]

Andrzej.
Thanks for all the work.
I`ve finally got the 9800Pro AIW/5.7/MMC 9.08 running with the WDM 6.14.10.6246 03/08/2004 by checking what was installed on an 8500DV on the other (same type) box and using the system hardware and driver update and connecting the audio externally. Works a treat with zero problems. Fast channel switching, schedule recording and no hard freezes or stutters.
Don`t think I`m going to bother with the X800 as it`s just too much like hard work so I guess, unless the Canucks come up with a resolution, that`s the end of the line for AIW for me and I`ll go to separates, not necessarily ATI, on the new 939 box.
I`ve no doubt many other problem installs would like a proper resolution, especially as the CATs are now doing so well and you`ll be a hero if you can help bring a resolution to the problems.
I do realise there are a lot of people with no real problems (excepting maybe the scheduler) but still looking around Rage3D and suchlike, there are still a lot with the same type of problems and I doubt it`s doing ATI or the AIW series many favours.

[exAndrzej]

...finally got...

Ahhh....

..but the fun don't stop for us...

...cos we are investigating now to see what - if anything - can be done to help other customers with this kind of query

[SHISH]

That`s what I would hope. I know some of ATIs guys trawl other forums and I`m sure they can find these problems coming up time and again and they have been for some time I`m told by several people who`ve emailed me.
It`s just a pity that the support people couldn`t be a bit more errr supportive???.
I`ve got a new rig on the way when I get organised and I`ll be going for an X800xx AGP so I hope you get these problems ironed out as I`m not a green man and I`ve had AIWs since Moses was a boy and I`ve got plenty things to cram in slots without worrying about any extra cards to find space for.
I stream video off one rig and sometimes two and have done since well before it was popular and the AIW hasn`t any real competition except for the driver problems.
Although MMC has gone up in numbers, I`ve not noticed any real startling changes like the CATs have had and the drivers have had some problems.....bit like the old ATI.
Anyway, much appreciate your time and trouble Andrzej, tell the Canucks you want overtime :-)

[exAndrzej]

...I`ll be going for an X800xx AGP...

So you are not convinced of the benefits of PCI-Express for video editing ?

[SHISH]

So you are not convinced of the benefits of PCI-Express for video editing ?

Not especially as I can`t utilize the full bandwidth of an AGP 8X never mind PCI-e 16X.
Having looked at the figures and my own requirements, I cannot justify upgrading to a PCI-e system at the mo as it would also mean, due to the lack of slots on current NF4 boards, figuring out replacements (expensive and maybe not even on the market) for at least a couple of things. I utilise 3 pci slots now and one or two have to be 64bit.
May be looking PCI-e next year but running 3 systems means upgrade has to be a gradual process.
Believe it or not, I`m still running an old S.G.I video workstation and the bandwidth on that for video and transmitting video still outstrips any normally available consumer stuff and it will be very expensive to replace and still get the kind of features that has available. Be nice to get an upgrade to the cpu boards but Alphas still rule for raw processing power.

[exAndrzej]

...running 3 systems...

Kinda hoping that you are charging for your editing services !

[SHISH]

Kinda hoping that you are charging for your editing services !

Didn`t realise you were still around mate, just caught you on a refresh.

I do still do some pro video work and a bit of consultancy but am effectively retired and rarely work outside of home. Basically just pocket money stuff and not the kind of thing my long time friend down the street does as he is officially retired from SGI sales but still so well known that his phone never stops even just for advice.
Having been a lifelong radio ham and in on early TV stuff (amateur TX/RX, 10Ghz wideband high def) as well as a lot of computing and electronics engineering, I have streamed tv/satellite/ digital video for some years as well as data and at one time had an experimental setup feeding a small housing estate. That was in the days when Internet was military and research and my transatlantic phone bills via 1200/75 bit modem were huge and I was very pleased to get a 2k/2k modem connect.
So I`ve been around the technical side for a long time but nowadays it`s partly hobby and mostly just trying to keep up with the grandkids.
And of course, I still game a bit (just found the coffee hack in San Andreas :-) ) and build systems.
Money now has to come into consideration and I now have to justify a new setup over say a new bathroom or the wife`s next trip to see her folks and attempt to wipe out Germany`s national debt with her credit card.
I guess I`m no longer at the bleeding edge just for the hell of it....comes to us all eventually.

[exAndrzej]

...pleased to get a 2k/2k modem connect...

I remember doing A Level Computer Science at Woolwich College when the whole class had terminals linked to Thames Polytechnic's PR1ME system using a 1200 baud duplex jobbie... and that was the height of comms tech in those days

...trying to keep up with the grandkids...

As Dan Vivoli once told me "when your kids get to 7 years old you can forget 'catching them' on a PC - you can practice from now until the end of time and you will never be on the same level again !"

...wipe out Germany`s national debt with her credit card...

Don't argue with the boss - you will just get hurt

[SHISH]

I rarely argue with anybody these days.

Anyway, ageism aside, the gaming granny I sometimes talk about, (mebbe not here but round the net, my grandaughters other granny) has popped her Gold Card in and wants a new gaming rig.
So I guess I`ll find out how 2x core A64s perform as she`s specified GP use as well, and sli looks to be favourite but looking for top end gaming and graphics means either a compromise or the big pair o` greenies unless Crossfire is out soon.
Present rig has an X8..xl card in but she wants everything new and "top end". Not too much hurry yet but what`s otherwise top end for ATI nowadays and without letting any secrets out, when can we expect the new stuff on the shelves? Prolly got a couple months at most to sort things out.
By the way, she`s a retired mainframe engineer with a very good pension.....OK for some. Anyway, looks like some research is on the cards.

[exAndrzej]

...got a couple months...

You could buy red or green without going wrong

However, a couple of months could really see the world move - so it might be cool to wait

I am still unconvinced about dual core and gaming

They seem to be good for 'video stuff' - but these AMD FX jobbies certainly seem to eat gaming-geometry for breakfast

I think one of the reasons for slow sales (hence price drops) on certain high end cards in the past month or two is that the enthusiast user is a pretty smart bunny

I think posting on (as opposed to reading) HEXUS pretty much qualifies anyone to be considered an enthusiast

Enthusiasts know that - no matter what the current speed king looks like - there is always the possiblity that the scores you get from the fastest card in the world today could look totally embarassing next to those from an 'Ultra' variant or next-gen ATI card

There will always be times when your opponent gets ahead - even if it is only for a short while

If you are even going to lose the lead...

...then summer is the time

Hang in there - see what the HEXUS Hierarchy say about the next spin of card and work from there

The poll on the home page sums it up

Number 1 response is "Wait to see what ATI will bring"...

...I think that this is because every card we have bought out since the 9700 Pro has successfully 'captured the flag' in terms of overall performance - specifically 9800 Pro, 9800XT, X800 and X850

At the same time - we have put a ton of effort into our drivers - which the enthusiast community really seem to appreciate

And, as I said at the beginning, no matter which product you go for, it is unlikely that you will be making a bad mistake these days
(you just might have to live without 'bragging rights')