Opinion - Apple TV media player now available in UK. But why?

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Apple's hard-disk-equipped network media player, Apple TV, is at last available in the UK, priced at £199 all up from the Apple Store.

But why the company has decided to launch the product at all remains a mystery.

It connects only to HD TV sets, so users are going to be restricted to watching low-res 320x240 pixels or 640x480 footage, bought from Apple or have to try to find and repurpose HD footage acquired elsewhere.

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http://img.hexus.net/v2/lifestyle/ne...rnt_rem_tn.jpg

Read this HEXUS.lifestyle opinion, then tell us if you can can think of something that Apple might have up its sleeve that we've missed.

It's a good idea in principle IMHO, but it really needs to be able to support DivX before I'd consider getting one. Development on that appears to be progressing quite quickly, however.

Assuming that it is made to work, however, I would think that this would be an ideal replacement for XMBC - smaller, quieter and able to output hidef.

At first glance it appears to be a lot of money for little return :(

It\'s Apple, so long as it looks nice no-one really cares about the functionality :rolleyes:

It does look nice though.

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Originally Posted by b0redom

It's a good idea in principle IMHO, but it really needs to be able to support DivX before I'd consider getting one. Development on that appears to be progressing quite quickly, however.

Assuming that it is made to work, however, I would think that this would be an ideal replacement for XMBC - smaller, quieter and able to output hidef.

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I read somewhere (not on Apple's site, I hasten to add) - and really should have said about this in the opinion - that there is allegedly some kind of support for DivX.

However, I tested this out as best as I could in the absence of having an Apple TV to try.

How? By attempting to open within QT player a whole bunch of different DivX files - some with AVI tails, some with divx tails.

With files having divx tails (which I could only access by choosing to view all files from within QT Player), I got an error message, "Error -2048: the file is not a movie file".

I didn't get this message with files having avi tails but some simply wouldn't play and those that would play had no sound and no video.

When QT Player was able to open a file, it offered the option to get some missing element - and if I accepted that, it took me to one of DivX's own web pages where I could download the free DivX goodies (including Codec and player).

However, I already have all the latest DivX goodies installed (including some paid-for elements) and all seem to me fully up to date and working.

Nonetheless, I downloaded and installed the DivX package on offer, accepting that there was a possibility this might actually mess up my current installation.

Result - er, it seems to have messed up my DivX installation!

I'm still investigating that, though!

Did a re-install of some other (paid for) DivX elements, followed by a reboot (why is that necessary for goodness sake?) and DivX now seems to be back to normal.

Still unable to play any DivX files in QT player and, as I have now realised, also unable to import them into iTunes - of which I have the very latest version installed.

Hopefully this product will break Apple's arrogance enough to make them realise they are not as good as they think they are - after all, not everybody wants an iPod!

I see on the Inq that this box has already been hacked to play Xvid

http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=38498

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Originally Posted by moby_matt

Hopefully this product will break Apple's arrogance enough to make them realise they are not as good as they think they are - after all, not everybody wants an iPod!

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I'm not quite sure why why articles like this should make people react in such an anti-Apple way.

I wrote it genuinely believing that Apple would struggle to sell the product in anything like the volume it would have achieved if it had supported SD and also if the company had made available some HD content for owners of HD TV sets to play through it.

I was, therefore, sort of wondering aloud why the product had even been launched right now and was rather hoping that folk would pile in explaining that I'd missed something screamingly obvious.

Don't get me wrong, Steve Jobs and Apple do come over to me as arrogant at times, but so, too, do Microsoft and its top people; Intel and its top people; and a whole lot of other top firms and their top people - though certainly not all firms and certainly not all the time.

With that out of the way, does anyone have any clues about what Apple might actually be thinking it's going to achieve with Apple TV?

Credit where credits due, you don't half follow up you articles well mate. I can see this thread becoming another one like the Evesham iplayer thing! Fair play to ya Bob.

Shame i have no interest in this product what so ever! :D

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Originally Posted by toolsong

I see on the Inq that this box has already been hacked to play Xvid

http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=38498

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Trouble, is, the place where this is all being detailed - the somethingawful forums - makes it quite clear that they're only at the start of the process.

Nonetheless, it's genuinely fascinating to see this all rolling out over a period of a few days with lots of people pitching in with tips and help.

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Originally Posted by autopilot

Credit where credits due, you don't half follow up you articles well mate. I can see this thread becoming another one like the Evesham iplayer thing! Fair play to ya Bob.

Shame i have no interest in this product what so ever! :D

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Thanks for the kind words - truth is, though, that since I don't have an Apple TV to experiment with and review, I can see me personally driving the thread along with interesting revelations as happened with the Evesham iplayer thread.

On which subject, I see that the stock level at Evesham of the iplayer remains above 200 (it's currently at 211), so I'm wondering how long it will be before it creeps down below 200.

Must remember to keep an eye on that!

As for your having no interest in the Apple TV - I kind of suspect that that's going to be a bit a more general viewpoint and likely to cause the company a bit of grief.

Yes, it's just like a watered down version of what plenty of devices on the market already do, albeit with itunes integration. And what it does do, it does not do particularly brilliantly. I'm not an Apple hater and im not intending to bash them, but do I think its just another example of how un-innovative Apple have become of late. Watching Steve Job's on stage gushing about the iPod's new game playing abilities should drive that message home; wow, games? really? how incredible :rolleyes: The Airport Express would be another example of a device that really does not cut the mustard, not even close, yet if we stick an Apple logo on it hopefully it will sell.

It will all depend on how the hacking/modding community take to it, and also how Apple react to them. A fine example fo this is the Topfield 5800PVR, they took a very mediocre Freeview PVR and turned it into the best on the market by miles.

That's assuming that Apple would ever allow third-party mods on their products (without reaching for their litigation department's phone number..).

Probably depends if they see the hackability increase sales. They dont really need to officially endorse it, just be a bit more relaxed about leaving it open enough for hackers to truly exploit it. A lot of companies do that, although officially they don't support it for legal reasons etc.

Although the iPod has had plenty of custom firmware for it, i believe they have been pretty anal about the iPhone, so we will have to see. Although the iPhone is a different kettle of fish to be fair.

The strange thing is that if Apple really pulled their fingers out they could storm the Streamer/PVR market.

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Originally Posted by autopilot

Probably depends if they see the hackability increase sales. They dont really need to officially endorse it, just be a bit more relaxed about leaving it open enough for hackers to truly exploit it. A lot of companies do that, although officially they don't support it for legal reasons etc.

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Either that, or they sit back, wait to see if the idea has any traction and then co-opt it, just like they did with Bootcamp. Also, it's worth seeing http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2007/03...tv_and_sd_tvs/ - apparently Apple TV DOES support SD, as long as the TV has component inputs; or you can use a component to RGB converter.

It does just seem like they didn't think it through well enough - a proof of concept box instead of a full retail product.

Maybe it was a response to the Xbox 360's media extender capabilities?

Essentually it's a half power mac mini for half the price, it's a real shame it has so much less then half the usefulness. I'm torn between saying it's overpriced because it does so little, or it's cheap because there's a hd capable computer in there just waiting to be used to it's full extent!

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Originally Posted by autopilot

Probably depends if they see the hackability increase sales. They dont really need to officially endorse it, just be a bit more relaxed about leaving it open enough for hackers to truly exploit it. A lot of companies do that, although officially they don't support it for legal reasons etc..

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Apple aren't really known for their 'open' products are they tho? I doubt (very much) they'd do a topfield - Apple would rather sell you all the extras!

Any assertion that Apple TV doesn't support SD TVs is just wrong.

All you need to connect it is a RGB to Scart cable or a set of component cables and an RGB to Scart adaptor. There is one of these bundled with the Xbox 360 btw. It also has the necessary mode support as pointed out on rogueamoeba.com (576i and 576p for PAL).

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Originally Posted by JamesBulman

Any assertion that Apple TV doesn't support SD TVs is just wrong.

All you need to connect it is a RGB to Scart cable or a set of component cables and an RGB to Scart adaptor. There is one of these bundled with the Xbox 360 btw. It also has the necessary mode support as pointed out on rogueamoeba.com (576i and 576p for PAL).

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If you read the article thoroughly, you will see I mention the possibility of using a component-to-RGB adaptor as a cheaper (but not cheap) alternative to an HDMI-to-RGB adaptor.

RGB is the common denominator in each case because most half-decent TV sets in the UK can bring in RGB via Scart - and that's necessary in the case of Apple TV cos, contrary to what you're thinking, RGB and component are not one and the same thing.

So, unless the SD TV set you want to use with Apple TV has dedicated component inputs (rare), a DVI input (rarer still?) or an HDMI input (not fitted to SD sets), you'll need to convert Apple TV's output to something the set can handle - and that's likely to be RGB.

If you just stuff component into a TV on its RGB inputs, it's not going to work - though, hopefully, it's not going to damage to the set either (though, with luck, someone else will comment here soon to let us both know if there is any likelihood of damage).

What's confusing you, I guess, is the fact that Xbox 360 uses the same pins for RGB as it does for component - but that does NOT mean the RGB and component are one and the same thing.

These URLs might help you get things sorted out in your own mind:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Component_video

http://www.michaeldvd.com.au/Article...Connectors.asp

http://www.projectorcentral.com/component.htm

Oh, and though this is your first posting and, consequently, I was a bit dismayed with your "I know better than you tone" - don't worry too much, I'm not going to be holding it against you (don't want to catch anything - nah, only jokin').

Fact is, I do regularly get found out (ie get correctly corrected) in these forums - and consequently learn a lot from them myself.

As a result, the articles in which errors occur gets corrected (which far more important than my ego) and, hopefully, I don't repeat the cock up!

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Originally Posted by nichomach

Either that, or they sit back, wait to see if the idea has any traction and then co-opt it, just like they did with Bootcamp. Also, it's worth seeing http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2007/03...tv_and_sd_tvs/ - apparently Apple TV DOES support SD, as long as the TV has component inputs; or you can use a component to RGB converter.

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Tsk, tsk, not like you to not read the HEXUS article before commenting!

I say all this and more in the piece!

*cough*
Quick-scanned the article after seeing the lead-in here.:embarrassed:

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Originally Posted by Bob Crabtree

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Originally Posted by moby_matt

Hopefully this product will break Apple's arrogance enough to make them realise they are not as good as they think they are - after all, not everybody wants an iPod!

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I'm not quite sure why why articles like this should make people react in such an anti-Apple way.

I wrote it genuinely believing that Apple would struggle to sell the product in anything like the volume it would have achieved if it had supported SD and also if the company had made available some HD content for owners of HD TV sets to play through it.

I was, therefore, sort of wondering aloud why the product had even been launched right now and was rather hoping that folk would pile in explaining that I'd missed something screamingly obvious.

Don't get me wrong, Steve Jobs and Apple do come over to me as arrogant at times, but so, too, do Microsoft and its top people; Intel and its top people; and a whole lot of other top firms and their top people - though certainly not all firms and certainly not all the time.

With that out of the way, does anyone have any clues about what Apple might actually be thinking it's going to achieve with Apple TV?

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Sorry if that sounded anti-Apple Bob - not quite worded as I would usually...

I have to agree in that I fail to see why Apple have released this product when it doesn't appear to do anything ground-breaking. Perhaps they should have looked at producing a PVR with twin tuners instead that could rival the Humax 9200 (which is about the same money) ?

In fact I guess it won't be long until Humax release a Hi-def version of the 9200, then the Apple will be even less appealing.

What do you think?

Surely the better money is spent buying an XBOX 360? More functionality by the sounds of things !!

I would expect a much better remote from a dedicated media unit.

Hi Bob

There are reports that 3rd party software runs on their with minimal hassle. I've no idea how intended that is... I'd post a link but your forum doesn't trust me yet. "Members are required to have a minimum of 5 posts before they can post any URL's"

Searching on either of "joost_successfully_run_on_apple_tv"
or "hacking-the-apple-tv" should find the links...

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Originally Posted by danbri

Hi Bob

There are reports that 3rd party software runs on their with minimal hassle. I've no idea how intended that is... I'd post a link but your forum doesn't trust me yet. "Members are required to have a minimum of 5 posts before they can post any URL's"

Searching on either of "joost_successfully_run_on_apple_tv"
or "hacking-the-apple-tv" should find the links...

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How did you know what I was up to; are you a mind-reader?

I've just done a news story rounding up all the key developments - Hackers turning Apple TV damp squib into hot item?