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Thread: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

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    Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    You're in charge of global PC development. Which change(s) would you make?
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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    I'd like to see a case that has a monitor mount built in, either to embed a monitor into the case or an arm that holds the monitor above the case, to give system builders an upgradeable option for an all in one machine. I like all in one machines for their space saving options while providing a better screen than is available on laptops. I'd like to expand that to allow system builders to get the same benefits of space saving but without giving up the upgrade-ability of custom cases. I would be an awesome LAN case if it gets done at some point.

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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    Better cooling! Can't believe how difficult it seems to be to get a case where the fans work in concert with internal CPU and GPU fans. I'm sure water cooling does a better job but I don't see why no one has thought of a better way of ducting air flow through a case so keep the GPU and CPU well fed with fresh air and then quickly ducted out the back. It just seems to be a case of throwing more fans at the job until its cool enough at the moment. I'd also like to see a cheap gaming laptop that doesn't run at 80C at the output - My cheapy A8 lenovo is hot enough to give burns and thats with a cooling mat!
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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    Quote Originally Posted by Noxvayl View Post
    I'd like to see a case that has a monitor mount built in, either to embed a monitor into the case or an arm that holds the monitor above the case, to give system builders an upgradeable option for an all in one machine. I like all in one machines for their space saving options while providing a better screen than is available on laptops. I'd like to expand that to allow system builders to get the same benefits of space saving but without giving up the upgrade-ability of custom cases. I would be an awesome LAN case if it gets done at some point.
    Like this?

    http://www.gigabyte.com/products/pro...px?pid=3109#kf

    or this?

    http://www.nextcomputing.com/product...tations/radius

    Think this is ready built though, not sure if the case is bespoke
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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    Reduce licensing costs for Windows - infact sort Windows out in general. When you're looking at PC's costing sub-£300 the cost of a Windows license starts to become a VERY significant part of the BoM price.

    Microsoft have finally recognised the threat in terms making it free for sub-9" tablets, but frankly Windows 8.1 is the third best tablet OS out there and I say that as a Windows 8.1 tablet user - and the rare occasions I use it I've given up on ModernUI with it and just tap around on the desktop version of Firefox for most things as IE11 and the ModernUI apps are mostly dreadful.

    When looking at traditional PCs and laptops the high OS pricing and a product that went out of its way to alienate existing users to push in to a market that they've utterly failed in just goes to demonstrate that Microsoft's incompetence is really the biggest threat to the continuation of the PC as a platform.

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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorburn View Post
    Reduce licensing costs for Windows - infact sort Windows out in general. When you're looking at PC's costing sub-£300 the cost of a Windows license starts to become a VERY significant part of the BoM price.
    It wasn't free to develop... how do you propose Microsoft make revenue without becoming Google or Apple and just trying to drive people to an app store? Windows is rather more complex than Android or iOS...

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorburn View Post
    Microsoft have finally recognised the threat in terms making it free for sub-9" tablets, but frankly Windows 8.1 is the third best tablet OS out there and I say that as a Windows 8.1 tablet user - and the rare occasions I use it I've given up on ModernUI with it and just tap around on the desktop version of Firefox for most things as IE11 and the ModernUI apps are mostly dreadful.
    It needs work but it is far more customisable the Android or iOS, IMHO Windows is the OS closest to being the "one OS for all devices" where a tablet could can dock with different setups and the same storage/CPU can move between roles... I wouldn't buy an iOS or Android tablet (not functional enough for me) but I'd love a good Windows 8.1 tablet, 8-9" with a keyboard and desktop dock...

    Quote Originally Posted by Thorburn View Post
    When looking at traditional PCs and laptops the high OS pricing and a product that went out of its way to alienate existing users to push in to a market that they've utterly failed in just goes to demonstrate that Microsoft's incompetence is really the biggest threat to the continuation of the PC as a platform.
    Also goes to underline just how much PC == Windows, Linux has utterly failed to capitalise in the low cost market and only Google ChromeOS is making any headway and that's basically a limited tablet type device like Android or iOS... OSX has always been too expensive for the average consumer as well, and rather marmite.

    Traditional PCs/Laptops are reducing in sales volume for 2 main reasons - firstly the hardware lasts longer because even 5 year old stuff is very capable still for internet browsing and secondly because simple usage patterns are well catered for by smartphones and tablets which are far more portable and user friendly for the average tech-eejit. The quality of Windows is only a minor factor, if people actually needed/wanted new PCs they'd be buying them and since Windows is the only OS that makes any sense to most people on a PC then it would just be there by default in whatever version.

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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    Quote Originally Posted by kingpotnoodle View Post
    It wasn't free to develop... how do you propose Microsoft make revenue without becoming Google or Apple and just trying to drive people to an app store? Windows is rather more complex than Android or iOS...
    That's what Microsoft IS doing - the reason they wanted to force everyone in to ModernUI was because then you have to purchase all your apps through their store front. They want their own walled garden and revenue take on top of the OS licensing costs.

    The question of where they can draw revenue from isn't really my problem though, its theirs. The combination of Windows hardware requirements for a reasonable experience, combined with the licensing costs, is harming laptop and desktop sales and pushing people to other platforms (NOT Windows tablets).

    Quote Originally Posted by kingpotnoodle View Post
    It needs work but it is far more customisable the Android or iOS, IMHO Windows is the OS closest to being the "one OS for all devices" where a tablet could can dock with different setups and the same storage/CPU can move between roles... I wouldn't buy an iOS or Android tablet (not functional enough for me) but I'd love a good Windows 8.1 tablet, 8-9" with a keyboard and desktop dock...
    Windows in general is more customisable, but ModernUI itself certainly isn't. I still don't think a Windows tablet like my Transformer Book T100 actually gives a good "one OS for all devices" experience - it's a so-so netbook combined with a poor tablet, and that's primarily down to the lackluster OS.

    Quote Originally Posted by kingpotnoodle View Post
    Also goes to underline just how much PC == Windows, Linux has utterly failed to capitalise in the low cost market and only Google ChromeOS is making any headway and that's basically a limited tablet type device like Android or iOS... OSX has always been too expensive for the average consumer as well, and rather marmite.

    Traditional PCs/Laptops are reducing in sales volume for 2 main reasons - firstly the hardware lasts longer because even 5 year old stuff is very capable still for internet browsing and secondly because simple usage patterns are well catered for by smartphones and tablets which are far more portable and user friendly for the average tech-eejit. The quality of Windows is only a minor factor, if people actually needed/wanted new PCs they'd be buying them and since Windows is the only OS that makes any sense to most people on a PC then it would just be there by default in whatever version.
    I agree on smartphones, but the quality of Windows has been a major factor of people choosing Android/iOS tablets over Windows laptops - they are simpler in terms of not having to worry about viruses, malware, etc, and give a better user experience at a lower cost. The combination of every XP user now getting popup messages telling them XP is no good anymore and the poor public opinion of Windows 8 will just push more people to make the switch.

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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    Intel and Microsoft's prices need to come down maybe about 30 percent. Especially now that Linux is becoming more popular.

    CPU's & GPU's need to give better performance at a much lower power usage. Nvidia and Intel seem to be ahead here, but they all still need to improve things.

    Mini ITX is great and needs more manufacturers behind it. Personally I have a great big lump of a PC and in this day and age Mini ITX tells me the size of modern ATX motherboards is not really needed. So smaller PC and MOBO's Please!

    Tablets seem to have the power these days (powering high res' screens with some fairly advanced GFX) perhaps x86 should take a back seat for some advanced ARM Multi CPU/GPU motherboards !

    Off subject: I don't really see tablets continuing to gain ground on proper PC's, tablets at the moment only seem to be for the fashion conscious and unless some major advancements happen tablet sales will drop off in the next few years after the FAD has been seen for what it is. But a lot of the tech in them should be forwarded to the PC..or Mac if your that way inclined.

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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    I Used to Have a Amstrad CPC6128 many moons ago. One of the features that could be resurrected would be that you could use a module that housed pre-installed ROMs which had the likes of word on that would install the minimum to the core machine but keep the majority on the ROM. The software ran instantly (SSD Like today). Piracy would be harder as it would be more than a clone disc, but a duplicate encrypted ROM. It would be another money stream for chip makers.

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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    The only problems PCs have these days are software related. It's all a needlessly inconsistent bloated buggy crappile.
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    ...every time Creative bring out a new card range their advertising makes it sound like they have discovered a way to insert a thousand Chuck Norris super dwarfs in your ears...

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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    Quote Originally Posted by peterb View Post
    Like this?

    http://www.gigabyte.com/products/pro...px?pid=3109#kf

    or this?

    http://www.nextcomputing.com/product...tations/radius

    Think this is ready built though, not sure if the case is bespoke
    Those look awesome, why can't I find one on Scan I think one of those designs as a gaming LAN box would do well. LANs are becoming more common, above the locally run ones within social groups, so I think that a lot of gamers would choose something like that over a conventional case because of its utility. I know myself and a friend picked our first cases out because they had a handle on the top to be easily carried; we organised a LAN once a month almost so anything that made the transport process easier was well worth it.

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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    Quote Originally Posted by DemonHighwayman View Post
    Tablets seem to have the power these days (powering high res' screens with some fairly advanced GFX) perhaps x86 should take a back seat for some advanced ARM Multi CPU/GPU motherboards !
    Any modern GPU could push pixels for fun. It's what happens when you throw 3D images at it that counts for most, and while even the most intricate games can look impressive on a high-end phone or tablet, the complexity of them is miles and miles away from what a half-decent desktop GPU can (and does) do. x86 doesn't come into it.

    Don't get me wrong, I like that we've gone through the whole simple game phase again, the true essence of casual gaming and what brought us to where we are, but PC and even console games can offer so much more (I'm not saying they always do, but they can).

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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    Forget the obvious: memory, price, form factor...All that is irrelevant.
    The PC business is stagnating, and will continue to get worse until a solution is found to one simple problem: the availability of LOW-cost internet access to anyone, anywhere on earth.

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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    Quote Originally Posted by this_is_gav View Post
    Any modern GPU could push pixels for fun. It's what happens when you throw 3D images at it that counts for most, and while even the most intricate games can look impressive on a high-end phone or tablet, the complexity of them is miles and miles away from what a half-decent desktop GPU can (and does) do. x86 doesn't come into it.

    Don't get me wrong, I like that we've gone through the whole simple game phase again, the true essence of casual gaming and what brought us to where we are, but PC and even console games can offer so much more (I'm not saying they always do, but they can).
    What I was getting at about x86 is that seemingly because of its complexity it uses a lot more power. Now if we could get similar performance using ARM (maybe 2-3 chips) to a current midrange x86 cpu that would be a welcome power reduction.

    I realize PC GPU's are superior to tablet offerings but tablet GPU's have advanced very quickly in comparison, and the latest ones even power 4k screens! So in a year or two, maybe tablets can match PC graphics of today -who knows ?

    Anyway power usage I guess is what i'm most concerned about with PC's.

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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    The world has been seriously held back by Microsoft, Intel and Apple recycling other peoples ideas and generally doing all they can to devalue the word "innovation". Nuke them from orbit, it is the only way to make sure.

    That would release the intellectual property rights to the DEC Alpha (currently shelved by Intel), so open source it and let the Chinese universities and government complete the work they have started on making new versions of the CPU. Might get some interesting hardware then rather than just more iterations of the Pentium Pro squeezed into an even thinner laptop at ever higher prices because that is the vision of some idiot at Intel, running Microsoft's latest mouth breathing controlled interface.

    The world's server rooms are already dominated by Linux, and you can buy a small Android laptop for £50 on amazon today, there is no lack of genuinely interesting ideas out there. They need to be given a chance.

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    Re: Features - QOTW: How would you improve the PC?

    Most of my thoughts on improving a PC have happened, and the device known as a "tablet" now exists, which for the majority of people is the internet access point that they need.

    Two reasons now exist to own a PC over a tablet in my opinion

    1) Data entry and analysis. Whether its preparing documents, working with ERP software or analysing sales figures, a PC is still the best option by far. Within an office environment, or even just at home a tablet doesn't work well.

    To improve a PC further for this means that the OS has to be less intrusive and become better at resource management. I still think Windows allows a single application to take too many resources and doesn't free them up fast enough. Too many times I've seen users cancel running reports because the PC has completely locked up.

    2) Games, despite the lack of PC specific titles of late, the PC still represents a good gaming option. Improving this should focus on the PC's strengths of offering custom content, allowing files to be freely changed and altered.

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