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Thread: Elon Musk plans human trials for brain-computer Neuralink in 2020

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    Re: Elon Musk plans human trials for brain-computer Neuralink in 2020

    I think Musk would probably have this tech himself if it didn't mean time off work to recover. We have this idea (promoted by doctors) that injury from surgery heals within 6 weeks. I can say this is unequivocally bollocks. There's chronic inflammation and some wounds don't heal for ages. There's always fatigue after a surgery like this and to think it could ever be "routine" with current medical technology is utterly insane. If we develop a way of completely eradicating micro-organisms from the surgical field whilst preserving human tissue, yeh, okay, maybe. But that isn't anywhere close.

    In my field, we stick in pacemakers to stop people's hearts stopping. A pacemaker implant is second only to hip replacements in terms of cost effectiveness (i.e. how much money it saves over time Vs the cost of the treatment). So why don't we give one to everyone? Anyone can get cardiac conduction tissue fibrosis and end up dying of a heart stopping and a few grand is pretty cheap. We don't because of risk / benefit - you must determine that someone is going to benefit before exposing them to risk. If a pacemaker gets infected, the risk is life threatening and the same with a brain infection. The idea that this could be used recreationally is utterly insane for now. If he wants to develop a treatment for a specific medical condition then I'd be more than happy to see the results. I accepted the risk of paralysis for my surgeries (all three of them) but the condition they were treating was such that i had no life without it.

    In medicine most treatments have levels of evidence attached to their indications. Class I is an indication where if you don't treat the patient, you're negligent. Class IIa is "yeah, you should do this but there are reasons not to", IIb is "maybe, made not, some evidence but not definitive but likely beneficial on balance" and III is "don't do that" and where the risks outweigh the benefits. If you throw in a pacemaker for a class III indication, you're likely to get sued if the patient realises. The evidence for doing this kind of Musk stuff isn't even class III. it's non existent. We know the risks, we don't know of any benefits from this. It's therefore totally unethical in my view. This man is taking a look from an engineer's stand point, not a doctor's.

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    Re: Elon Musk plans human trials for brain-computer Neuralink in 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by philehidiot View Post
    I think Musk would probably have this tech himself if it didn't mean time off work to recover. We have this idea (promoted by doctors) that injury from surgery heals within 6 weeks. I can say this is unequivocally bollocks. There's chronic inflammation and some wounds don't heal for ages. There's always fatigue after a surgery like this and to think it could ever be "routine" with current medical technology is utterly insane. If we develop a way of completely eradicating micro-organisms from the surgical field whilst preserving human tissue, yeh, okay, maybe. But that isn't anywhere close.

    In my field, we stick in pacemakers to stop people's hearts stopping. A pacemaker implant is second only to hip replacements in terms of cost effectiveness (i.e. how much money it saves over time Vs the cost of the treatment). So why don't we give one to everyone? Anyone can get cardiac conduction tissue fibrosis and end up dying of a heart stopping and a few grand is pretty cheap. We don't because of risk / benefit - you must determine that someone is going to benefit before exposing them to risk. If a pacemaker gets infected, the risk is life threatening and the same with a brain infection. The idea that this could be used recreationally is utterly insane for now. If he wants to develop a treatment for a specific medical condition then I'd be more than happy to see the results. I accepted the risk of paralysis for my surgeries (all three of them) but the condition they were treating was such that i had no life without it.

    In medicine most treatments have levels of evidence attached to their indications. Class I is an indication where if you don't treat the patient, you're negligent. Class IIa is "yeah, you should do this but there are reasons not to", IIb is "maybe, made not, some evidence but not definitive but likely beneficial on balance" and III is "don't do that" and where the risks outweigh the benefits. If you throw in a pacemaker for a class III indication, you're likely to get sued if the patient realises. The evidence for doing this kind of Musk stuff isn't even class III. it's non existent. We know the risks, we don't know of any benefits from this. It's therefore totally unethical in my view. This man is taking a look from an engineer's stand point, not a doctor's.

    I hear what your saying, but the upside is 4k porn uploaded directly to your eyeballs with pleasure centres being manipulated by the associated software, damn the risks


    On a serious note, if this ever gets to the commercially available stage then it will more than likely be the entertainment applications that will drive sales, not the medical ones.

    That's a long way off though
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    Re: Elon Musk plans human trials for brain-computer Neuralink in 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Ttaskmaster View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Tabbykatze View Post
    I'm the complete opposite and am a firm believer that eventually Cyberisation is the future of the human race.
    But do you think Musk is really the one to lead it?
    Out of all the major tech leaders, I'd say hes probably the best bet for now.

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    Re: Elon Musk plans human trials for brain-computer Neuralink in 2020

    I've just seen it.

    Satellites everywhere with an omnipresent internet. Neural links in everyone allowing streaming directly into your brain, with the ability to stimulate the pleasure centres and cause release of various neurotransmitters.

    Musk wants to be the next great pr0n baron. It's so obvious.

    (Actually, sounds just like Deus Ex...)

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    Re: Elon Musk plans human trials for brain-computer Neuralink in 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Dareos View Post
    I hear what your saying, but the upside is 4k porn uploaded directly to your eyeballs with pleasure centres being manipulated by the associated software, damn the risks
    The fact that someone could hack that data route, even without knowing how dark my imagination can be, it's a nightmare waiting to happen... Still want one, or shall I flood your pleasure senses with images that are like sandpaper on nerve endings?
    _______________________________________________________________________

    Quote Originally Posted by PC-LAD View Post
    Tasky is right

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    Re: Elon Musk plans human trials for brain-computer Neuralink in 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by Ttaskmaster View Post
    The fact that someone could hack that data route, even without knowing how dark my imagination can be, it's a nightmare waiting to happen... Still want one, or shall I flood your pleasure senses with images that are like sandpaper on nerve endings?
    My imagination is dark enough to scare away any hackers.

    I once "removed" a gobby, abusive young lady from a café with a graphic description of what was in my head. I got free food as a thanks.

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    Re: Elon Musk plans human trials for brain-computer Neuralink in 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by philehidiot View Post
    My imagination is dark enough to scare away any hackers.
    No no... they just hack. *I* supply the darkness.... hur hur hur hur!!!!!!
    _______________________________________________________________________

    Quote Originally Posted by PC-LAD View Post
    Tasky is right

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    Re: Elon Musk plans human trials for brain-computer Neuralink in 2020

    Don't know if I would trust someone as seemingly unhinged with direct access to my brain.

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    Re: Elon Musk plans human trials for brain-computer Neuralink in 2020

    So Marvel has Billionaire Tony Stark and DC has Billionaire Bruce Wayne to save humanity. So it is now OK for Billionaires Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos to save the real world because that is what Billionaires do, save the world not rape it for as much money as they can make Right???

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    Re: Elon Musk plans human trials for brain-computer Neuralink in 2020

    This is pretty interesting. As a fan of the Deus Ex series, I for one am looking forward to getting my augmentations implanted.

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    Re: Elon Musk plans human trials for brain-computer Neuralink in 2020

    Quote Originally Posted by ToastyPorcupine View Post
    This is pretty interesting. As a fan of the Deus Ex series, I for one am looking forward to getting my augmentations implanted.
    So.... you'll be getting a Johnny Jaquobis style finger laser, then?
    _______________________________________________________________________

    Quote Originally Posted by PC-LAD View Post
    Tasky is right

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    Re: Elon Musk plans human trials for brain-computer Neuralink in 2020

    I thought this was satire at first lmao

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