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Thread: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

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    Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    Mozilla is perturbed about "additional and unnecessary steps" to alter browsing defaults.
    Read more.

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    Re: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    While I don't disgree with the comments about Windows 11 making life harder for users, maybe Mozilla could take notice of their own users complaining about their changes making life harder for them before complaining about other companies.

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    Re: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    Quote Originally Posted by LSG501 View Post
    While I don't disgree with the comments about Windows 11 making life harder for users, maybe Mozilla could take notice of their own users complaining about their changes making life harder for them before complaining about other companies.
    Guess that shows that you don't have to be a $billion mega-corp to have big egos involved who just 'know best'.


    Wasn't the GNOME 3 on Linux another attempt to foist major changes on users whether they liked it or not? AFAIR wasn't about the fear of being left behind the hyped tablet market like Microsoft's Metro UI? Or concentrating so much on a scaleable UI that traditional desktop users' experience regressed?

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    Re: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    Quote Originally Posted by LSG501 View Post
    While I don't disgree with the comments about Windows 11 making life harder for users, maybe Mozilla could take notice of their own users complaining about their changes making life harder for them before complaining about other companies.
    Never had a problem with Mozilla, infact I think that will run on anything tpm or not (sorry cheap dig).
    But firefox I would say is miles better than edge or even chrome.

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    Re: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    This kind of thing is why I'm not even really looking at W11 until we get to see the final version, and then know if this is a deliberate move or just a "developer thing".

    it was found Mozilla has already done something which lets its Firefox browser reclaim the browser preferences in one shot, but the likes of Chrome, Opera, Vivaldi, and Brave needed the presence of mind to change and confirm at first ask or fiddle through multiple file associations later.
    Well, exactly. I'd bet that if individual packages don't start to acquire a "make me default" facility, poste haste, some utility developer will.

    I use the utilities I use because I find them best for me. They might be built-in tools, or more likely, 3rd party tools, but either way, I'm switching to them because I've already decided they're best for me. Some are free, many paid-for, but in any event, I use what I prefer. YMMV. If, when it comes out, it were to turn out I can't, it makes my decision about upgrading for me. But I doubt that'll happen.
    A lesson learned from PeterB about dignity in adversity, so Peter, In Memorium, "Onwards and Upwards".

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    Re: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    I wonder how long before the EU gives MS another fine?!

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    Re: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    Quote Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH View Post
    I wonder how long before the EU gives MS another fine?!
    That is another point.
    Unlike Intel who settled out of court ("we've never been convicted!"), Microsoft were actually fined and this kind of behaviour seems contrary to their settlement.
    Competition authorities are weak enough in what they do and don't do and powers they have, but blatantly breaking a settlement? That's asking for trouble and subsequent breaches are handled far quicker too.

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    Re: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    Quote Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH View Post
    I wonder how long before the EU gives MS another fine?!
    That thought was what immediately hit me too but, of course, their current response, and it might well be true, would be "it's just a beta".

    If this reported behaviour is in the released version, then I guess a lot depends on exactly what it does, and probably how it does it. But if it's as the reports suggest, it really looks like MS are setting themsleves up for another regulator b-slapping. That is probably why my sense of this is that it's a .... 'misinterpretation', and that surely even MS aren't that daft. Or if they are, they'll come to their senses.

    The cynic in me even wonders if it's a deliberate misdirect? You know, plant a bit of media click-bait, wait for the howls of outrage, issue a polite mea culpa, "sorry, beta version yada-yada" and hope people move on from hardware requirements outrage, etc.
    A lesson learned from PeterB about dignity in adversity, so Peter, In Memorium, "Onwards and Upwards".

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    Re: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    I'm sure it's all news generation and hype. They want as much publicity about Windows 11 as possible. Every time something like this comes out, people read it and they'll do what we should all do... "it's a non-issue, it's beta, I don't care as long as it's not in the final version. This kind of thing is the very point of this kind of testing". And then you see something about how they've made Paint better and you're supposed to go "oooooh".

    But you don't because they're advertising how they have made Paint look prettier rather than "we've removed the bloat and the spyware so using your computer won't be like wading through telepathic treacle that reports your thoughts".

    Are they pushing the boundaries? Or are they stripping out features they don't like, putting it back to basics and seeing what people say they'd like from it? Why build something and then present it and then rebuild it, when you can just wait for the complaints and then build it once based on that market research?

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    Re: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    Quote Originally Posted by kompukare View Post
    That is another point.
    Unlike Intel who settled out of court ("we've never been convicted!"), Microsoft were actually fined and this kind of behaviour seems contrary to their settlement.
    Competition authorities are weak enough in what they do and don't do and powers they have, but blatantly breaking a settlement? That's asking for trouble and subsequent breaches are handled far quicker too.
    Quote Originally Posted by Saracen999 View Post
    That thought was what immediately hit me too but, of course, their current response, and it might well be true, would be "it's just a beta".

    If this reported behaviour is in the released version, then I guess a lot depends on exactly what it does, and probably how it does it. But if it's as the reports suggest, it really looks like MS are setting themsleves up for another regulator b-slapping. That is probably why my sense of this is that it's a .... 'misinterpretation', and that surely even MS aren't that daft. Or if they are, they'll come to their senses.

    The cynic in me even wonders if it's a deliberate misdirect? You know, plant a bit of media click-bait, wait for the howls of outrage, issue a polite mea culpa, "sorry, beta version yada-yada" and hope people move on from hardware requirements outrage, etc.
    MS seems to go through cycles of remembering their past mistakes and acting on them,and then forgetting everything and doing the same mistakes.

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    Re: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    Quote Originally Posted by LSG501 View Post
    While I don't disgree with the comments about Windows 11 making life harder for users, maybe Mozilla could take notice of their own users complaining about their changes making life harder for them before complaining about other companies.
    Mozilla gives you about:config to turn stuff off, unlike MS/google/apple/etc

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    Re: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    Quote Originally Posted by Xlucine View Post
    Mozilla gives you about:config to turn stuff off, unlike MS/google/apple/etc
    That only works as long as the switch is still available within about:config and hopefully works correctly when changed. They've been removing things from it after all, for example they just removed the ability to turn off the new proton UI (which a lot of people seem to dislike, myself included) via about:config and we now need to resort to userchome etc. Mozilla is trying to change firefox into the same sort of 'fixed design' that chrome etc uses so long term it might not give us that option, to be fair by that point they might not actually have any users left but still.

    It's not just removal though, some things are left in about:config but are 'no longer supported' so may have issues in the future, like compact mode....something 'mozilla' feels isn't necessary to support because in their opinion 'no one' uses it....
    Last edited by LSG501; 20-08-2021 at 11:44 PM.

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    Re: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    Quote Originally Posted by Xlucine View Post
    Mozilla gives you about:config to turn stuff off, unlike MS/google/apple/etc
    Vivaldi has vivaldi://flags and Opera has opera://flags/

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    Re: Microsoft adds friction to default browser switching in Windows 11

    Quote Originally Posted by kompukare View Post
    That is another point.
    Unlike Intel who settled out of court ("we've never been convicted!"), Microsoft were actually fined and this kind of behaviour seems contrary to their settlement.
    Competition authorities are weak enough in what they do and don't do and powers they have, but blatantly breaking a settlement? That's asking for trouble and subsequent breaches are handled far quicker too.
    Intel started off being really good at settling at the last minute, but it didn't always work. Intel lost the DEC/Compaq/Intergraph case (though clearly Intel had already dealt a killing blow to those hardware companies) and later the EU and Japan found against Intel. Intel are convicted monopolists. However, given some of their fan base I'm just surprised you can't buy "Convicted monopolist inside" stickers that they use with pride.

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