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The Start menu is gone, but is the desktop better or worse?
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The Start menu is gone, but is the desktop better or worse?
To get over the desktop drawbacks you can get the start menu back. There is a free version available but I went with Start8 from stardock for about £3.
I just got so used to using the search bar that using the MetroUI seems counter productive.
Next up, i'm hoping that a theme can be created to bring back Aero, with its transparency and rounded edges.
I'm a professional sound designer and composer and I've tried Windows 8 but can't stand this Modern UI rubbish. It's so incredibly counter-productive in a business environment! Thankfully Stardock gave us Start8, a wonderful start menu for Windows 8. However, the UI is still there.
Hated Windows 8 when the developer preview was released. Have since tried the release preview in a VM full screen for a while, getting used to it, and I have to admit it's actually good.
You raise some excellent points in the article about applications vs. apps - how using an app takes over the whole screen, kicking you from your real 'work'. This is a problem Microsoft will have to deal with in Windows 9. I still get the sense of being forced to use this big (albeit attractive) full-screen Start screen, even when all I want is to quickly search for a file and open it.
Also, I find having to click 'Files', 'Apps' etc. on the right after a search counter-productive. In Windows 7, if I typed 'Device Manager', Device Manager would be the first option. In Windows 8 I have to type Device Manager and then click 'Apps' for it to display results for apps, which is pretty useless. Unless I'm missing something?
Ive had a few compatibility issues that I wasnt expecting.
- Windows had drivers for evrey device except for Creative soundcard and wasnt very helpful in getting one (but i put the blame at Creative's door more than Windows)
- ASUS AI Suite hardly works in Win 8
- Some steam games refuse to work in Win 8 (Rock of Ages and Poker Night at the Inventory so far, suspect more Im slowly working my way through the list
- Logitech Webcam, driver works but software package wont install under Win 8 and they havent done a Win 8 version yet
- Due to not being able to fully disable UAC or use the built in super admin account (you can do but then none of apps on the Start page work) some programs installed on desktop have annoying UAC shield logo's on them and i have not been able to get rid of these yet even though my account is set to admin. (Most suggestions online say replace the image with a blank one but dont want that hassle, there has to be another way)
- Due to them removing a lot of the customise options for the desktop i can no longer set the default colour of windows background from white to the colour I want (I do this to help with my dyslexia and cant believe microsoft have done away with it, also white is the worst possible colour for reading text on for dyslexic's)
Apart form all that its ok. :)
Thanks Hexus for a superb write up, I for one have installed the start button only because I can get around more quickly, my work experience with Windows 8 is superb and I do not have any problems at the moment, not only does windows open and shut down quicker but Microsoft Office is so fast starting up in word and excel, it was quite a shock from what I was use to in Windows Vista when I got my programs up quicker.
I totally agree the new UI does not work well with a laptop or desktop computer and I personally feel you should get a tick box whether you want to use it or not, at the moment when I start up I go straight into Desktop so it is not bothering me, and I am having second thoughts about installing Windows 8 onto my main PC at home because I am enjoying the feel and the quirkiness of it all.
Other have tried putting Windows 8 down I am not sure why it looks like a solid performer to me but everyone is allowed there opinions.
Enjoying the Experience of windows 8 in Desktop mode, well done Microsoft for something new.
This is my biggest problem over deciding on moving to Windows 8: why can't they simply give YOU the choice? Forcing people to go either one way, or the other, is always going to cause dissent at some point, by being flexible you remove one hell of a lot of concerns.Quote:
Originally Posted by Geoff I
So the EU are concerned to the tune of billions about Microsoft 'unfairly' crowding out free web browser software but not the many commercial anti-virus products? Or haven't they noticed yet?
Same problem here - keep checking here http://support.creative.com/KB/showa...sid=61105&h=13 they are (slowly) updating drivers for 8.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanoe
The default MS driver does work for me (XFI Titanium fatality pro pcie) but the 'beta' driver from creative does not.
ASUS don't claim it will and yes this needs sorting :(Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanoe
Really? You think we'd be better off if MS shipped without any malware/virus protection so that the leeching anti virus companies could take your money? MS haven't stopped anyone from installing their own virus checker and disabling the built in one.Quote:
Originally Posted by bridges009
Which programs? I don't move UAC away from default level (security is good).Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanoe
creative have a beta driver for windows 8 some games have patches to work for windows 8 and i believe asus will be doing a windows 8 version of there softQuote:
Originally Posted by Kanoe
you can still use other antivirus products but windows gives you one for free to sart with you can also use it in conjunction with the program of your choice
Kanoe, you can disable the UAC, just go to search then type msconfig, Tools then change UAC settings.
Interesting about Creative, I clicked a link to their site and got taken straight to a download page where my card was supported (X-Fi ExtremeGamer).
You can move the slider down the bottom all you like but in Win 8 it never fully switches off UAC (like it did in 7) as its more baked into the OS than before.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonj1611
So far I got it on Game Save Manager, Defraggler and MSI Afterburner and CPU-Z. Not present on Steam, Origin, CCleaner. Thats pretty much all i got on at the mo. Would welcome any further suggestions.
EDIT: My gf did try explaining this to me last night but I may not have remembed fully. Its something to do elevated priviledges and that evn though you set your account to be Admin level it actually doesnt give you the same priviledge level as the built in admin account. You can use the built in admin account (change its name etc) to get round this but then it locks you out of using the Apps and App store. Being playing with gpedit.msc to change various settings to combat the original issue but not 100% of the impact of tweaking these settings to the secruity of the system.
Indeed, I have just downloaded defraggler and have noticed what you said, while UAC once turned off doesn't interrupt like it did when it was on it still leaves the icon there. Curious.
However no UAC icon on the Start screen I see.
[QUOTE=Kanoe;2688713]Here's a trick from Windows 7 - for things you want to run on startup with admin privs use the task scheduler to launch them. It's possible to run them with the highest privileges and with no UAC prompt. See http://www.techrepublic.com/blog/win...-scheduler/616 for an example which still applies today. Software can programatically set this up for you and so it's really down to the authors not being compliant with the security model (for example, CCleaner used to hit UAC but they've now fixed it).Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonj1611
For stuff you run manually, and only on occasion i'd advise you live with it - after all it's there to protect you and whilst not bulletproof it's an extra level of protection nonetheless. I'm a developer and I run UAC at default level on all my systems (and i've even made our own software compliant with it too).
If none of that helps there is one other trick..
Utterly agree here - that Microsoft ship a basic (?) anti-malware product with the OS is unarguably a good idea. This doesn't prevent folks from subsequently installing a more feature-filled "paid for" app suite later on. So no, I don't think that Intel/Mcafee, Symantec/Norton, etc are going to be losing too many sales - maybe even the reverse since they can now sell on the "we're better than what's there already" aspect. Only downside being that some may think that they're now bulletproof and not bother with any other security software.Quote:
Originally Posted by dangel
And yes, I realise that some folks out there are going to argue that "secure operating" makes anti-malware unneeded but I personally prefer to have that second line of defence if I inadvertently do something dumb (it's been known to happen).
I figure UAC is there for a reason and don't find it too objectionable. The little shield mod on the app icon is a little annoying from a style point of view, but on the other hand the shield does remind you that the app might/does need elevated privs.Quote:
Originally Posted by dangel
As to the article I'm a bit confused - the tone up to the mid-point seems pretty negative, then it suddenly starts going positive. Did the writer get a call from the editor to remind him/her that they needed to be generally positive? ;) I'm also going to argue strongly with the comments about file versions being a replacement for Backup/Restore - since the docs on the latter make it clear that it also has a function wrt disaster recovery, which as simple file version tool won't.
What the series of three articles has convinced me is that my Windows 7 boxes will stay on Windows 7, but any new kit (Christmas is coming soon) will be spec'd with Windows 8.
There is a few issues Mr. Gates needs fix but these are all tiny tweaks which can be implemented in a service pack in maybe a month? all other complaints are for the users to adapt, I'm not saying it'll be quick or easy but it will be worth it especially when using touch screen monitors.
No, what he means is the shield icon that appears. With UAC turned off you get no warnings or prompts just that shield icon.Quote:
Originally Posted by dangel
I run it with it off personally, but thats a personal choice.
Erm seems the quotes are quoting the wrong people, twice in this thread I have noticed it
There may be a bigger problem with UAC. Because the admin user priveleges are not super priveleges as per W7 there may be some programs that do not run. I have had this already on one program but managed a work around
Well depending on who you were quoting - what's the problem with that? You turn off UAC and expect prompts?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonj1611
I leave it on because I very rarely trigger it anyway and because of the obvious benefit of elevation.
I think in 8 disabling UAC also kills MUI apps since the sandboxing relies on it (vague recollection).
I didn't say there was a problem? I was saying what his problem was. And no think I wasn't understood properly, I know you don't get prompts but for some reason you still get that icon, which before when it was switched off you didnt get prompts, warnings or the icon either.
I have turned it off but haven't had any problems as of yet with apps or anything else. I spend 75% of my time on the desktop but haven't had anything yet with the UAC icon.
http://www.thefunnyblog.org/wp-conte...-1996-fail.jpg
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lsk7sdhqRD1qe022q.png
Windows 8, designed by primary kids.
After restoring the start menu and tweaking Explorer beyond what's available by default, my Windows 8 RTM installation doesn't even show the main Modern UI "window".
The available Creative beta drivers are working flawlessly on the Creative USB devices I have. I was quite impressed to see that Microsoft did manage to add to its driver repository a lot of very up to date system drivers, akin to what used to happen on Windows 2000 and earlier, only causing issues with WLAN switching hotkeys.
All in all, Windows 8 is a faster and lighter on resources Windows 7, as long as people take the time to disable/bypass most Modern UI features, IF they intend on using Windows 8 simply as an optimized Windows 7 rather than going head on with Modern UI.
It's simply indicating something that requires elevation (and therefore has risk) which you could argue is still a good thing. Either way, no biggie.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonj1611
"The Devices charm won't let you. And if you're thinking the App switcher would be a good alternative to Alt + Tab, think again, it only lets you switch between Windows Store apps; desktop programs aren't listed at all."
Or you can just use Alt-Tab and have it list all metro and desktop programs
some nice tweaks with the task manager and copy dialogue but too little for me. If it ain't broke......................
Sorry but ouch - Personal Identification Number numbers ?Quote:
PIN numbers and picture passwords provide new authentication methods
So? You found a typo, good for you..Quote:
Originally Posted by mikerr
Anyway, I really want to move to Windows 8 for the performance improvements and the enhancements to Window 7, but based on the comments about it distracting you and the blue screen with the unhappy face, really makes me think they have come up with this OS purely for tablet users who spend less than an hour on it and have completely forgot about the rest of the people who actually work on their computer.
Based on history; Windows 98 was an improvement to 95, XP was an improvement to Millennium, Windows 7 was an improvement to Vista. Windows 8 is probably going to be replaced very fast by something to make everyone happy now.
This was quite an objective review. Probably more than 50-60% of Windows 8 users will not do anything than check their email, watch a YouTube video and browse some pictures. People like us who hang out on this forums don't make more than 10% of the Windows user base.
My eldest kid got a new laptop with Windows8 on it for Christmas (HP Envy dv7) and she's pretty impressed with it. That said, I don't think she really "gets" MUI apart from the fact (so she tells me) that it gets out of the way quite easily.Quote:
Originally Posted by Savas
Her old dad (me) on the other hand is still less than impressed: she's got four MUI apps that refuse to update, with no explanation why they failed (and, more importantly, no clue how to solve the issue); when I got an account setup it seemed to insist on a network-aware "roaming" profile only for me to then have to switch it to a "local" account because I needed admin rights, (because I needed to install AV etc)
So, as you say, I'm looking forward eagerly to Windows9 when they'll have all the issues sorted out. In the meantime boring old Windows7 is fine and dandy for me.