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Thread: £500 gaming build

  1. #17
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    Re: £500 gaming build

    Quote Originally Posted by Turbotab View Post
    What is your quantitative definition of an excellent motherboard?, Bit-Tech actually test the items they recommend, what objective methodology do use, beyond the power of fanboism! The age of stock in the supply chain cannot be guaranteed, and thus many AM2+ motherboards, may not even work with an AM3 processor, without a BIOS flash, none too handy if you do not have a spare AM2 to hand.
    You really don't check review dates carefully do you?? Why don't you check the release date of the newer BIOS for instance. Motherboards like the J&W 790GX Extreme had the newer BIOS in place in early Feburary. Bit-tech's review was in the middle of the same month.

    You argument is very,very weak as it can apply to motherboards for Intel processors too. Also I have had to flash the BIOS of various motherboards to make them work stably with certain Intel processors in the past.

    Intel also make multiple revisions of their CPUs too just like AMD do and sometimes you need to flash to a new BIOS to get the whole shebang working properly.

    What happened when Intel transitioned to their 45nm processors for example ??

    What about from the Pentium D to the Core2 then??

    People have issues with RAM,issues with graphics cards,etc and some of these need BIOS updates to solve them too.

    If this is such a big mountain to climb you should stick to a pre-built PC TBH as many people have had to work around these issues before.

    Also are do you really think that websites are unbiased?? Look at the media around you and you will unpleasantly suprised!!





    Quote Originally Posted by Turbotab View Post
    The ability to unlock the forth core on the X3 720 is sporadic at best, and even then you cannot guarantee stability, especially when overclocked. The few that do achieve a stable OC on the forth core, well I say more power to them!.
    Yep, people on these forums have managed to do so sucessfully. It is useful people know this and give it a try. If they succeed then it means a quad core for no extra price. I have always said that it was a possibility and it was only possible using a 790GX based motherboard. Sometimes people who were going to buy the 720 were not even aware of this. In the days when the 6800le graphics card could be unlocked both my examples were unlocked to 6800 and 6800gt configs. People like you were saying on forums that the likelihood was small and pointless.

    Using your argument we should stop overclocking as it is not guaranteed by the manufacturer!! Of course why spend the extra few quid on an motherboard which you can overclock with when an el-cheapo basic motherboard(with no overclocking ability) can be had for £40??
    After all we cannot be 100% certain that an overclock can be achieved??



    Quote Originally Posted by Turbotab View Post
    Regarding the Madshrimps article, if you examine the Crysis Warhead result, both CPUs produce the same result, when at the same clock rate. They conclude that even at 1280 x1024 the game is GPU bottlenecked. All games at 1920 x 1200 and even 1680 x1050 are heavily GPU bottlenecked, so it demonstrates that a E7400 is just as capable as a E8600 or X3 720 of supporting a modern GPU, at high resolutions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Turbotab View Post
    You also confidently state that modern games prefer multi cores, you give GTA IV & Far Cry 2 as examples, we can ignore GTA, as it is a crappy port, that struggles even on uber hardware, without compensating gamers with mind blowingly superior graphics over its console brethren.

    Lets take Far Cry 2, as an example, in this review the higher clocked dual core (E8500) is faster than the triple core, X3 720, so where is the purported multi core advantage? Do not get me wrong, DirectX 11 and Windows 7, may allow developers to better utilise many core environments, however I do not possess a crystal ball.

    ??????????????????????????????????? Don't base it on one game!! What about FarcCry 2 then?? The extra cache of the E8600 made it 10% faster clock for clock when compared to the E8600. Also you do know that FarCry2 does make use of multiple cores!!

    Ignoring GTA4 is also pointless as more and more games are cross platform. If it can use so will other games in the future. If anything this means more and more games are going to take advantage of multiple cores. FarCry 2 is another cross platform game too.

    People were making the same argument about single cores and dual cores only a few years ago. A dual core Athlon or Pentium D will be far better utilised in modern games than even their higher clockspeed single core brethren.

    Why not go with a cheaper sub £80 E5200,E5300 or X2 7750+ then if you want to go dual core?? The E5*** series only have 1mb less cache than the E7*** and a super high multiplier meaning that you can use a cheaper motherboard too for overclocking to high clockspeeds. I of course made this point before but you conveniently missed it!

    Also what happens in a two years time when games do become more CPU dependent and make better use of multiple cores?? Ever thought how powerful a £100 graphics card will be then?? What about a £200 one? In this case the E7400 will start to show its age much quicker than an X3 720.

    You really do need to think ahead about these things.

    Also BTW the E8500 costs £160(with a cooler). Compare processors at similar price points!! The E7500 is the closest competitor to the 720. Funny that you have missed out the reviews which show that the 720 is as fast or even faster than an E8400!!

    You do know that DX11 will run in Vista too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Turbotab View Post
    You state that “Also whereas the Q6600 would be a good buy at £150 the later ones have high VIDs too and are poor overclockers when compared to earlier examples”, please can you provide links, to where this has been methodically tested, also Scan has the Q6600 for sale at £135!!
    I have one of the later higher VID Q6600 chips in my current computer. Tried the chip with two different chipsets,PSUs and coolers and it needed more voltage than earlier ones people I know have.Many people on other forums including this one have noticed the same thing. I also have had early batch E4300 and E4500 processors which needed much less voltage to overclock with than later ones. Again many people noticed this too on other forums


    BTW the Intel Q6600 costs £137 at Scan for an OEM processor.You need to add a cooler too. An AK965 will cost £14 so it comes to a total of £151.

    http://www.scan.co.uk/search.aspx?q=q6600

    http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/Akasa...Intel-push-pin

    Of course since the Q6600 is a hot running processor when running over 3ghz you may want to invest in a better(and more expensive) cooler too!!



    Quote Originally Posted by Turbotab View Post

    In the reviews you link to, all three use one of the following:
    MSI DKA790GX Platinum
    Gigabyte GA-MA790FXT-UD5P
    ASUS M4A79 Deluxe
    Quite ironic that in an attempt to back-up your assertion that cheaper AM2+ motherboard provide a solid foundation for overclocking, that these professional reviewers chose to utilise MBs that retail for well over £100.
    ??????????? I see one 790GX motherboard there!! The others are 790FX based motherboards!! They have the same SB750 southbridge as the 790GX!! The major difference is that the FX has more PCI-E lanes than the GX and lack of integrated graphics. Overclocking ability is the same as a result!! Also the ASUS M4A79 Deluxe is a DDR3 motherboard. Most reviews show that DDR3 makes little difference compared to DDR2 with the Phenom II. Also a lot of these reviews actually tested the processors with BOTH DDR2 and DDR3 too.

    Again many people have used the J&W 790GX on forums to great effect(including a few here on Hexus too). The same goes for the Asus M3A78-T and even the Biostar one. People on forums have got good overclocking results with them. The Asus M3A78-T had some good reviews on review sites too.


    I actually contacted the guy at Bit-tech about this and he said he had not used the cheaper ones thats all. Since he had not used any of the cheaper ones he could not vouch for them either.

    Have you not even fathomed that manufacturers may even send out some of the more expensive motherboards out to these websites? It is free publicity for their more expensive components which makes noobs think they need to spend more money than they have to on a motherboard.

    So using your incredible flawed logic we should NOT use cheaper motherboards since reviewers use more expensive motherboards in their reviews.

    Again what about user reviews of these cheaper motherboards then if no review sites have reviewed them?? So basically any user review is rubbish too??

    Who actually reviews hardware for these websites then?? They are hardware enthusiasts like many people on these forums.

    Also perhaps you should also look at some of our own Hexus members who actually use 780G and 790GX based motherboards.

    The Phenom II X3 720 and X2 7750+ have unlocked multipliers in the first place!! They don't even need an uber motherboard to overclock with!!
    Last edited by CAT-THE-FIFTH; 06-04-2009 at 06:59 AM.


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    Re: £500 gaming build

    Have a look at the BBB,it's a £475 custom gaming build done on a budget with up-to-date links, prices and build info with test results.

    Well worth a look......
    Last edited by Hyperviper34; 06-04-2009 at 09:10 AM.

  3. #19
    Not a good person scaryjim's Avatar
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    Re: £500 gaming build

    @OP:

    Are you looking to overclock at all? If so I'd concur with CAT that your money would be better spent on a Pentium Dual Core E5xxx processor.

    I'd also add that if you wanted to consider the AMD route, this Gigabyte 790X motherboard is a good option @ £93: it has the newer SB750 southbridge with the overclocking (and *potential* core unlocking) assistance, and also supports CrossFireX, giving you the option of going for a 48x0 card and adding another one down the line. Hexus's review found that the 4830s scale particularly well when paired up. Scan are currently out of stock of 4830s, but they do have 4850s for just over £100. What resolutions are you planning on gaming at? you may find that a 4850 is sufficient...

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    Re: £500 gaming build

    I know the Q6600 has a stellar reputation, but the Q6700 is only a couple of quid more at the moment. It's a steal from Scan, and will likely hit higher clocks than the Q6600.

    http://www.scan.co.uk/product.aspx?ProductId=26532

    and available on Today only for less...

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    Re: £500 gaming build

    Thanks for the wealth of replies.

    For longevities sake, the arguments to move to a AMD x3 720 make sence.
    On resolution I currently have a 19" 1400x900 screen but will most likely upgrade to a 22" 1680x1050 in a month or so.

    build v2

    896MB XFX GTX260 XT, 2000MHz GDDR3, GPU 621MHz, 216 Cores - £147.19
    Antec Three Hundred Black Midi Tower Case - £50.47
    520W Coolermaster Real Power M520 Modular PSU - £62.89
    Arctic Cooling Freezer 64 Pro V2 - £16.66
    AMD Phenom II X3 720 Black Edition - £120.73
    4GB (2x2GB) Corsair TwinX DDR2 XMS2, PC2-8500 (1066) - £42.38

    Total - £440.32 (without motherboard)

    So a decent mobo for this system. I don't need raid,more than one PCI-E slot, firewire, eSata or DDR3. So the best overclocking board I can get for preferably no more than £100 would be ideal.

    Gigabyte GA-MA790X-UD4 seems to have decent components although the second PCI-E slot and such would never be used. User comments suggest it only does voltage increments of .1 for Ram, NB and HT and the Northbridge is pretty hot...so maybe not.

    Gigabyte GA-MA790GP-DS4H seems good but is £126.39.

    J&W JW board is out of stock atm and the Biostar TA790GX XE and Biostar TA790GX 128 don't seem to have great reviews and the sapphire 52026-00-40R can't see anything of clarity on.

    Maybe worth dropping down to a 780 board? Can't see anything much in comparison to how well liked for overclocking the £110 Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3R seems to be.
    Last edited by mikepegg; 06-04-2009 at 03:37 PM.

  6. #22
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    Re: £500 gaming build

    How about an ASUS M3A78?

  7. #23
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    Re: £500 gaming build

    What about this, great board for the money.

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    Re: £500 gaming build

    Quote Originally Posted by scaryjim View Post
    How about an ASUS M3A78?
    Perhaps, not sure its any better than the GA-MA790X-UD4 for £10 less though.

    Quote Originally Posted by staffsMike View Post
    What about this, great board for the money.
    link?

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  10. #26
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    Re: £500 gaming build

    The J&W motherboard is back in stock!! According to Scan they ship with the latest AM3 capable BIOS. The Asus 790GX DDR2 board has had quite good reviews too. The Gigabyte 790X looks good too.

    The J&W is the cheapest though!!


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    Re: £500 gaming build

    Seems to be down to the J&W JW-790GX-Extreme or the Gigabyte GA-MA790X-UD4 and £2 between the two.

    Other than claiming to be "the 1st 790GX motherboard successfully overclocked the Phenom 9850 Black Edition to 3.4GHz on air, long time ago before the launch!" the JW-790GX-EXTREME doesnt seem to have much written about it. Some odd comments on their forums about having to set the CPU multiplier in hex though.

    Any facts/reviews/something with a url to help me make a decision?

    Also read on another thread by Sputnik that "Artic cooling freezer 64 won't fit, The latch fouls the Northbridge heatsink." for the J&W JW-790GX-Extreme...sigh.
    Last edited by mikepegg; 06-04-2009 at 09:27 PM.

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    Re: £500 gaming build

    The J&W is a great 'bang for buck' board. Setting the BIOS in hex is not difficult. They are all shipping with the 1.02 BIOS so are K10 ready.

    I'm not a great overclocker but, I did have it running the 720 at 3.2Ghz at stock voltage (1.325).

    Setting the Advanced clock calibration to auto stopped the machine from starting but, That is probably something I did wrong.

    I did manage to fit the Arctic cooling 64 but, was not happy with it pressing on the Northbridge heatsink incase it fried the northbridge. Now using the scythe ninja 2 and running prime95 for hours it gets to 35c.

    Here I put some info on BIOS settings http://forums.hexus.net/hexus-hardwa...look-ok-3.html

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    Re: £500 gaming build

    got all my stuff and installed now.

    Went with the AMD build and a Gigabyte GA-MA790X-UD4.



    All running nicely and silently. 3dmark 06 gave me 13164 at stock speeds. 15905 @ 3636MHz.
    Last edited by mikepegg; 27-04-2009 at 01:48 PM.

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    Re: £500 gaming build

    Quote Originally Posted by mikepegg View Post
    got all my stuff and installed now.

    Went with the AMD build and a Gigabyte GA-MA790X-UD4.



    All running nicely. 3dmark 06 gave me 13164 at stock speeds. 15905 @ 3636MHz.
    Nice build!! Did your Phenom II X3 720 have a usable fourth core BTW??

    It is impressive what you can get for around £500 nowadays!!


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    Re: £500 gaming build

    Quote Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH View Post
    Nice build!! Did your Phenom II X3 720 have a usable fourth core BTW??
    Nah unfortunately not. Put the latest BIOS on, set ACC to auto and no boot.

    Quote Originally Posted by CAT-THE-FIFTH View Post
    It is impressive what you can get for around £500 nowadays!!
    Was just under £550 with 2 front case fans and the OCZ vendetta 2 but worth the extra fan £ methinks

  16. #32
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    Re: £500 gaming build

    Quote Originally Posted by mikepegg View Post
    Was just under £550 with 2 front case fans and the OCZ vendetta 2 but worth the extra fan £ methinks
    It is only a few quid over and TBH in the long run it is worth it.


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