Home Server - File Backup - Play Around - Advise?

[mikeo01]

Hi, as I am going into my final year of university I was thinking of setting up my own little local server for personal use (because the support in the uni, is well )

I have never really played around with this sort of stuff at home, so was thinking of building a local server to act as file backups (in which my parents could use also) and also to set up a database (for playing around with server side scripting).

I have ventured into multiple areas of computing, mainly scripting and programming so want another computer to mess around with to test with these below:

Apache
PHP & MySQL
Java (test bed)
File backups
Usual server stuff (active directory, domains, DHCP etc etc)

Thinking of using Ubuntu Server edition as I am familiar with ubuntu and really need to start learning more Linux.


As for the hardware, I was thinking about going for server side hardware for the sake of the experience.
I purchased a cheap Sempron 3600+ thinking of using the computer as a file server only, but now I am thinking of venturing into dual socket boards, Opteron based preferably. Yeah it will be older socket 940s, but I should be able to pick up some ECC DDR RAM, I won't be needing too much at all. Or would it be worth my time to stick with an AM2+ socket or AM3 and pick up a Sempron/Athlon for this? Worth my time and money for the Opterons?


Also looking for a managed switch for personal use just for the hell of it.

This is for my final year project and just for learning server side things which will benefit me in future.


Any advise or suggestions, am I going the right way about it? Both the software and hardware, need experience with both really.

Thanks

EDIT:
Forgot to add, I won't be buying a rack mount. I have an old CM iTower 930 that can fit SSI CEB, with a bit of modification it could fit in. Seen as there won't be much devices should go well. *Should*

[smargh]

HP Microserver + Technet subscription.
Or, just VMware Workstation + Technet subscription, and skip additional hardware.

Or pick up an older HP G5 / G6 on ebay, i.e. 261181604893 is £250. These are certainly not designed for cheap ongoing electricity costs though.

[mikeo01]

Hi,

Thanks for the reply. I am looking for cheaper hardware which I want to put together myself. The dual opterons I have worked out will come at around 200w-250w if I take hard drives into account.

Bare in mind these will not be running 24/7, they are for experiment purposes, so preferably Linux because its customisable and free. It's mainly the hardware I am iffy about.


Unless it would be better to find some Xeons on eBay?

[mikeo01]

EDIT: Should really say, anything I can get my hands on to build a cheap server

I am not too savvy on server hardware, but I take it would be similar. Could I reuse say some Dell Poweredge motherboards as that's where I can find say AMD Socket F. Looking towards opteron because I want to try them out

[scaryjim]

All AMD processors can handle ECC RAM if you can get hold of some. 250W of server will pull ~ 15p of electric in 4 hours. A sensibly tweaked, undervolted set-up with a low-power single or dual core processor will do a tenth of that. If you're going to be using it for several hours, several times a week, then seriously consider power draw. A dual core celeron or AMD APU should be plenty, put if you're seriously considering getting something more powerful then a 65W AMD APU would be my favourite - one of the A8-5500 or A10-5700.

Obviously if you *want* to try out "server-class" hardware that's up to you, but I don't think you'll see any real benefit from it - an x86 computer is, after all, an x86 computer, and I'm pretty sure you're not building a server because you want to spend hours with your head in the case: at which point once you've but the case panels back on you're not going to know the difference between two quad core Xeons/Opterons and an i7 2700k/FX-8350. Plus second hand desktop components will be a lot cheaper than second hand server-grade components.

[mikeo01]

Thanks for the reply. I was a bit worried about the power consumption. I think the thought of server grade hardware appeals. I do have my eye on a HDAMA Arima quad socket opteron board, it's fairly cheap but ships from the US. Overall it would cost me £100 for the quad board and 4x quad opterons.

The APUs do seem pretty decent I was considering them, I suppose I wasn't sure they would be up to the job. The APUs and boards are very cheap.

I was mainly thinking also the future proof of server stuff purely because they're built like bricks. And maybe using it as a 24/7 desktop.


Yesterday I managed to pick up a Sempron 145 for £13 so would that actually do, I could try unlocking it and keeping it that way.
If needs be I may opt for an APU then, the power consumption appeals me and I definitely want to start taking it into consideration


I think I may just be greedy in terms of processing power.

[scaryjim]

Unlock it, undervolt it (my Sempy 140 ran at -0.3v), lock the multiplier to somewhere between 8 and 10, and you'll have yourself a ~ 25W dual core

I'm about to do exactly that to build myself a new DC/Web/Mail server (Windows Server/Exchange). You'd be amazed at how little hardware you need to run most server applications, particularly with a very low user load: and if this is just a messing around server you're going to *have* a very low user load. The server-grade hardware is more about reliability when you have heavy load (i.e. tens of users). I've run a Server 2000 web server on a 300MHz Celeron with 256MB SDRAM before, and my old Linux bow was a 2GHz socket A Sempron with 512MB DDR. If it's just for you to mess around with you really don't need much power (it'll spend 99% of its working life at idle), and the older and more complicated your hardware the more idle power draw rockets (go back too far and you don't even get cool'n'quiet/EIST).

As I say, I totally get the interest in server hardware (I know for a fact that there are two old unused servers kicking around from my old unit and I have to fight the urge to liberate them ), but for your uses I just don't think it's sensible. Even as a single core the Sempron would be fine; if you can unlock it then so much the better.

[mikeo01]

25w dual core? ok now that sounds appealing I mean I do want a energy efficient computer, I am not paying the energy bills here so definitely the lower the better.

I am surprised to be honest, I didn't realise you need that little hardware to run things, I assumed server applications need more processing power just because the programs are more complex.
I think it's the thought of having a server which is a lot lower powered than my current desktop that puts me off. I may just have to purchase an SSD and stop worrying about super quick processors

I will give my little Sempron 145 a go then

And that is completely true, most of it's life it'll be sat there twiddling its thumbs. I have no idea why server hardware is much more interesting, deals spring up and they are so tempting.

Thanks for the help, for pulling me back from the idea too. I may have to start considering my current desktop's power consumption too.

[scaryjim]

No worries.

Servers tend to need a lot of concurrency - be that processor power, disk IO, memory throughput, network etc. - because in production environments they can have thousands of users accessing them simultaneously. So a heavily loaded server will need a fast, multicore processor, masses of memory bandwidth, and a big RAID. But if you're going to be the only user, all of that load goes away, and most of the time the server software will sit there waiting for you to ask it to do something. And when you do ask it, it can dedicate pretty much the entire hardware stack to doing that one task. If you're using Linux your software stack is free (as in beer), and the Sempron was so cheap it'd be a shame not to at least give it a go. And if you find the Sempron isn't up to the task, you just move on and get something beefier

[DanceswithUnix]

I like to have enough speed to saturate the local gigabit network, these days that isn't too hard.

I use a Llano quad core, utter overkill but the mini ITX form factor is appealing. A dual core version would have been enough tbh, but what kind of toy is that?

[scaryjim]

*ahem*

http://forums.hexus.net/current-barg...md-bundle.html

[mikeo01]

Yeah that's true, but entire hardware just for me, sounds great

In all seriousness, yeah I will give that Sempron a go, I will see how efficient I can get the little thing. Something very appealing about single cores and I don't know why a 250W would probably suffice.


Both my board and pretty much all AM3 boards come with a Gigabit link which should go nicely for backups, I'll just need to route requests and backups through my PC.
I also got my eye on a managed switch to have a play around so all good to go

EDIT:
That deal isn't too bad, £11 for 4GB DDR3 basically if you take Amazon prices into consideration

[scaryjim]

If you go through ebuyer you can get the APU and board for ~ £100, but even then £20 for 4GB DDR3-1333 is pretty reasonable. And it looks like the board supports extensive voltage adjustment (and has a UEFI BIOS), so might be nicely tweakable for efficiency...

[mikeo01]

Ah one day maybe for now I think my Sempron will do me justice

Problem now is though I ordered Opterons last night (ooops). It was a part of a deal so got 6x Opt8356s and 1x Opt2216. My stupidity. Cheap though.

[scaryjim]

Hmmm, wonder how easy you'll find it to get a board for them. If you can get a 6 - 8 socket board that'd be a real thread monster

Hmmm, not that I'm trying to tempt you or anything, but http://www.ecrater.co.uk/p/16950037/...-h8qm3-2?gps=1



16 threads, 600W+, what's not to like But be ready to empty your life's savings into it if you pick up the server habit now...

[mikeo01]

That would be amazing to try out well funny enough I can get boards for them, however they are shipped from the US. They're all refurbs or used and priced at £70 or lower. That's for the quad sockets However warranty wise, if something goes wrong that's it. But I definitely considered it! I was thinking of modifying my old Coolermaster iTower to fit it, SSI MEB, huge

There's the dual boards that I got interested in, but efficiency wise they would perform not so well in comparison to newer chips.

I did not see that link!! (I want it!). I really shouldn't "accidentally" click "buy now". I knew I shouldn't of got an eBay account for this very issue, too much tempting hardware out there


Orrr I could pick up some 6128s now as they are unbelievably cheap and wait till C34/G34 socket boards start flooding eBay