Cheap build for MCSE virtualisation server

[Smudger]

Hi, a mate want me to build him a server for the purposes of getting him through his MCSE, and so the requirement is pretty similar to my requirement of about 4 years ago...

So, as I haven't kept my ear to the ground with regards to what's best for what, I need some advice.

Is AMD still the way to go for cheap virtualisation?

Would I be better just getting him one of those HP Microservers?

Is an intel setup the most cost effective?

I'm guessing we'll need to be running 3 or 4 virtual servers at a time.

[Bonebreaker777]

I am not really into all the 'VT' but I would say that sticking to the previous generation (socket 1366/1156) would be the most economical. CPUs should be cheap, ECC DDR3 memory should be cheap, etc. One issue would be to find a suitable motherboard but once the requirements been laid out and the budget been set, it is easy to work it out.

[abaxas]

I've got a couple of old quad core opteron serviers (tower) that could be used.

Is this just for MCSE or will he be using vmware too?

[b0redom]

I started looking at doing this, and then decided it would be just cheaper and give me way more grunt if I maxed out the RAM in my iMac and bought a copy of VMWare Fusion.

Does he not have a gaming PC he can use?

[Smudger]

It's just for MCSE, and no gaming PC available, unfortunately.

He's set a budget of £500-600

[aidanjt]

Would nested virtualisation on his desktop/laptop not do?

[scaryjim]

Sounds a lot like the discussion we're having over in http://forums.hexus.net/pc-hardware-...-thoughts.html might be relevant. There's plenty of options on the 'bay for single s1366 Xeon or dual s771 xeon builds for £100 - £200 for the mobo, CPUs and RAM. Obviously you need to add a PSU and hard drives to that, but it's the cheapest way to get server-grade hardware that's designed for virtualisation, and if you're careful with your choices (look for the low-power L-series Xeons) it shouldn't break the bank for the other components either.

if it's new kit you're looking for though, AMD is absolutely the way to go, since they enable hardware virtualisation in all their chips. Something like an FX-6300 (£80) on a cheapish AM3+ board (with integrated graphics) (£35) would give you lots of cores to work with, while a cheaper option would be a £25 Sempron 3850 (quad core, so better for VMs) with a £25 AM1 board. Get lots of high capacity RAM: you can pick up 8GB sticks for just over £40 now, so a couple of those is probably a resaonable investment.

[shaithis]

If the budget is low there are essentially 2 choices:

1. AM3 system
2. Old server pull from ebay or one of the specialists that recycle old kit

Option 1 will obviously not be server-grade hardware, although I can't see him needing that.
Option 2 will be VERY noisy. If he has a back room that it can be put in and not heard, it will work, otherwise it might get annoying FAST.

[Smudger]

There's no current desktop/laptop to use, hence asking me to put it together. The idea is that it'll be used for the duration of the course for virtualisation, then converted for use as a normal desktop/light gaming rig/media server afterwards. I was thinking about grabbing one of the decommissioned servers from work and giving that to him, but a DL380 is probably overkill for the purposes...

Edit: The one I built years ago was also an AMD system, and it served me well, so I'll probably go that route. If only I didn't give that one to my parents...

[aidanjt]

There's no current desktop/laptop to use, hence asking me to put it together.

Ah, well in that case, I cobbled this together:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: AMD A10-7850K 3.7GHz Quad-Core Processor (£109.99 @ Ebuyer)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-F2A88XN-WIFI Mini ITX FM2+ Motherboard (£77.94 @ Aria PC)
Memory: AMD R9 Gamer Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-2400 Memory (£89.99 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: Crucial M500 960GB 2.5" Solid State Drive (£245.00 @ Amazon UK)
Case: CiT MTX-005B Mini ITX Tower Case w/300W Power Supply (£27.99 @ Ebuyer)
Optical Drive: Samsung SN-208DB/BEBET DVD/CD Writer (£12.12 @ CCL Computers)
Total: £563.03
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-05-27 13:16 BST+0100

I figured the highest priority is lots of ram and fast storage, and the A10 aught to be plenty powerful enough for the VMs and all those post certification tasks you mentioned. You don't need much beyond that, but there was room in the budget for a motherboard with ac wifi and an optical drive, so tossed them in there, tweak accordingly.

amended to bump ram to 2400, since the APU graphics core benefits a framerate bump from faster ram for after certification.

[Bonebreaker777]

Ah, well in that case, I cobbled this together:

PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

CPU: AMD A10-7850K 3.7GHz Quad-Core Processor (£109.99 @ Ebuyer)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-F2A88XN-WIFI Mini ITX FM2+ Motherboard (£77.94 @ Aria PC)
Memory: AMD R9 Gamer Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-2400 Memory (£89.99 @ Amazon UK)
Storage: Crucial M500 960GB 2.5" Solid State Drive (£245.00 @ Amazon UK)
Case: CiT MTX-005B Mini ITX Tower Case w/300W Power Supply (£27.99 @ Ebuyer)
Optical Drive: Samsung SN-208DB/BEBET DVD/CD Writer (£12.12 @ CCL Computers)
Total: £563.03
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2015-05-27 13:16 BST+0100

I figured the highest priority is lots of ram and fast storage, and the A10 aught to be plenty powerful enough for the VMs and all those post certification tasks you mentioned. You don't need much beyond that, but there was room in the budget for a motherboard with ac wifi and an optical drive, so tossed them in there, tweak accordingly.

amended to bump ram to 2400, since the APU graphics core benefits a framerate bump from faster ram for after certification.

Shame to the no-ECC support for APUs but I would say an ITX 'server' is nice now and will be even better after (small, quiet, portable to a degree). I would however suggest A8-7600 instead of the A10-7850K. It is not that far performance wise, consumes less and the excess money could be used for an after-market cooler. Plus upgrade the case to something better (CM Elite 110 or Powercool Qube).

[DanceswithUnix]

ITX is very nice if you are absolutely stuck for space, but I went for http://www.ebuyer.com/611200-asus-a8...rboard-a88xm-a as a motherboard as it has plenty of SATA ports, and 4 DIMM sockets for lots of ram. Glad I did that, I am already upgraded from the original 8GB to 16GB or ram so all 4 of my slots are now used.

That would require a bigger case, but then that help for using cheap hard drives.

This assumes that, like me, your VMs aren't going to be chewing lots of CPU, in which case the A8 7600 http://www.ebuyer.com/657970-amd-a8-...-ad7600ybjabox would be tempting as you get a reasonable performance quad core.

If you want some grunt behind the machine, then AM3+ with FX6350 or FX8350 is the way I would go.

[aidanjt]

ECC is only any use for production anyway. It's not as if this is going to be running for anything serious.

[Smudger]

Thanks guys, what about a PSU? Last time I bought one, Corsair were still good! Would a 400w (say, Seasonic) do the job, or would it need more grunt?

Edit - Sorry, just seen to CiT case comes with a 300w PSU. Would that be enough?

[abaxas]

960gb ssd........

[AGTDenton]

You really don't need that much for Virtualisation just make sure the CPU has the virtualisation support which is most i3s, i5s and above (sorry out of the loop on AMD). I ran 2 virtual PC's from my laptop quite happily. RAM is the main killer for Virtualisation. You'd want to look at 12-16GB.
At work I use my standard mainstream desktop i7 860 with about 6 VM's on for testing Server and client changes.
12GB is just enough but would prefer 16GB.

I bet you would get a very capable AMD FX system for your budget.
Personally don't like APU's but each to their own.

I am not really into all the 'VT' but I would say that sticking to the previous generation (socket 1366/1156) would be the most economical.

I'd steer clear of 1366 prices are extortionately high when I looked a couple of months ago and good mobos are scarce.