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Thread: Principles of Air Gunnery

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    adamspestcontrol.co.uk
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    Principles of Air Gunnery

    Air to Air Gunnery Principles

    Ok 1st thing to get your head round is this isnt easy so dont get disillusioned to early, your trying to hit a moving target from a moving platform with projectiles that follow curved paths at varying speeds! Lets look at each in turn

    1. Projectile (bullet) time of flight [TOF]

    If youve ever fired an arrow or thrown a stone youll have noticed that the projectile takes a finate length of time to reach the target, during this time forces come into play. Gravity, The longer the TOF the further the projectile drops. Areodynamic drag. the bullet deccelarates.

    Therefore the closer you are the less these forces have effected your shot. TIP 1 GET CLOSE

    Quote "You can have computer sights or anything you like, but I think you have to go to the enemy on the shortest distance and knock him down from point blank range. Youll get him from in close. At a long distance its questionable."

    Colonel Erich "Bubi" Hartmann Luftwaffe 352 victories WW2

    This Time of Flight [TOF] poses a problem as between pulling the trigger and impact the target will have moved. Maybe not much but then you dont have to miss by much to miss completely. If howver the target is directly in front of you either head to head or running away this movement will not have an effect on aim except in terms of gravity.


    TIP 2 If the target is at an Angle to you LEAD IT

    Quote " Im not a good shot, few of us are. To make up for this I hold my fire until I have a shot of less than 20% deflection and Im within 300 yrds. Good discipline on this score can make up for a great deal"

    Lt.Colonel John C Meyer USAAF

    Snap Shots and Tracking Shots

    Tracking Shots

    A tracking shot does exactly what it says on the tin, track your target from the rear of the target until such time as the bogies movements can be followed smoothly at a range suitable for the guns on the plane been flown, To do this you must stop the bogies vertical and lateral movements having an effect on your shot by "Saddling up" Get behind your bogie and inside his turn, you then have a choice to position his plane ahead of the gun sight Lag Pursuit once in range you then lift the gunsight over the top of him, give him the correct angle of deflection both in front (and remember gravity) above him and let her rip. Or position the target in front of him Lead Pursuit then apply the same principles, this is however risky as the bogie that pulls a sharp move can be lost under the nose of the plane. Or Pure Pursuit where you are following driectly behind, at first glance this would appear the easiest option however a plane from behind makes a very small target.

    Tip 3

    Learn to saddle up and practise Lag pursuit

    As a guide in FB when a plane is turning to your left at 0.30m (300m) you will need to allow TWICE the height of the plane and AT LEAST 1.5 to 2 plane lenghts in front to score hits with .303 machine guns on a Hurricane or similar. In fun games Ill fire from anywhere from 0.35 down, however in more serious aircombat (VOW / VEF) I wont even think about firing till 0.25 usually 0.20 or closer.

    Snap Shots

    This shot presents itself often at the start of a dogfight when the planes 1st meet, the principle is simple to put as much lead as possible into the air so the bogie flys threw the lead. For example you are diving down to meet a target coming up fire as he lifts his nose in front of him as he disappears from sight stop, use your excess speed to bank hard and high, youll be amazed how often as you look over your shoulder your target has a oil, gycol or fuel leak Or sometimes the good old pilot Kill.

    Another example is when closing on an existing DF to help out a wingman who is up the creek, you dont have time to track and lead his aggressor, hes owning your mate, so just blast straight at him and hit him hard.

    More later

  2. #2
    Asking silly questions menthel's Avatar
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    Nice stuff Dak! Can't wait for the further installments.
    Not around too often!

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    HEXUS.timelord. Zak33's Avatar
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    rgr that...look forward to it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Advice Trinity by Knoxville
    "The second you aren't paying attention to the tool you're using, it will take your fingers from you. It does not know sympathy." |
    "If you don't gaffer it, it will gaffer you" | "Belt and braces"

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    Two things have made me think about the distance you fire from. I have a devil of a job getting any hits, but recently I was in a P39 chasing a 109 had a few 300 metre shots with the usual result, however this time I decided to stop firing and just stick to the little booger. Twisting turning etc, and then all of a sudden he fills my screen, one (just one, honest) shot from that monster cannon and BOOOOOOM! the 109 is in flames and plummeting to the deck.

    The other thing that has focused my mind on "distance", is when I am driving home (dont know why this doesnt happen on the way to work). When I get to the 300 yard marker to the junction I turn off, I imagine I'm in a cockpit and on the exit road is a 109. Boy its a long way to fire and get hits!
    The Man with the Silver Spot

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    Im a newbie as some of you know, and some of the words need explaining - If you could please


    Deflection? This the angle that your plane is to the other one?

    My shooting is terrible! Im getting better at controlling the plane and getting away (well.. say 60% of time i get away) most deaths are bailing which kill me (dont know why) and stalling to low (oops).


    But shooting is hard Normally miss... my controls seem maybe bit sensitive so u jump around my target with the ret and miss lots!

    iNsChris

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    No more Mr Nice Guy. Nick's Avatar
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    Deflection...

    Ok, imagine you're approaching a plane from a 45 degree angle behind him with your sights on his cockpit. If you fire now, by the time your bullets get to where he was when you fired, he will have moved on.

    Deflection is the amount of angle taht you have to change your flight path so that when your bullets get to a certain point in space, they meet your enemy's plane there.

    Its a bit like passing a ball into space for Michael Owen to run onto... you kick the ball ahead of him and he runs to meet it there...

    Measuring deflection in degrees is only really handy for explaining the principle. In practise, its all about firing ahead of your target so he flies into your bullets... and no, its not easy...

    For 109s, the best place to hit them is along the engine cowling or in the radiators under the wings... or do what I do, hose the sky down and hope you get lucky...

    If you go into the hardware setup screen of the game, you can adjust your joystick properties and make your stick less twitchy, though I find its normally cos I use a zoomed in gunsight view, so any movement will seem huge!
    Quote Originally Posted by Dareos View Post
    "OH OOOOHH oOOHHHHHHHOOHHHHHHH FILL ME WITH YOUR.... eeww not the stuff from the lab"

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    zoomed is impossible lol, never use it! Jump around way to much!

    Ah i see yeh, I knew i had to shoot infront of them but didnt realise your called it deflection!

    I guess i also need to get used to shooting above to counterack gravity also .

    iNsChris

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    HEXUS.timelord. Zak33's Avatar
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    troo....but CONVERGANCE takes that into account.

    If you set convergance to 300 metres, the bullets cross AND are at that height at 300 metres etc etc.

    But...lets go back a bit.

    I have an air rifle: It is set to hit bang on at 40 yards. The line of sight through my scope is STRAIGHT...the pellet leaves the barrel about 3 inches below my line of sight....cos the Scope is above it.

    The pellet travels UP through my libe of sight quite close to me....it travels in a rainbow shaped arc, and then back down to cross my line of sight at exactly 40 yards.

    Its like a rainbow.

    THEREFORE I have 2 convergances.

    With a plane, the machine guns and canons are often far apart....so they have to be targeted/zeroed/converged at a distance to take both the arc of flight AND the cross over into account.

    A hurricane has up to 12 machine guns in its wings...they are VERY FAR APART...so they corss at your given distance.

    However...something far deeper must be accounted for.

    Back to the air rifle....ready.

    If I lie in the grass and shoot a buny in the head, along a flat field, so long as I am 40 yards from it I can aim straight.

    If I am closer I aim a bit low
    If further I aim a bit higher.

    But what if I aim at a bird in a tree right above me?

    And guesses?

    Quote Originally Posted by Advice Trinity by Knoxville
    "The second you aren't paying attention to the tool you're using, it will take your fingers from you. It does not know sympathy." |
    "If you don't gaffer it, it will gaffer you" | "Belt and braces"

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    HEXUS.timelord. Zak33's Avatar
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    well, this is the problem.....gravity sucks DOWN.....so if you are flying straight up, and you shoot, the bullets dont drop back down ...well they do, but down is backwards...

    they drop backwards....ie they slow down.

    And you gotta aim lower than normal....cos they'll be miles over otherwise.

    Is this helping?

    course its not......dont get like me, and worry about all these things.

    Play it like a fun game....get up there, shoot, if you miss, try summit different.

    Once you get it right, come shoot me down....I'll still be calculating with a protractor just how many degrees off I have to shoot when you toast me

    Quote Originally Posted by Advice Trinity by Knoxville
    "The second you aren't paying attention to the tool you're using, it will take your fingers from you. It does not know sympathy." |
    "If you don't gaffer it, it will gaffer you" | "Belt and braces"

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    lol zak i get it, One thing which is annoying is when i hit and it seems to sdo absolutly nothing! I came up behind a guy sprayed him with both guns and they hit and say debury flying yet no smoke... no cables broke or surfaces affected!

    GRRRRRRR!

    off to play Look out for iNsChris - Normally play is the big servers with fixed cockpit and names on!

    iNsChris

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    No more Mr Nice Guy. Nick's Avatar
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    Aim for wings or engine/cockpit.

    The wings have fuel tanks in them, so get em smoking... the engine has loads of sensitive stuff all crammed into a small place... and the cockpit... well, how would you fly with a couple of shells through your head?

    It depends what you hit em with too. .303 calibre rounds don't do masses of damage to the airframe, whereas a couple of 20mm explosive shells will tear the tail right off...
    Quote Originally Posted by Dareos View Post
    "OH OOOOHH oOOHHHHHHHOOHHHHHHH FILL ME WITH YOUR.... eeww not the stuff from the lab"

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    Its hard to find good servers, i hate playing without names because i end up chasing my own team for hrs untill i get close and find out there not the enemy!

    Also, most ones seem to be empty or have high pings or boot me and say "not registered" lol!

    At the moment i havent got any chases going today! Enjoying it though! i wake up just excited to play it!

    bad for my studys

    iNsChris

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    adamspestcontrol.co.uk
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    LOL He is hooked peeps Servers with correct plane sets IE Allied v Axis 109s/190s/Stuka etc V Yaks, I153s, Spitfires is brillant for NO icon / name play, means target recognition comes in and then you hit more often as you have to ID the tgt 1st

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    yeh, not advisable on two days of gaming though eh hehe!

    I was on a server earlier and the planes were freely avalible! It was stupid!

    Woohh i feel dizzy typing this from all the spins and stuff lol!!!!

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