News - Windows 8 to deliver faster boot times

[HEXUS]

Microsoft focuses on the fundamentals.

Read more.

[pauldarkside]

Now that's a welcome improvement - the demo in their video they showed was shockingly quick.

/wishes he had UEFI

[hansmuff]

I don't see this as an important feature for two reasons:

(1) SSDs are making inroads and bring boot times sub 20s to Windows 7 as is. In a few years, SSD boot drives will be standard fare.

(2) Device drivers are stupid enough as it is today. Hibernation frequently causes problems with drivers on my machines where I end up cold booting to resolve the issue. I understand that when hibernation becomes part of the boot process, and microsoft validates the drivers properly, those issues may be mitigated. I also think though that it'll be a painful process for end users until drivers really are stable enough for this mode of operation.

[pauldarkside]

The way I understood it, after reading the blog post, was that device drivers would still initialise as normal, it's the kernel that's hibernated. Have I misunderstood something?

[tigertop1]

Any news on a Beta version for us to test yet?

[Funkstar]

I don't see this as an important feature for two reasons:

(1) SSDs are making inroads and bring boot times sub 20s to Windows 7 as is. In a few years, SSD boot drives will be standard fare.

Sub 20s is one thing, but taking it down to the level in that video is something else. The slowest part of it was the POST process, this highlights just how badly the PC needs UEFI. POSTing a laptop is one thing, doing that with a desktop is going to show that the BIOS POST is going to be many times longer than the Windows 8 boot process. Anyway, that system was using a SSD to get to that level.

(2) Device drivers are stupid enough as it is today.

See below

The way I understood it, after reading the blog post, was that device drivers would still initialise as normal, it's the kernel that's hibernated. Have I misunderstood something?

Directly from the article:

Sp yes, it's just the kernel session that goes into the hibernation, meaning drivers are still initialised just like in a cold boot and so is the user session. You will still need a full boot at times, after a Windows Update that affects the kernel for example, or for anti virus app updates.

[Lucio]

Looks interesting, but what are the security implications of not being able to kill the kernal off?

[kalniel]

Looks interesting, but what are the security implications of not being able to kill the kernal off?

None. Power off is still power off - nothing can be done until powered back on again. Users and Windows can restart the kernel as required.

[Lucio]

None. Power off is still power off - nothing can be done until powered back on again. Users and Windows can restart the kernel as required.

I was more thinking of providing a new way for malicious applications can hide themselves from security scanning software. By activating just prior to the kernel hibernating and then activating their payload as it comes back of hibernation I could see potential vectors.

[crossy]

I was more thinking of providing a new way for malicious applications can hide themselves from security scanning software. By activating just prior to the kernel hibernating and then activating their payload as it comes back of hibernation I could see potential vectors.

Nice piece of thinking - I'm guessing (/hoping!) that MS has seen this potential too and come up with a "cunning plan" to nip it in the bud - there was some talk (elsewhere) of having levels of approvals/signing - so it's only the apps with the most-secure/most-trusted that could insert themselves. Okay, that's a system that's no proof against some daft user going "Allow this app..."

SSDs are making inroads and bring boot times sub 20s to Windows 7 as is. In a few years, SSD boot drives will be standard fare.

Yes, I'm in broad agreement with what you're saying - heck the way things are going we'll have all but archival on SSD - so that's OS and apps on large, easily-affordable SSD's. Plus, I'm actually pretty content with my Win7 boot time - maybe I should get around to disabling some of the POST checks, because they (seem to?) take a good while. My current system POSTs, then I get my Splashtop "mini OS", then Win7. And tbh by the time I get settled/comfy the system's usually at login screen anyway. Only real advantage to (as an example) halving the Win7 boot time would be that it might render the Splashtop stuff a bit redundant. Especially if there's a way found to increase the speed of the DHCP client lease acquisition, which seems to count for a good slice of the "sitting around doing nothing" time after the password's been supplied.

I think, like many here, I'm hoping that MS do a public beta programme, in which case I'll be very interested to get my hands on this new OS revision.

[kalniel]

I was more thinking of providing a new way for malicious applications can hide themselves from security scanning software. By activating just prior to the kernel hibernating and then activating their payload as it comes back of hibernation I could see potential vectors.

I see what you mean, though I'm not sure it'd be any different to current hibernation - drivers and AV should initialise before the user session where currently running programs would initiate, then it's the normal case of having to clean the hibernation image. So yes, I guess it could prove a risk to stability - I don't know if AVs can selectively clean parts of an image.

[Hicks12]

well you would have hoped MS know about any potential threats and have already got them sorted, obviously windows has never been known for being amazing when it comes to threats but i think windows has been very secure so this issue shouldn't appear.

The boot time on that laptop looked insane... id love to have it boot that fast! I hope Microsoft do another beta as i think it really helped with windows 7, also hope its on the MSDNAA thing for universities that pay for it as i can use it nice to get a free upgrade to w8 haha

[TheAnimus]

Roomer has the RTM being late spring next year, so they might well make a public beta, but probably shorter duration than last time. Apparently people will still get 6 months to make sure their stuff works before it gets released to the masses.

[tigertop1]

As one of the great unwashed in Microsoft's view of the world I shall be humbly grateful for even 6 months with a Beta before I decide whether to line their coffers.

[Phage]

Thread revival time !
Just to let you know that the hibernation/warm boot is a spawn of the devil. I went from a cold boot time of ~25secs to >3mins. Turn the feature off and normality is restored. WTH Redmond ?
(Yes, I also updated the BIOS and all drivers since you ask)

[Jonatron]

Thread revival time !
Just to let you know that the hibernation/warm boot is a spawn of the devil. I went from a cold boot time of ~25secs to >3mins. Turn the feature off and normality is restored. WTH Redmond ?
(Yes, I also updated the BIOS and all drivers since you ask)

How much RAM do you have?