How to leave 3.

[Darryld1]

Hi folks,

I have given 30 days notice to 3 in July. they offered me a PAC code (please note the subtle difference between 'requesting' and 'being offered'). They offered it to me on the basis that IF I did not use it within 30 days, that it would expire.

as it turned out, 3 considered the acceptance of a PAC code as a reason to ignore the 30 days notice I had already given them and continued to provide me with a service which I did not want.

i repeatedly told them that I did not want to receive a service from them and they ignored me for about 3 months.

i cancelled my DD with my bank and was refunded.
i contacted OFCOM who were shocked though they had heard of 3 behaving like this
i continued to call 3 customer services and repeated myself over and over
i repeatedly requested to speak to a manager and couldn't
i was repeatedly told the same thing by 3, that if i didn't use the PAC code, that 3 woud assume that i still wanted a service regardless of continually telling them that i didn't.
PAC codes are NOT mentioned anywhere in 3's or Orange's terms and conditions so how can they state that by not using one, they can assume that i still want a service from them even though i say otherwise?

I would like to assume that i have done everything i could have but incase i haven't, if you have any other suggestions please let me know.

many thanks.

[Mithrandir]

Try contacting otelo.

[shadowmaster]

Just use the pac code on some free pay as you go sim card. That should shut them up. Once the number has been transferred your 3 account will automatically close.

Its a bit long, but I find its the only proper way to cancel a contract, without being charged for another month.

[mightymouse]

yep i second that, so long as you dont port it to another network or send them an official letter to give them a 30 days notice then you will still be charged. it will still be better to port it, the day you port it is the day the contract is cancelled

[Darryld1]

Thanks for the replies folks. I hope my experience is helping someone - that's why i'm being so detailed. Remember that i also have a life to get on with, so i'm spending some of it with the intention of helping someone. Some of this might be obvious to you and some of it not. Take what you need. You are helping me too, so big Thanks.

Okay so there is no mention of PAC codes in 3's or Orange's T&C's yet they both imply verbally and in writing that PAC codes overide 30 days notice and any other requests by a customer to cancel a contract. I don't mean cancel mid-term, I mean 30 days notice, 30 days before the minimum term of that contract is due to end.

How many people appreciate what 'minimum term' actually means? It certainly isn't explained when we sign contracts and we hope that we'll never have to deal with such things - though so often we actually do! it means that you have entered an open agreement with them to provide a service until you give them notice to stop providing that service as per their T&C's. In my case, I gave them notice several times a week for 3 months and still they did not stop providing that service. They could have suspended the service pending further investigation but all they did was argue the toss. They could have stopped at any time. That is a FAILURE on their part.

Then a false assumption is made by 3. This is that is a PAC code (which is offered and not requested - please make sure you make a distinction about that ie you did not 'request' a PAC, you were 'offered' one and accepted it on certain terms) is a sign that if it is not used within 30 days, it will not only expire (this is the bit they don't tell you) but they will take it as a sign that you still want a contract even if you say you don't when you receive another bill from them. What then happens is that you are then expected to give another 30 day's notice. This is not what PAC codes are intended for. A PAC is only a transfer of a number and should not be linked in any way to contractual terms and conditions to do with contract termination.

I spoke again to OFCOM today who again stated that PAC codes are not to be used in the way 3 are using them.(as detailed above)

I also spoke to OTELO today who said the same. (ditto)

Tomorrow I will inform Trading Standards and CAB.

My attitude has always been this: as 3 chose to provide me with a service, despite me giving 30 days notice and afterwards continually requesting they do not supply one, that they are responsible for doing so. If they choose not to act on my request, that is their choice. It's slightly different from saying that I accepted that just because they texted me a PAC twice, that I tacitly accepted the terms of them doing so. Again, a PAC is ONLY a transfer of number and nothing else. Any inference made or drawn from offering and supplying one, is false!

3 debt recovery dept. called me again today to ask how I inteded to pay. 3 really are totally ignorant of it's customer's requests and their own processes. It's like trying to argue with a machine which is not programmed to accept anything other than it's programmed response. Purposely designed to be difficult and to cause such situations. This is an example of how far removed 3 are from their own processes and I will use this as an example of how they FAIL. I have already been contacted by 3 executive office who offered me first "a credit of £40 to my account" then "a credit of £50 to my account". Which account? What sort of 'credit'? Isn't this 'offer' acceptance that they are wrong? I take it that way and I am inferring that this is bribery to get me to accept part of the blame. No chance! This is already costing them more than they could ever hope to receive.

I have requested my original contract, not a photocopy. I would love to be a fly on the wall of whoever gets to read my letter as it's a real stinker!

I have requested a copy of their T&C's which state anything to do with PAC codes. They will not be able to provide this and I believe they have not offered to in the hope I won't ask for it. Wrong!

I have requested all recordings and transcriptions of all phone conversations (i doubt they recorded any), especially the call during which they offered me a PAC code and didn't explain the implications they give to it not being used. They will not be able to provide this because they did not explain this to me at the time they offered me a PAC. What they say they did do was text me twice and at the end it said something like, if I don't use the PAC, that I should contact them. Why would I do that? So they could try to talk me out of leaving 3? I had already stated that I was leaving 3 when they transferred me to another team in customer services who tried and FAILED (I used that word a lot in my letter to them) to convince me to stay.

i'll be sure to keep you all upto date. If you have any questions, please feel free to ask.

[Mithrandir]

Thanks for the useful info. I'm planning to cancel my 3 contract when the contract period runs out. Looks like I might run into some problems.

[Hermann]

When I got to the end of my three contract I called and gave my 30 day notice. I also asked for my Contract No to converted to PAYG. This meant there was no PAC involved but I would keep my No.

On the last day of my notice three offered me a renewal of 500mins/100txts and an LG Viewty phone for £5 a month for life, so I took that!

So when giving your notice don't bother with a pac just ask to go to PAYG.

You can always get a pac once your on payg to transfer the No to where you want.

[dave87]

The reason they maintain your account and continue billing you until the PAC code is used is to allow you to port your number to another network without interruption of service.

However that doesn't explain their reluctance to cancel your contract...

[huftda]

A friend of mine used to work for Vodafone, he always used to say to me:

"Whenever you cancel your contract you should write to the company, having a duplicate copy of the cancellation letter and send it recorded delivery."

That way you can prove you have canecelled the contractfrom the recorded date (30 Days). If the Company won't help anymore then make a complaint to Ofcom.

[Ramedge]

I have just ported my number over to t-mobile ( as a mate works for them so I get a friends and family half price deal ) It went through today and now after reading this thread I am a bit worried.

Should I now make sure my 3 direct debits are canceled? My Pac code has been used and I am on t-mobile as of today.

They have been hard work since day one. Ofcom and Otelo have been no help to me either. I was miss sold the contract by the network
I don't want them taking any more money from my account. What should I do? I think they are expecting to take another payment out.

[Darryld1]

You have used your PAC code, which mobile phone service providers are abusing by stating that it is recognised as a way of ending a contract or they assume that if you don't use it once it has been issued, that you actually want to stay with them!

A PAC CODE IS ONLY SUPPOSED TO BE USED TO TRANSFER A NUMBER, NOT TO CANCEL A CONTRACT OR ANYTHING ELSE! PAC CODES ARE NOT MENTIONED IN ANY SMALL PRINT, TERMS AND CONDITIONS OR CONTRACTUAL AGREEMENTS.

My advice is that you also cancel your direct debit because if they reinstate it without your consent, as they did with me, you'll end up having to get our money back by negotiating their purposely irritating and annoyingly endless layers of what they call Customer Services and you won't get anywhere! It's designed in such a way that you are not supposed to be able to get anywhere and so you'll give up - as any reasonable person would.

If you don't use your PAC code to take your old number with you, which by law you are entitled to use it or not and it shouldn't affect your contract termination in any way - read the small print and you won't find any mention of PAC codes for this reason - you must give notice that you wish to end your contract.

1. give notice
2. cancel your direct debit
3. put it all in writing to them.
4. DO NOT accept any 'offers' or 'helpful suggestions' such as 'upgrading' ie taking out a new contract.
5. Do not enter into any discussion at any time. Simply cancel and leave.
6. an 'upgrade' is a NEW contract and nothing of any benefit to you which you couldn't get anywhere else.
7. shop around and get everything in writing.

[Darryld1]

After receiving a standard threatening letter from 3 stating that if I do not pay them within 7 days, they would place the matter - which is of their own making - into the hands of a debt collection agency, I again called OFCOM and OTELO. 3 tried to call me yesterday but I missed the call. When I called them back, I was immediately sent in the direction of their totally useless 'Customer Services'. I hung up before the automated nonsense had finished as I don't have to wait for them to sort their lives out enough to call me in person to sort this out - I don't have to continue to repeat my details and ID to yet another numbskull Customer Services pillock who cannot do anything about what i'm telling them.
3 have totally ignored anything I have ever done over the last 5 months to sort this out and now they have 4 days in which to sort it all out to my satisfaction or i take them to court.
As advised by OTELO and Consumer Direct (trading standards) I have given 3 seven days notice to provide me with a copy of my original contract in which it is NOT stated that PAC codes are a legal means to terminate or continue a contract.

PAC CODES ARE NOT MENTIONED IN ANY TERMS AND CONDITIONS THEREFORE THEY ARE BEING USED ILLEGALLY!

watch this space...

[Darryld1]

Yet another call from the automated dialler from 3's call centre to discuss how i'm going to pay for their massive cock-up.
That'll be yet another call after the last several calls from them during which I was told on each occasion that they would not call me again.
This is harrassment and i'm going to report their 0845 number to BT and have that number blocked.

I am disgusted that 3 still expect me to explain myself to yet another person who doesn't know my story. Do they expect me to explain it to the whole company before they actually DO something about this nonsense?

Useless, incompetant, ignorant, time-wasting, law-breaking, pillocks! They now have 4 days to respond to my second request for a copy of my original contract - the one I allegedly signed which allegedly stated that I accept that PAC codes can be used by 3 to terminate contracts even though doing so would be a breach of contract law by them. Talk about chasing their own tails. The fools are causing this simple matter to become a very expensive waste of time for them and me. Thing is, I have already won - I just have to get them to agree to their mistake in writing and IN COURT!

[Darryld1]

What a suprise, again no written confirmation of receipt of my letter in which I gave them 7 days notice....but another call from 3 exec office. This time "as a goodwill gesture and to bring the issue to a speedy conclusion" they're going to zero my balance.
No recognition of the 5 1/2 months of hassle from them. No recognition of any of the questions I have asked about PAC codes, terms and conditions or anything else. No offer of compensation. No written reply to any of the questions I requested answers for. No original copy of my contract.
I told them that I will consider their offer hen they put everything in writing. They tried to get me to settle over the phone bu tI insisted that they put it all in writing..... and they have precisely until close of business to do just that.
Useless, incompetant, ignorant, time-wasting, contract law-breaking, pillocks!

If I was so wrong, why would they want to zero my balance one day before the cut-off?

[mightymouse]

I have just ported my number over to t-mobile ( as a mate works for them so I get a friends and family half price deal ) It went through today and now after reading this thread I am a bit worried.

Should I now make sure my 3 direct debits are canceled? My Pac code has been used and I am on t-mobile as of today.

They have been hard work since day one. Ofcom and Otelo have been no help to me either. I was miss sold the contract by the network
I don't want them taking any more money from my account. What should I do? I think they are expecting to take another payment out.

usually once you port your number over to another network your account closes automatically. at least that was what happened to both my 3 lines, 2xo2 and 1xvoda. but i would still cancel the DD after they have collected the final payment

[Darryld1]

You're probably okay even though 3 are a bunch of desparate cowboys who also happen to own a mobile network. Definitely cancel your direct debit! Definitely do not expect 3 to behave appropriately - just take a little time to read some of the postings about other people's experiences. 3 will do anything they possibly can to cause as much trouble as they can IF you give them the chance to do so.
DO NOT enter into any discussion with 3 about your opinions about their service, other services they provide or anything at all for that matter as 3 will take whatever you say to mean that you might still want to be a 3 customer, so they'll provide you with a service you didn't ask for - at least that is the experience of the majority of people who I know.
Infact, you'd do them a favour by complaining to them about how worried you are that they'll rob you blind at the first chance they have.