Petrol Pump Daylight Robbery

[Fraz]

Ok... so my car's petrol tank holds ~40 litres of fuel. I've had it for about 6 years now, and until about a year ago, never once have I managed to get more than about ~40 litres of fuel into it at the pumps in a single go - even if it was at the bottom of the red on the gauge.

But what's this? Recently I'm managing to fit ~43 litres, or even ~45 litres of fuel into my car! Well, according to what I'm seeing on the pumps.

Since I'm certain that my petrol tank hasn't been slowly growing in size over the last 6 years, I'm pretty sure that there are just a lot of garages out there at the moment with what might be termed "advantageously" calibrated pumps.

Anyone else experiencing this recently? Is there an official way to complain? I'm getting pretty sick of paying £1.10 for only 0.9 litres of fuel.

[Allen]

I've always pondered this whilst filling up... how do you know how much you're actually getting??

Do you always use the same petrol station? Do you stick to the "big" brands, if you like? I'm sure it would be much harder for the likes of Tesco's for example to not give an accurate amount.

[Stringent]

Thats interesting. To be honest I never counted the amount I put in, I just put in cash value, so I go in with a view "I am going to put £30 in" or "I need to fill up" never paid attention to how much was actually going in.

[Gr44]

I have a 56 Litre tank apprantly and I've never put more than 52L in

[Fraz]

I've mainly encountered it at a couple of more dubious independent (or not big name, at least) petrol stations, although I'm sure the worst offender I've ever had (which was WAAAY over what I've ever managed to put in before) was the Esso on Hotwells Road in Bristol. I remember it in particular because it was the first time I ever paid over £50 for a full tank of fuel, and really couldn't understand why.

[GoNz0]

they get random inspections to check for things like this, phone up and report em !

[peterb]

It falls within the remit of trading standards, and they do and check pump calibration at regular (but random) intervals.

This link is from the Hampshire TS and includes a comment about petrol pump calibration. Other areas will have their own trading standards (Weights and measures) organisations.

http://www.hants.gov.uk/regulatory/t...libration.html

[daniel_owen_uk]

Take a petrol can, fill it to the line and see what the pump is saying?

[Stringent]

As with anything, there are always going to be 'bad apples' around trying to swindle you out of your money. Stay away from far in-the-middle-of-nowhere garages, also because you have no idea how long since they last filled up!

[kalniel]

My MPG seems to be going up, determined by topping up at pumps, so maybe pumps are getting more generous too

What car is it Fraz?

[Saracen]

It falls within the remit of trading standards, and they do and check pump calibration at regular (but random) intervals.

This link is from the Hampshire TS and includes a comment about petrol pump calibration. Other areas will have their own trading standards (Weights and measures) organisations.

http://www.hants.gov.uk/regulatory/t...libration.html

Quite right. There might be a few obscure exceptions, but I can't think of them offhand, to the general rule that anything that is sold to the public "loose", either by weight or volume, is controlled by Metrology legislation and one of the authorised bodies for overseeing that is indeed Trading Standards.

There are some highly detailed processes and test procedures designed to ensure that traders can't tamper with calibration, or at least, not without removing seals (often wire and lead) that protect the calibration switches. And the tools you need to replace the seals aren't publicly available, for obvious reasons.

For instance, if you measure something by weight, be it milligrams of a pharmaceutical in a drug lab, or loose potatoes in a supermarket, or a lorry on a roadside weighbridge, the principle behind the calibration on those weighing devices is exactly the same. The implementation, in terms of the points in the range of the scales at which you test and the size of the permissible error vary, but the principles don't.

And Peter is dead right, those devices are periodically tested for compliance with the legislation. They'll be calibrated and sealed when installed, and periodically checked either by TS or by another body operating on their behalf. If the seal is not intact, they're illegal to operate period. Traders can check those seals, and if one has become damaged during normal use, they should take the scale out of operation and get it verified and resealed. If they get a random TS visit, and they're trading on a scale without an intact seal, they at the least risk prosecution, and it's very likely to happen if the sale is operating out of tolerance as well, especially if the consumer is getting short-changed.

All the above I'm sure of, because I'm one of the people trained and authorised by TS to do the verification of retail scales (or rather, scanner/scales) to ensure compliance with legal tolerances, and I've lost track of how many I've run both calibration and verification tests of, but it's a LOT.

I don't have anything to do with petrol pumps, or any other sale by volume, but as I understand it, the same principles and basic regulations apply as do by weight.

So I also agree with Peter on this - refer it to Trading Standards. That people are committing an offence by fiddling with calibration doesn't mean they don't risk it and do it. If TS get reports, odds are they'll do a random check at some point, and are certainly likely to if they get several such reports. And if they do a check, either the pumps will be verified as within tolerances (and pretty small ones at that), in which case there's no problem, or they won't be, in which case they'll be taken out of service until such times as they are in tolerance, and depending on circumstances, maybe a prosecution will follow.





In case anyone's interested, most supermarket scales operate within a range from 100g to around 10Kg to 15Kg, depending on model. When we calibrate, we're using trim weights of 0.5g to check the precise point at which the scale detects a change in weight, using known, accurate, calibrated and regularly certified control weights, at a range of test points from 100g right up to the scale's maximum weight. On such a scale, the Maximum Permissible Error (MPE) at, say, 15Kg is 1.5e and, for a scale in that class, "e" is 0.0005Kg, i.e. MPE at 15Kg is 7.5g.

If you buy a measures 15Kg of, say, loose potatoes, and you're not getting within 7.5g of that, the scale is outside permitted tolerance and would be illegal to trade on. As I say, it's a pretty tight tolerance. And lower down the weight range, while e doesn't change, the permitted multiplier does, so at 1Kg weight, you're within a 2.5g tolerance.

I can only assume the verification of delivery by volume of fluid works in much the same way.

[Konan555]

As a side note here. One of the reasons to switch off ones mobile was that they reportedly interfere with some of the pump metering electronics. I'm not entirely convinced myself as, but it's a lot more plausible than starting fires.

[MadduckUK]

As a side note here. One of the reasons to switch off ones mobile was that they reportedly interfere with some of the pump metering electronics. I'm not entirely convinced myself as, but it's a lot more plausible than starting fires.

dont petrol stations put mobile masts in the price bord tower things? anyways..

im sure there is a pump at the BP garage nearest to me that dishes out quite a lot less than it should, then again i don't tend to go unless im desperate as its super expensive and the premium is only 97

[Konan555]

dont petrol stations put mobile masts in the price bord tower things? anyways..

They do, but the signal from one of those won't be as strong as a phone right next to something.

[finlay666]

As a side note here. One of the reasons to switch off ones mobile was that they reportedly interfere with some of the pump metering electronics. I'm not entirely convinced myself as, but it's a lot more plausible than starting fires.

Mythbusters showed the mobile myth is rubbish for fires, it wouldn't interfere anyway, (they dont interfere with planes for instance... the plane gives off more interference than the phone) it's more repeatedly getting in/out of your car is more dangerous due to the static build up which can cause ignition if you dont ground yourself before going near the nozzle

[abaxas]

I dont think we need to worry about this.
Dodgy petrol is far more common and costly :<