Question about the road traffic act 1988

[G4Z]

ok here is a question for you guys,

My dad has a car registered to him that my sister drives. She has been caught speeding (80 mph in a motorway roadworks area witha 50 limit... dozey bitch)

Anyway, the ticket has come to him and he has provided her name but he does not want to sign the form because they cannot process it. Now section 172 covers this and I have pasted it below, The police have returned the ticket and want him to sign it but the act doesnt actually state anywhere that you have to sign it. What do you guys think, is it Illegal to provide the name and address of the driver but not sign the form?


172.?(1) This section applies?
(a) to any offence under the preceding provisions of this Act except?
(i) an offence under Part V, or
(ii) an offence under section 13, 16, 51(2), 61(4), 67(9), 68(4), 96 or 117,
and to an offence under section 178 of this Act,
(b) to any offence under sections 25, 26, 27 and 45 of the [1988 c. 53.] Road Traffic Offenders Act 1988, and
(c) to any offence against any other enactment relating to the use of vehicles on roads.
(2) Where the driver of a vehicle is alleged to be guilty of an offence to which this section applies?
(a) the person keeping the vehicle shall give such information as to the identity of the driver as he may be required to give by or on behalf of a chief officer of police, and
(b) any other person shall if required as stated above give any information which it is in his power to give and may lead to identification of the driver.
In this subsection references to the driver of a vehicle include references to the person riding a cycle.

(3) A person who fails to comply with the requirement of subsection (2)(a) above is guilty of an offence unless he shows to the satisfaction of the court that he did not know and could not with reasonable diligence have ascertained who the driver of the vehicle or, as the case may be, the rider of the cycle was.

(4) A person who fails to comply with the requirement of subsection (2)(b) above is guilty of an offence.


http://www.hmso.gov.uk/acts/acts1988..._8.htm#mdiv172

[TiG]

G4z, i'd say you would be best off getting this looked at by a lawyer, as far as i'm concerned the police can turn the screws if they see fit... They might find some other section that counter acts this - best to get proper legal advice..

TiG

[G4Z]

I would agree yeah, but maybe there are some legal beagles on this here, anyone?

[Zathras]

http://www.lawontheweb.co.uk/crimertosign.htm

It suggests your father should sign, and that your sister can be prosecuted anyway based on the evidence your father has given, even if it hasn't been signed. Your sister should take the points like a (wo)man. IMHO People playing silly beggars and trying to get off on technicalities when clearly in the wrong is detrimental to those who do have a case for either harrasment or unfair treatment by the police WRT speeding and also sites campaigning against speed cameras would get more support from reasonable people if they didn't trumpet how 'clever' they think they are by getting off blatant speeding offenses by technicalities
.
Some more links

http://www.pepipoo.com/FAQ.htm

[[GSV]Trig]

If she was speeding then she should take the rap.
If your dad doesnt sign it and give her details he'll get the points/fine.
By signing it it doesnt mean that he'll get away with it.

[G4Z]

well, Like I said she is a dosey bitch tbfh.

Problem is she is gonna lose her license for this one I reckon, i have already told my dad the same thing, my interpretation was that not signing it would basicly mean you had not provided a statement and you can be prosecuted for it.

Thanks for the input lads.

[TeePee]

Based on the guidelines she's looking at 6 points, 14-56 days disqualification and a fine of up to £2,500. Since this took place in roadworks the majistrates are likely to take a very dim view. Let us know what she gets..

[Vimeous]

TeePee, as she was travelling at 30+mph over the legal limit at that point on the road it would be classified as 12points and a licence removal as G4Z suggests unless someone went and altered the rules. Hence why you often see a 95mph queue on motorways and not a 100mph one

Very occasionally there are advisory limits applied to roadworks (though where peeps are working it's unlikely), so if she's going to be heinously lucky she'd get done for ignoring the advice and being over the regular limit. It depends on the shape of the signing at the roadside.

[Punky]

i thought that if you said you couldn't remember who was driving at the time, you don't have to pay the fine? was she done by a camera or a copper? if its the camera, you should be able to blag it. if it was a copper, then she's in the poop.
peace

[Lead_Head]

Their used to be a loophole whereby if you sent back the NIP without a signiture then they couldnt prosecute you because it isnt a legal document if it isn't signed. Dwight Yorke the footballer got away with it this way. This loophole has since been closed.

Neil Hamilton got away with a speeding ticket by saying he didnt know who was driving the car at the time. So they couldnt put it on one persons license.

If you really want to get away with it, and theirs more than one person on the insurance of the car, you can say this, but I'd strongly advise against it, just take the punishment, and be done with it.

80mph in a 50mph roadworks, like you say, is a tad silly, I'd say it will be a 2 month ban + costs / fine.

[TeePee]

http://www.pepipoo.com/Magistrates_guidelines.htm

I guess someone went and altered the rules.

[[GSV]Trig]

Not signing it now means it goes on the registered drivers licence IIRC...

[XTR]

Not signing it now means it goes on the registered drivers licence IIRC...

they cant do this..........