Gaza aid flotilla to set sail

[aidanjt]

Yeah, the peace activists with weapons attacking soldiers.

[neonplanet40]

Or soldiers shooting civilians 4 times in the head. O wait that didn't happen . . . . .

[TooNice]

Well, looks like the Israelis are having a bit of fun with the whole situation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOGG_osOoVg
[Frankly speaking, I doubt that either sides are squeaky clean. Just because some activists were shown to be violent, it doesn't mean the most of the convoy were, nor does it mean that everyone shot were]

[TooNice]

Well, looks like the Israelis are having a bit of fun with the whole situation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOGG_osOoVg
[Frankly speaking, I doubt that either sides are squeaky clean. Just because some activists were shown to be violent, it doesn't mean the most of the convoy were, nor does it mean that everyone shot were]

[aidanjt]

Well, looks like the Israelis are having a bit of fun with the whole situation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOGG_osOoVg

Yeah, saw that yesterday, had a bit of a giggle from it.

I doubt that either sides are squeaky clean.

Agreed.

[pp05]

Well, looks like the Israelis are having a bit of fun with the whole situation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOGG_osOoVg
[Frankly speaking, I doubt that either sides are squeaky clean. Just because some activists were shown to be violent, it doesn't mean the most of the convoy were, nor does it mean that everyone shot were]

I've been in touch with someone who was on the boat.

Most of the wounds were bullet wounds. 9 died. Many others injured.

There were men who also had wife and grown up kids with them. Some of them did resist and rightly so. I'm not sure what else one is expected to do given the situation.

Turkish media has shown images of israeli soldiers that were captured but not harmed. They have shown their humanitarian side. Quite frankly they had every right to hurt them.

For the Israeli's this is a PR disaster. If people didn't have contempt for them before, many will now. To fire shots at peace activists is dispicable.

What gets my goat is that all of a sudden all the politicians are up in arms acting like this blockade started 2 weeks ago. This has been going on for over 2 years and now it's not right?

Secondly, all the press coverage has been Israel dominated. Never have we seen or heard from the free gaza movement. They dont even command a paragragh in our papers, 30 seconds of air time. If it was not for them, we would not have got this wake up call. It was brave by the activists to follow their convictions and board that boat.

[aidanjt]

Now *this* is interesting.

[Disturbedguy]

At least try to hide your blatant anti-Israeli bias. But please, do carry on ignoring 1st hand video evidence in favour of exaggerated and out-right dishonest claims. That'll make you more rational and objective.

You mean like you constant pro Israeli bias? Works both ways.

[aidanjt]

Some of them did resist and rightly so. I'm not sure what else one is expected to do given the situation.

Not have people bitch and moan when you're issued with a darwin award for assaulting a soldier.

For the Israeli's this is a PR disaster. If people didn't have contempt for them before, many will now. To fire shots at peace activists is dispicable.

Again, 'peace' activists with weapons attempting to murder soldiers.

Remember, these people were intent in running on a blockade, a militarily HOSTILE act, that gave the Israeli naval forces the authority to SINK any ships attempting to breach the blockade. They didn't, instead they boarded the ships to bring it to an actually functional port, for the supplies to be checked and taken to Gaza on the road. And there, or Eygpt, is where they should have went to from the start.

You don't run a blockade unless you want to get people killed.

What gets my goat is that all of a sudden all the politicians are up in arms acting like this blockade started 2 weeks ago. This has been going on for over 2 years and now it's not right?

Welcome to politics. People don't give a crap by default. The flotilla 'outrage' is nothing more than moral panic brought about by exaggerated and dishonest claims, which will fade away within a few weeks.

[aidanjt]

You mean like you constant pro Israeli bias? Works both ways.

Nope, I'm looking at the situation objectively. Neither party is 'in the right', I support neither party, I have no vested interest in either party 'being right' or 'winning', and the entire middle-east could be turned into giant field of glass craters and I still wouldn't give a crap.

[Disturbedguy]

Nope, I'm looking at the situation objectively. Neither party is 'in the right', I support neither party, I have no vested interest in either party 'being right' or 'winning', and the entire middle-east could be turned into giant field of glass craters and I still wouldn't give a crap.

Right...this coming from the person that gave out the "Everybody hates Jews" card...

[TooNice]

Some of them did resist and rightly so. I'm not sure what else one is expected to do given the situation.

For a start, the right thing is not always the smart thing. Someone demands your wallet at gunpoint, the right thing might to tell him to sod off and or try to disarm him, but I would imagine that it is also more likely to get you shot. It is a fine line between dying for your conviction and poor judgement.

I am willing to give the content and purpose of the flotilla the benefit of doubt, but the game was up the second the IDF tried to board the ship. For an aid vessel, there are two choices: 1. Attack the soldiers, and risk getting yourself killed, and the people who did not sign up to die killed. Or 2, Do what the Rachel Corrie crew did. For an aid worker, which one do you think is more beneficial? Either way, the boat will be taken over and every aid worker killed is one less who won't be able to do another trip. Frankly speaking, 1. wouldn't even register as a option to me if it wasn't for the fact that it happened or if the convoy was politically motivated.

That's unless each and everyone is ready to die for the cause and/or you have the muscle (arms) to break the blockade military. But then, it would no longer be an aid ship.

[aidanjt]

Right...this coming from the person that gave out the "Everybody hates Jews" card...

Strawman, nowhere did I say "Everybody hates Jews", don't misquote me.

[Disturbedguy]

Strawman, nowhere did I say "Everybody hates Jews", don't misquote me.

You came out with the card that jews are hated etc a few pages ago.

The fact is, the ships shouldnt have been boarded in International waters, they could have waited until they were in Israeli waters, dropping in armed with sub machine guns isnt going to make people react kindly tbh, it will more than likely scare them, of course they are going to fight back, all it would have taken is one person fight back then the rest would have followed.

[aidanjt]

You came out with the card that jews are hated etc a few pages ago.

I still didn't make that statement. Don't misquote me. If you need to refresh your memory reread through the thread, tyvm.

The fact is, the ships shouldnt have been boarded in International waters, they could have waited until they were in Israeli waters, dropping in armed with sub machine guns isnt going to make people react kindly tbh, it will more than likely scare them, of course they are going to fight back, all it would have taken is one person fight back then the rest would have followed.

a) Israel didn't sign up to the law of the sea, they're not bound by that treaty.
b) Whether they boarded the ship in international waters or off the Gazan coast is irrelevant, arbitrary waffle, people still would have been killed for trying to murder the boarding party irrespective of *where* it was boarded.

[Kata]

I tend to believe the peace activists

I think a "LOL" is in order if you believe anything they have to say. Dodgy NGOs like the ones on the ship that refused to turn back really are the scum of the earth.

ISTANBUL—The Islamic charity that was a key organizer of a flotilla intercepted by Israeli commandos this week claimed martyrdom and victory Thursday, in scenes that appeared to set it apart from other aid groups.

The fact that all the dead belonged to the IHH, and that the group's ship was the only one in the convoy that chose to fight rather than offer passive resistance, has further focused attention on whether the group's motives were simply to provide aid to residents of the blockaded Gaza Strip.

"I am begging you, set sail another ship," said Filiz Mete, the sister of one of the dead, at her brother's funeral service Thursday. She and her children wanted to "go the same way" as her brother, as martyrs, she said.

So they're starting to sound like just another load of Islamic nutters who got exactly what they wanted. At least they decided to go up against people who could fight back instead of blowing themselves up amongst women and children in marketplaces, like they usually do...