The Dutch are really clamping down on weed

[abaxas]

Super strength weed is just like drinking spirits.

If you down 1/2 pint of vodka, you are not going to be very well. Both emotionally and physically.

[TheAnimus]

Except that it can take much longer for THC and its metabolites to be excreted from the body than alcohol.

Observation leads me to conclude it might not nesicerrily be an issue. I've never seen someone sober up on alcohol half as fast as someone has on weed.

That said I could often tell some of my school kids who'd had a fair bit of weed, normally two days before (they were usually honest with me) because they would not have their normal attention span.....

But that is the longest drawn out effect I can think of, its tenous at best, then we can look at something like this:

So it clears from the brain quite quickly.

[Larkspeed]

Undoubtledly just the usual thin end of the wedge measures from the Dutch old-fogey brigade. They rarely outright ban something - just chisel away at rights.

I live in the Netherlands and I hate to burst your bubble but they are planning an all out ban.

If plans go ahead starting next year the only people who will be able to purchase weed from coffee shops are those that can prove they live in The Netherlands.

In other words tourists will no longer be able to legally smoke weed here.

Now this is intresting, I would like to know the drivers for doing this as I'm sure its going to cost a lot of the cafes a lot of money.

Actually no all that will happen is they will sell more of the weaker variants so the money will be made up elsewhere.

As for the reasons behind it there is a lot of damage caused in this country by tourists on drugs and this is what they are trying to stop.

[TheAnimus]

In other words tourists will no longer be able to legally smoke weed here.

Being a pedant, surely its they can't buy, as is my understanding of the decriminalisation its currently illegal for them to smoke it technically.

Actually no all that will happen is they will sell more of the weaker variants so the money will be made up elsewhere.

Doubt it, the cost of differentiating between the strains is quite high I'd imagine. But then again I'm anti-big government so I hear something like this I see red tape squeezing small businesses out of business.

As for the reasons behind it there is a lot of damage caused in this country by tourists on drugs and this is what they are trying to stop.

That is true, I feel sorry for Amsterdamn in a way because they get such a large amount of the worst of Brits going over there Thing is I'd say its more the booze and hookers that start their bad behaviour!

Personally I like Utrecht, because its not full of these types....

[Larkspeed]

Being a pedant, surely its they can't buy, as is my understanding of the decriminalisation its currently illegal for them to smoke it technically.

--- True but since it is illegal to smoke it in public and you can't go to coffee shops, unless you are actually smoking it at someone's house you would be breaking the law.

Doubt it, the cost of differentiating between the strains is quite high I'd imagine. But then again I'm anti-big government so I hear something like this I see red tape squeezing small businesses out of business.

--- The strength can be controlled at growing time on the farms so the only checks would be spot checks to be sure the shops are complying with the new law.

That is true, I feel sorry for Amsterdam in a way because they get such a large amount of the worst of Brits going over there Thing is I'd say its more the booze and hookers that start their bad behaviour!

Personally I like Utrecht, because its not full of these types....

--- We live very North so we do not get it so much here. Being a brit myself I am sometimes embarrassed when we go to places like Amsterdam and Rotterdam and see the brits there making complete fools of themselves

[0iD]

In much the same way alcohol can provide an escape for those who are, I don't want to say weak, or predisposed, but have something, which allows them to become entranced.

In much the same way that opium isn't a problem for so many people, but for some it really is.

Absolutely. I am not against it, and to be honest I think alcohol and tobacco are just as dangerous in the long term, it's more about social acceptability, imo.

[Rave]

Super strength weed is just like drinking spirits.

If you down 1/2 pint of vodka, you are not going to be very well. Both emotionally and physically.

Personally I would be feeling absolutely brilliant if I'd just downed half a pint of Vodka- half a pint being 284ml or 11 1/2 single shots. I'd get into the downward spiral after half a litre.

Abyway....surely the Dutch would be breaking European law if they had a 'one rule for them, one rule for everybody else' approach?

[j1979]

I can talk for hours on the subject of cannabis. With a lot of experience, both as a user, cultivator, breeder and the legal sides. I can openly speak about it now, seen as all convictions have been spent. I won't go into details as I haven't really got the time.

But i will say this, out of all the drugs I have had (including opiates) cannabis, has had, by far the worst effect on my personality/mood/brain. The progression of the effects of THC over time are pretty bad. THC was thought to be the drug that gave the high, and strains at the cannabis cup are now showing up with well over 25% content in the dried bud. It is as far as i am aware no longer thought that THC is what gives the high, but other compounds.

I gave up about 8 years ago now, and in that time i have one had few few tokes on 3 spiffs. And the last 2 times it has ruined me. After years of smoking about an 8th a day, my brain had adjusted to be very receptive to the active ingredients in weed. Although at the time i could smoke more and more cannabis without really feeling it was effecting me. I just felt normal after a smoke. But now 1 toke and if i am not with people i trust 100%, i will become so paranoid, almost to the point of hallucinations.

Having said that, I still think all drugs should be legal and we should not like in a state that enforces prohabition, for 2 reasons.

1. Anyone over the age of 18 should have the right to do what they please, if it does not harm anyone else. (this is difficult to quantify) but should be a basic human right.

2. Prohibition does not work, regulation would be better. After the 2 biggest killer drugs are both legal. An Ecstasy death might make the news, but a i have never seen a liver failure from alcohol on the news unless its someone famous. I think we should legalise all. After all you can by solvents at BNQ and be dead in seconds...not many people die from solvents because the facts are on the can. "can cause death". Maybe if we legalise all and give all the facts then it would make the job of helping people with a drug problem easier. At the moment the government policy of prohibition and flooding the public with half facts with "info" sites like "talk to frank" are frankly laughable.

My point is, I think everyone should have the right to choose given the correct facts, but cannabis should in no way be underestimated.

[mikerr]

I know it'll be an unpopular view here but I'm more and more anti-weed these days especially as users seem totally unaware of how it affects them for a long time - several days afterwards.

I've seen quite a few friends change to be slower - they would say laid back -
on a permanent(*) basis just from casual use (few hits a week).

(*) maybe not permanent if they gave up for a few weeks, who knows

[TheAnimus]

As I'm mostly anti-prohibition (surely that means i'm just hibition?) I kinda wounder now how effective health warning on things are. I don't know a single smoker who isn't in chronic denial about the health warnings on the pack for instance.

As a drinker the biggest warning I've ever seen is the one of a pregnant woman on the bottle, makes me think damn skippy, better remember she is uglier than she appears, and suit up but nothing about the perils of drink.

[Spud1]

Super strength weed is just like drinking spirits.

If you down 1/2 pint of vodka, you are not going to be very well. Both emotionally and physically.

This is the point I wanted to raise - stronger (aka "good") weed is directly equivalent to stronger (40% + ) alcohol - except that weed is MUCH MUCH safer and less addictive.

I've no problem with regulation of the better weed, so long as the rule is applied fairly and consistently across the board. The problem is that it won't be of course, they will single out one drug (despite the fact that all studies show it to be safer than most legal drugs) and apply a policy like this.

The biggest issue though is that this will pose a greater health risk to anyone smoking it now - you either smoke 1 joint of good weed and get very high, or smoke 3 joints of average weed to achieve the same level..that really isn't good for your lungs.

So I can't really see a health case here..as has been mentioned it's the traditional anti drugs brigade in the government slowly chipping away..imo it's fine to keep it legal or make it illegal again - whatever they want..but this kind of half way house idea is just nonsense and doesn't help solve the issues around legalisation one bit.

edit: for a bit of context (and to answer Mikerr's point) , I was a heavy cannabis smoker for nearly 3 years, and during that time I smoked some of the best you can get (including 99.8% THC stuff called "budder"..the equivalent of everclear), and some of the worst..pretty much 1/8th a day. During that time I graduated from uni (1st class honours), and ran a successful business (which only went under a year after I stopped smoking..go figure!). I can say that during that time I was definitely more laid back than ever before - more relaxed and stress free..and yes there were a few bouts of paranoia, which always vanished when i sobered up. Whilst I would never go back to that lifestyle again, I do occasionally still share a few joints with some mates. There have been no long lasting psychological effects from those few years, and I now live a normal life where I don't really smoke, or drink much at all.

[scaryjim]

... the biggest warning I've ever seen is the one of a pregnant woman on the bottle, makes me think damn skippy, better remember she is uglier than she appears, and suit up ...

That just makes me think "stay away from pregnant women whilst drunk"... never been quite sure why though...

Working (indirectly) in the drug field, I have to say I'm strongly in favour of a complete rethink of drug policy in terms of regulation and licensing (it's one of the reasons I applied for my current job, although that's another story entirely). My concept really is pretty simple, too; possession of drugs *isn't* a crime, supply of *any* drug is a crime unless you have a license to supply it. Would it work in practice? God alone knows, but it's got to be better than the current situation ...

[abaxas]

edit: for a bit of context (and to answer Mikerr's point) , I was a heavy cannabis smoker for nearly 3 years, and during that time I smoked some of the best you can get (including 99.8% THC stuff called "budder"..the equivalent of everclear), and some of the worst..pretty much 1/8th a day. During that time I graduated from uni (1st class honours), and ran a successful business (which only went under a year after I stopped smoking..go figure!). I can say that during that time I was definitely more laid back than ever before - more relaxed and stress free..and yes there were a few bouts of paranoia, which always vanished when i sobered up. Whilst I would never go back to that lifestyle again, I do occasionally still share a few joints with some mates. There have been no long lasting psychological effects from those few years, and I now live a normal life where I don't really smoke, or drink much at all.

Interesting point.

Lots of people can drink and be fully emotionally capable with next day effects, while others simply cant. Some people are alcoholics, some eat every day at KFC while others just eat brown rice. Hence it is impossible to extrapolate one person's experience to the rest of the world, we are all different and act differently.

To look at cannabis in another way. Is it more dangerous that having a TV set in your house? If we look at it purely statistically, the TV set is much more emotionally and physically harmful. Just watch some daytime TV and see all the adverts for TV drug users.

[b0redom]

Bet Bill and Ben are bricking it.

[shaithis]

Looks like they are just keeping all the good stuff for themselves.....greedy buggers!