I always cycle as if some people are trying to kill me

[TheAnimus]

But videos like this just make shudder



This was uploaded by the driver apparently... He felt so little was wrong with his actions.

What I can't understand is the whole you shouldn't be on the road attitude, people say this a lot, when I'm in cycle lanes in queue traffic, or getting to the box ahead of the ASL. Would they rather I was in my car? Taking up more space, making more congestion. I also sometimes drive my commute route, almost exactly the same path, I am thankful for those not clogging the road. Sometimes my speed might be limited to say 10mph, but it is preferable to queueing motor vehicles. My bicycle commute is 35min, driving 1.5 hours. I am not slowing anyone down on average.

However, I'll be honest, sometimes I feel like I need to video my trip just for legal reasons. My hit and run was not remotely investigated by the met, because I wasn't injured, the only thing damaged was clothing. I still believe if I hadn't had parachute training, it would have been worse. We see people who commit vehicular manslaughter given suspended sentences, play with your satnav for 10+ seconds, no jail time. Have two pints, jail. I think we really need to start having more respect for the hazards of driving a few tonnes of steel.

[Saracen]

Well, my view is :-

- some car drivers are idiots.
- some cyclists are idiots.
- this is because some people are idiots, and drivers and cyclists are people.

Note - by "cyclist" I include both pedal and motor bikes, because a percentage of both are idiots.

[Dooms]

Indeed the whole car vs mbike vs cyclist argument is very flawed as its always the case of a minority of people ruining for the majority. I've seen drviers & riders do things when commuting that are just plain full on stupid and dangerous.

I don't drive a car but I'm a motorcyclist and bicyclist (currently commuting 20 miles a day on bicycle) and people scare me

[kompukare]

Problem is of course that the idiot with the 1 ton of steel is likely to cause a lot more damage...

But anyway, I think this country is a lost cause as far as quality of life is concerned and it's mostly due to the motor car. 50+ years of making the car king as left huge problem:

Roundabout: Roundabouts have absolutely no place in cities, certainly not in city centres. I know occasionally there might be a traffic light on some exists but if there isn't have you ever watched older people trying to cross near a roundabout? Frightening and none of the drivers stops to let people over; not just because motorists think they are so important that they can't slow down, but even those with manners have long ago learned that if they slow down, the idiot behind them beeps their horn.

Roads: Even on really busy pedestrian areas (like the station), there are no fly-overs or tunnels for the traffic (or for the pedestrians although I always think that it's the cars which should go down into tunnels leaving the surface free). Plenty of cattle gates to herd the pedestrian along though.

City design: I know, Englishman & castle, but the spread out nature of towns would actually make any serious attempt at providing public transport very hard. Ok, not as bad as American towns but compared to northern Europe there really is a large distance between suburbs. I'm really close to the centre of town here yet the house is a ~70m² thing on a huge 450m² site. I know, totally difference patterns of ownership, rental etc. on the continent but it's not like huge sites mean a good quality building; probably the opposite is true.

Zebra crossing: Not a single one in my town (Crawley) outside supermarket parking places. Can't have those important motorists having to slow down.

Traffic lights: Why does do the powers that be give pedestrians 5 seconds to cross and yet give the traffic 2-3 minutes between pressing the button? And recently they've actually reprogrammed all the lights - in favour of the motorists of course!
I've yet to see anyone except power-walkers actually making it across before the light has turned red again. And what's with the metal gating everywhere? Is that the only idea they have here to increase pedestrian safety, by herding people like cattle rather than slowing down those drivers who think they are entitled to drive through town?

The figures for pedestrian road casualties aren't really that bad, but is a lot of that because people are afraid to go out? Do the elderly live in fear of getting hit by cars, or are children ferried everywhere because of the danger of cars in cities? If pedestrian safety is mainly geared to intimidating pedestrians in general and consequently people don't go out that creates other problems too ('dead' cities or instance).

Because motorists scream loudly and because car ownership was an easy 'dream' (nightmare) to sell to voters, for decades the wrong approach has prevailed. Thing is, other countries do not have better quality of (street)life by accident. No quite the opposite: this was something which was planned and money was spent on it.

Hard to believe but in the early 1970s, the Netherlands had worse road traffic fatalities than the UK. Hard work and lobbying changed that. And the best thing about their approach is that a high percentage of road journeys are on motorways. I have no problem with cars being king of the motorways as they are exclusively for motor vehicles, but I have serious problems with letting cars taking over everywhere else.

Anyway, I could go on all day (and almost have!). I think when I get older I will have to go to another country or become boarded up afraid to venture out.

[Domestic_Ginger]

What did the cyclist do wrong?

I didn't think you could ignore red lights at a zebra crossing. A cyclist almost killed me doing that last month.

Where I live the cyclists use the pavements; I'm not sure whether this is to use the shortcuts or they are afraid of traffic. Don't get me wrong but the pedastrians need to be kept out of this.

[The Hand]

It makes me feel a bit ill watching that video. I'm considering getting myself a Montague x50 bike since the traffic is so bad in and around Lincoln and there are a couple of cycle lanes about, but people still drive like they own the road as in, only they are allowed to be on it. I have often wondered if people are disproportionately infected with toxoplasmosis in Lincolnshire as a whole (see the BBC Michael Mosley doc Infested).

[KeyboardDemon]

At the start when the cyclists first appeared on screen I thought, like the driver of the car, "what are they doing?" as for a few moments it was hard to predict what their intentions were, but what followed made no sense to me at all, if I were in the car I would have tried to give the cyclists as much space as possible, which also gives me a safe gap that I could use to overtake them without risking injuries or damage, I certainly would not have started shouting out of the window and don't see why the driver felt it was necessary.

Even if the cyclists had done anything wrong (which I don't think he did), the driver's reaction was way out of proportion to the tiny inconvenience he would have suffered in terms of delays and the only delays I saw in that drive were the ones created by him stopping to shout at the cyclists.

[wasabi]

I'm a driver, motorcyclist and cyclist - and have commuted all 3. Reckon pretty much all the worst stereotypes of all 3 are generally true. Cyclists jump lights, weave erratically and don't put lights on. Motorcyclists speed and do reckless overtakes. Car drivers spend more time Facebooking while looking down, or forcing their way out at junctions by just pulling out into traffic. Or tailgating.

Vicious cycle of bad behaviour that has become socially acceptable. We've become obsessed by speeding and drink driving as the only two road sins. Every other form or selfish reckless inconsiderate impatient bad behaviour seems fair game. Not everywhere all the time thanks goodness, but we're heading that way.

[Moby-Dick]

This is why I like living in Milton Keynes - they have separated vehicular and pedestrian traffic , which more or less works - though I'm told that the redways ( cycle / pedestrian paths ) are not the most friendly on skinny Bradley Wiggins esque wheels - which I would argue are probably not suited to a cycle commute in Milton Keynes anyways.

Problem is of course that the idiot with the 1 ton of steel is likely to cause a lot more damage...

But anyway, I think this country is a lost cause as far as quality of life is concerned and it's mostly due to the motor car. 50+ years of making the car king as left huge problem:

Roundabout: Roundabouts have absolutely no place in cities, certainly not in city centres. I know occasionally there might be a traffic light on some exists but if there isn't have you ever watched older people trying to cross near a roundabout? Frightening and none of the drivers stops to let people over; not just because motorists think they are so important that they can't slow down, but even those with manners have long ago learned that if they slow down, the idiot behind them beeps their horn.

Roads: Even on really busy pedestrian areas (like the station), there are no fly-overs or tunnels for the traffic (or for the pedestrians although I always think that it's the cars which should go down into tunnels leaving the surface free). Plenty of cattle gates to herd the pedestrian along though.

City design: I know, Englishman & castle, but the spread out nature of towns would actually make any serious attempt at providing public transport very hard. Ok, not as bad as American towns but compared to northern Europe there really is a large distance between suburbs. I'm really close to the centre of town here yet the house is a ~70m² thing on a huge 450m² site. I know, totally difference patterns of ownership, rental etc. on the continent but it's not like huge sites mean a good quality building; probably the opposite is true.

Zebra crossing: Not a single one in my town (Crawley) outside supermarket parking places. Can't have those important motorists having to slow down.

Traffic lights: Why does do the powers that be give pedestrians 5 seconds to cross and yet give the traffic 2-3 minutes between pressing the button? And recently they've actually reprogrammed all the lights - in favour of the motorists of course!
I've yet to see anyone except power-walkers actually making it across before the light has turned red again. And what's with the metal gating everywhere? Is that the only idea they have here to increase pedestrian safety, by herding people like cattle rather than slowing down those drivers who think they are entitled to drive through town?

The figures for pedestrian road casualties aren't really that bad, but is a lot of that because people are afraid to go out? Do the elderly live in fear of getting hit by cars, or are children ferried everywhere because of the danger of cars in cities? If pedestrian safety is mainly geared to intimidating pedestrians in general and consequently people don't go out that creates other problems too ('dead' cities or instance).

Because motorists scream loudly and because car ownership was an easy 'dream' (nightmare) to sell to voters, for decades the wrong approach has prevailed. Thing is, other countries do not have better quality of (street)life by accident. No quite the opposite: this was something which was planned and money was spent on it.

Hard to believe but in the early 1970s, the Netherlands had worse road traffic fatalities than the UK. Hard work and lobbying changed that. And the best thing about their approach is that a high percentage of road journeys are on motorways. I have no problem with cars being king of the motorways as they are exclusively for motor vehicles, but I have serious problems with letting cars taking over everywhere else.

Anyway, I could go on all day (and almost have!). I think when I get older I will have to go to another country or become boarded up afraid to venture out.

[shaithis]

One of the most contentious debates of recent years and one I can't see abating (at least until the cyclists stop holding up cars!)

As a driver (mostly) I do hate the way some cyclists appear to have the attitude of "You must make room for me"....regardless of fact they are doing 2 miles an hour up a steep hill, holding up 20-30 cars in rush hour.

Our roads move slow enough without having a cyclist as a "red flag bearer"....it sometimes feels like we are returning to 19th century motoring.....and this is all before we talk about road tax and insurance.....

[kompukare]

Yes, Milton Keynes does seem to be an exception (although I was only there shortly once). A bit 1950s/1960s concrete jungle though. It's like they tried a few different ideas with the New Towns in the 50s but never updated them. But for anyone who hasn't been to northern Europe (Scandinavia, Benelux, Germany, Switzerland and Austria), have a wander around on Streetview some time (Germany is mostly not on Streetview they have this thing about cameras and surveillance). Totally different layouts and attitudes. Like I said, this car-is-king attitude is the result of decades of poor planning and thinking. No such thing as road tax though and that's because precisely the term engenders some motorists to think they own the road.

[wasabi]

Cyclists weren't textbook examples of good riding which makes matters a little grey, but I see much worse most days. At least they looked and did some semblance of hand signals, if a little late and while riding side by side. Mr Angry behind the wheel is totally out of order though.

[Zak33]

i wached first bit.. and once I saw the two cylcists jumping the red lights and being waaay over the line ... hovering on their pedals instead of being behind the line where all traffic should be when the lights go red .. I thought "why are you doing that, nubber?" and stopped watching

[Spud1]

What did the cyclist do wrong?

Jumping the red lights and deciding to block the road side by side - that was pretty much the only thing they did wrong in the video. That's obviously frustrating - just like when you see drivers on their mobile phone or doing pretty much the same thing, but it wasn't cause for the reaction of the driver/passenger in the car. That was clearly uncalled for, and if they had any sense they would have cut the video after the cyclists made that (intentional) mistake.

I'll admit that cyclists on the road get to me sometimes, mostly because I tend to encounter them on narrow roads where it's not safe to overtake when there is oncoming traffic, so they invariably block the road as a result. Attitudes like the above of "the rules of the highway code don't apply to me" when they jump lights/weave through traffic etc really doesn't help.

Of course I know that the vast majority of the time, it only causes a problem because there is nowhere else to cycle. You can't cycle on the pavement, so you are stuck with the road..which is much more dangerous for the cyclist than it is for the car. Cycle paths themselves are hard to put in place given that it ends up narrowing the road in most cases (personally I would rather they narrowed pavements, our roads are too narrow as it is)..you can't win

[TeePee]

i wached first bit.. and once I saw the two cylcists jumping the red lights and being waaay over the line ... hovering on their pedals instead of being behind the line where all traffic should be when the lights go red .. I thought "why are you doing that, nubber?" and stopped watching

Pretty much this. They also passed on the left, which they shouldn't be doing. I remember there used to be short cycle lanes and then a cycle box at the front of some traffic lights (although not those shown in the video). I'm not sure who came up with that ridiculous piece of road design...

[Spud1]

I'm not sure who came up with that ridiculous piece of road design...

The same madmen who came up with "Shared Village Space"? (removal of the road in small towns to ensure that such areas become a chaotic mix of cars and people unsure where to go and how to avoid hitting each other, thereby jamming up the entire surrounding area)