AGP & System freeze

[Vijay]

Dear Austin,

To be very honest I did think of unplugging everything and then re-assembling it with a fresh install thrown in but only as a last resort.

Now it is not only the game that is freezing but windows too-funnily enough it works at the slower 1.5ghz. What I will do over the weekend is to remove the grapics card and run the machinefor an extended period of time say 10/12 hours and then proceed to the next step.

Please allow me to correct you see the fifth item below I got these details from the AMD site some time ago.

AMD Athlon XP Processors Core OPN Model Operating Freq.(MHz) Clock Mult. Nominal Voltage Max Die Temp. FSB Freq.(MHz) L2 Cache
Model 10
"Barton" AXDA3200DKV4E 3200+ 2200MHz 11x 1.65V 85º C 400MHz 512KB
AXDA3000DKV4E 3000+ 2100MHz 10.5x
AXDA3000DKV4D 3000+ 2167MHz 13x 333MHz
AXDA2800DKV4D 2800+ 2083MHz 12.5x
AXDA2600DKV4D 2600+ 1917MHz 11.5x
AXDA2500DKV4D 2500+ 1833MHz 11x
Model 8
"Thoroughbred" AXDA2700DKV3D 2700+ 2167MHz 13x 1.65V 85º C 333MHz 256KB
AXDA2600DKV3D 2600+ 2083MHz 12.5x
AXDA2600DKV3C 2600+ 2133MHz 16x 266MHz
AXDA2400DKV3C 2400+ 2000MHz 15x
AXDA2400DUV3C 2400+ 2000MHz 15x 1.60V
AXDA2200DUV3C 2200+ 1800MHz 13.5x
AXDA2200DKV3C 2200+ 1800MHz 13.5x 1.65V
AXDA2100DUT3C 2100+ 1733MHz 13x 1.60V 90º C
AXDA2000DUT3C 2000+ 1667MHz 12.5x
AXDA2000DKT3C 2000+ 1667MHz 12.5x 1.65V
AXDA1900DLT3C 1900+ 1600MHz 12x 1.50V
AXDA1800DUT3C 1800+ 1533MHz 11.5x 1.60V
AXDA1800DLT3C 1800+ 1533MHz 11.5x 1.50V
AXDA1700DUT3C 1700+ 1467MHz 11x 1.60V
AXDA1700DLT3C 1700+ 1467MHz 11x 1.50V
AXDA1600DUT3C 1600+ 1400MHz 10.5x 1.60V
Model 6
"Palomino" AX2100DMT3C 2100+ 1733MHz 13x 1.75V 90º C 266MHz 256KB
AX2000DMT3C 2000+ 1667MHz 12.5x
AX1900DMT3C 1900+ 1600MHz 12x
AX1800DMT3C 1800+ 1533MHz 11.5x
AX1700DMT3C 1700+ 1467MHz 11x
AX1600DMT3C 1600+ 1400MHz 10.5x
AX1500DMT3C 1500+ 1333MHz 10x

If you tell me how to i will mail the entire article to you or post on the forum board.

Thanks,

Vijay

[Trickle]

If the article says so, then it must be true... but anyway, the main bartons you see on sale are the 2500+, 2800, 3000, 3200 so I cant blame Austin for questioning it seeing that I did too. Hey, I dont even know the stock speeds off the top of my head of half my cpu's - seeing as I dont think I've ever ran any of them at stock unless by accident however this is semantics and getting off track.

Austins question is good. Have you properly stress tested your system by non graphical means?

Also, nothing has to be 'faulty'. Sometimes products of bygone eras (and not always old stuff) just dont gell quite as well with certain mobo's (but could be fine on another chipset etc). Add to the possibilities of Cheap PSU's aggravating a poor quality transistor on an el cheapo mobo could all add together to make the difference of it working at 1.5Ghz, but not at 1.9Gz.

[Vijay]

Dear Trickle,

No I have not stress tested my Comp and would you reccomend a free program -not too big a download please !!

I have been to pcpitstop but I dont think that was what you had in mind.

Also how long should the tests be run for 1 cycle, 10 cycles or more

Hey Austin sorry but having a 2600 I was naturally curious about it and found out whatever I could -didn't mean to knock you....

Have made two changes to the software installed and one to the system let see if it stops freezing now...I removed MBM and ASUS monitor-sys would hang shortly after I shut these progs and increased cache size on another partition. Fingers crossed!

I just hope the trouble isn't the ram as it is a helluva job getting PC2700 ram where I am.

Wish me luck,

Thanks again for all your help all of you,

Regards,

Vijay

[Trickle]

The pifast test linked to on a forum sticky is usefull to see if things are working at the correct speed.

For more usefull stressing, peeps tend to use memtest, toast etc... I have to say I just use pifast + seti/ud (see the distributed computing forum).

Lookie what I found trying to google for a usefull link for you
http://www.benchmarkhq.ru/english.html?/be_cpu.html

[Vijay]

Thanks a ton,

A veritable surfeit of goodies....Problem is which one to try out.

Any recommendations ?

Vijay

[Vijay]

Ran the pifast and got a score in the mid eighties-bad.Over the weekend tried out a few things and one of them seems to work.

The system would run ok at 1.533Ghz with fsb of 133 and would freeze at 1.913 (11x166).

I raised the multiplier to 16 and left the fsb at 133 (shades of XP 2500) and the system and games work fine so far.

I now feel it must be the ram that is at fault as it can't take speeds of 166-would you agree?

Thanks for your help but would like your feed back on this before I take it up with Kingston

Vijay

[Trickle]

What mem timings have you got the ram set at?

I've got some el chepo 2700 ram that wont do cas2 unless you run it at 133 - yet ittle do over 166 if you relax the timings a bit. Naturally relaxing timings affects performance, however you usually find that being able to increase fsb by an extra 33% (or whatever etc) will more than compensate.

As to which of the ones on that link to try... you could past some of the names in the search engine of forums like Hexus or OCUK and see which ones get mentioned. Actually I hadnt looked at the list at the time... suprising looking at it now how many of those Ive actually used in the past.

Any of the ones that have the 'burn' word would have suited the original stressing plan. But if you want to concentrate on mem now, try here. Have a search round the forum to see if you can find a thread explaining memory timings. Perhaps see if Hexus's front page has any memory review articles? You can tend to pick up what you need to know from reading a few of those.

http://www.memtest86.com/

[Vijay]

Thanks,

Mem timings I take it you mean cas/latency etc. It is set to spd if I am not mistaken the default is 2.5, 3, 3, 7. By relaxing the timing do you mean I should increase it from 2.5 to 3 or what particular config should I aim for.

I was under the impression that Kingston was a well established and reputable brand BTW ram prices in India are 25%-50% higher than else where so on takes what one gets.

There is no point in running atest at166 fsb as the Comp will hang well before completion and at 133 it works well enough for my purposes.What I propose to do is try out variations and get back with the results.

Regards and thanks again

[Trickle]

My el chepo ebuyer cas2.5 ram that I mentioned was set to 'by spd' and was pciked up as cas 2.0 on 2 separate boards... so dont take it for granted.

Kingston isnt necessarily that great. Cant you get the baord at settings inbetween 133 and 166?

[Vijay]

havent tried as yet but i think i can should be able to go up 150 or so. should I change the spd to manual and then config it and if what cas/latency.etc

[Vijay]

Profuse apologies.

the settings were 2.5, 3, 3. 7 for SPD

Have asked Kingston who told me to download the latest bios which i did but no change it still hangs at 166.

I wrote and told them so lets see what reply I get.

Vijat

[Austin]

If you can run 133/266FSB @ 2.1ghz but get no where near stable 166/333FSB @ 1.9ghz then it certainly indicates a problem with mobo or RAM. Using higher timings will slow you down a little (only very slightly) but should allow a faster speed (in mhz), around 2.0ghz it's well worth using at least 166/333FSB. 2.5-3-3-7 is already pretty normal timings but it won't hurt to at least try the highest settings your mobo allows just to see. Some RAM may need extra voltage to do what it's claimed to run at (ie PC2700 = 166/333mhz). Kingston are well known in the US but only the premium stuff, from what I've heard (actually little) the Kingston value type stuff is pretty pants. If you raise the RAM voltage don't expect them to honour the warranty though, check what it is designed to use in order to attain its rated speed. Geil were very well known for needing obscene voltages to run at their rated speed.

Now what to do if the problem lies with the mobo? You're KT400 based so ensure the mobo is set to run the RAM and FSB in sync (1:1, 6:6, PC2100 @ 266FSB or PC2700 @ 333FSB etc). Use som ediag sw to check the PCI/AGP speeds as they should be 33/66mhz. Unfortunately raising the FSB from 133/266 closer to 166/333 entails its own problems as you're KT400 is divider based, the PCI/AGP will run out of spec and can cause instability themselves. Your KT400 is designed for 166/333FSB so it will (or should) use the 1/5 divider to make PCI/AGP=33/66mhz. Perhaps it is a power problem or down to the NB overheating but I think a simpler mobo or RAM based problem is the cause. Good luck.

[Vijay]

Thanks, Kingston have replied and confirmed the problem is the Ram,which they are replacing.Fingers crossed that the new one works.In the mean time I am getting 2.13 ghz ar16x133 which I can live with. Aida reports the temp at 51 C and Vcore at 1.68.

Will wait untill the new ram comes and then post again.

Thanks and regards,

Vijay

[Vijay]

The Ram came today and I installed it.I set the CPU speed to 1913 and the other settings on auto .It promptly hung doing a spybot scan. Added the old ram to the MB and spybot ran without freezing the Comp.

Took out old ram Comp froze.

Set the Comp settings to manual; FSB to 166/33 and the multiplier to 11.5x, Comp ran for a little while and then froze again.

Back to last good settings which were 16x133 and no hang ups.

I am now begining to think it is not a Ram problem but the MB itself is screwed up.

Any ideas on what I should try next?

[Austin]

Working fine at 2.1ghz 133/266FSB but problems at 166/333FSB with a lower clocked CPU clock would indicate ...

* Mobo.
* RAM (but you've tried new stuff).

I can't see it being the CPU, PSU or cooling as everything is fine at 2.1ghz with 266FSB. No other parts should come into play. Ensure you have the latest mobo BIOS and drivers for ALL your hw. You could try running with minimal parts only (and disable unneeded onboard stuff) just to rule that out. It's best to check the BIOS setting and ensure RAM is set to run synced with slow (high) timings. ALso be sure to try diff slots on the mobo and is try to use only 1 RAM stick at a time. Also check what voltage it should use at 333mhz / PC2700 speed. Check what the PCI and AGP are reported as when at 333FSB (should be 33 & 66mhz). Other than that I can only assume the mobo is at fault and you should persue that avenue. You didn't remove the fan on the NB (if there was one there)?

[Vijay]

No fan on the MB ( will check out all the voltage setting and then get back.The ASUS jumper free setting is from 1.5 to 1.85 at present 1.68 to 1.7

Tried one ram at a time in slots 1 to 3 and it still hung at11.5x166.

Pci and Agp are at 33 & 66.

Did I mention that I downloaded the latest Bios and installed it.

Now to convince Asus.

Vijay

(Edited to correct spelling mistakes)