News - Microsoft ditches Windows 7 E version

[nightkhaos]

I'm aware nobody is forcing me to use IE, my objection to IE is that it is pretty much impossible to remove should I choose to use another browser.
Personally I'd be quite happy to have a basic web browser come as standard with windows, to give an example.

Windows comes with Wordpad a pretty basic word processor, when a user decides they need something better they have a look around, choose a better program and install it. The same could be done with a browser, something like IE3 could be installed as standard which will do the absolute minimum(render HTML and Images), a basic browser would also allow a user to search for another product then download and install it.

Microsoft wouldn't have to be put in the stupid position of advertising competitors products with a "choose a browser" screen.

Yeah... install IE3, a browser that is so out of date that it wasn't even deployed with Windows by Microsoft. (They started deployment with IE4 iirc).

Your point is noted, but IE3 is not the best choice. Maybe something similar to Lyx or Links?

[Singh400]

I'm aware nobody is forcing me to use IE, my objection to IE is that it is pretty much impossible to remove should I choose to use another browser.

But why do you want to remove it? It's pretty much impossible to completely remove IE from Windows. Given that alot of things depend on IE engine. AFAIK you can turn off all "access points" to it. But the general browser engine will still be there.

Windows comes with Wordpad a pretty basic word processor, when a user decides they need something better they have a look around, choose a better program and install it. The same could be done with a browser, something like IE3 could be installed as standard which will do the absolute minimum(render HTML, Images and run Javascript), a basic browser would also allow a user to search for another product then download and install it.

Your argument for having IE3 over IE6/7 pre-installed is kind of weak. Why would you prefer IE3 of IE6? Because it's more "basic"? It doesn't matter if it's full featured or basic, all you are going to do is download another browser right? And that takes like 30 secs.

If it bothers you that much download your browser before hand and have it ready. Or use FTP to download your favourite browser.

[[GSV]Trig]

I'm aware nobody is forcing me to use IE, my objection to IE is that it is pretty much impossible to remove should I choose to use another browser.
Personally I'd be quite happy to have a basic web browser come as standard with windows, to give an example.

Windows comes with Wordpad a pretty basic word processor, when a user decides they need something better they have a look around, choose a better program and install it. The same could be done with a browser, something like IE3 could be installed as standard which will do the absolute minimum(render HTML, Images and run Javascript), a basic browser would also allow a user to search for another product then download and install it.

Microsoft wouldn't have to be put in the stupid position of advertising competitors products with a "choose a browser" screen.

Not a brilliant example tbh, how many people that have installed Word or whatever there choice is actually then uninstall wordpad? I've never uninstalled it on any of the machine that I've installed office on..

Windows comes with IE, so what, if you want something else then download something else, theres no need to get all arsey about the fact that they want to ship windows with a browser..
Imaging windows not coming with a browser, how do you connect to the internet to download another browser?
OMGWTFBBQ!!!1

[Splash]

IE3? Because stuff built to run on Win95 will work fine on a 64 bit machine, and won't be full of security holes?

Why not just have Lynx for Windows preinstalled? At least it'd be more stable and secure out of the box... (though whether it would run on a 64 bit machine is another matter, of course.). Gah, just realised that Nightkaos has basically said all this already. +1 to him/her

I think we all need to face facts - in their current situation Microsoft are damned if they do and damned if they don't. Personally I don't mind IE being preinstalled, so long as they keep patching it when holes are discovered and I'm not *forced* to use it (like I'm not forced to use Notepad, Wordpad, the Windows Firewall, yadda yadda yadda).

[Splash]

When business people congratulate M$ it's similar to politicians congratulating a dictator on how well they've run a country. Freedom of choice isn't in the remit of either M$ or your average dictator; both practice Embrace, Extend and Extinguish and base their entire philosophy on it. Indeed, the very height of pure capitalism is the same as a dictatorship; one entity in control with everyone underneath doing exactly as they say.

However you feel about M$, they are definitely worth a study in how to massively exploit a business sector.

Or alternatively worth a study in how to run a very effective business?

I do think I could do a better job, but I don't think I could write better software (or any software worth selling in fact).

M$ run an effective monopoly, and they do it badly. I think the mistakes are probably made because they don't think things through, the W7-E edition reversal is just the latest in a number of retarded decision regarding the launch of W7. Personally I think that most people with 2 brain cells to rub together could have sat down in an office a couple of months ago and came out with a better launch than M$ has produced...

1) Decide what versions you are going to have, don't artificially limit them. (Such as the netbook application limit)
2) Multi-user licenses are a no brainer in this day and age, I would suggest 3,5 and maybe a 10 license pack.
3) Sort out the Europe mess before you make any announcements. What this article is talking about could have been agreed months ago I am sure.
4) Set realistic price points and sell to them, don't bother with this convoluted pre-order nonsense.
5) Treat Apple and its advertising with the contempt it deserves, but don't sink to their levels of infantile bull droppings.
6) Head off to the beach for a beer and a BBQ.

First things first - the whole M$ thing makes you saound even more like a whiny 12 year old. Do youself a favour and stop using it. And now for your points...


1 - pretty certain that was ditched long ago
2 - Family pack for 3 licenses. How many normal households have more than 3 PCs? Sure - I have 5 plus a bunch of testing machines, but frankly if you need 10+ licenses then you need to speak to a reseller about getting some form of volume licensing.
3 - The "Europe mess" is as much the doing of the EU as it is Microsoft's in my eyes. You'll disagree, of course but we're all entitled to our opinion.
4 - They price the product to sell and maximise profits. The "convoluted pre-order nonsense" helps build hype for day one sales, and seems to have worked pretty well from where I stand.
5 - I actually agree with you on this front. I'd probably buy a Mac if it wasn't for their advertising stylings.
6 - Agreed on this one too.

[Animus404]

IE3 was just an example of what the browser would be like. I didn't actually mean take the 16bit exe and stick it on a brand new 64bit Windows7.

In my opinion providing a basic browser would satisfy the EU, and allow fair and open competition between the competing browsers. While at the same time giving users who don't know how to use a cli ftp client an easy way to get a browser they can actually use.

[nightkhaos]

IE3 was just an example of what the browser would be like. I didn't actually mean take the 16bit exe and stick it on a brand new 64bit Windows7.

In my opinion providing a basic browser would satisfy the EU, and allow fair and open competition between the competing browsers. While at the same time giving users who don't know how to use a cli ftp client an easy way to get a browser they can actually use.

The EU government has not told Apple off for shipping Mac OS X with Safari preinstalled and "no obvious option to install another browser". They are only targeting Microsoft because of it's effective monoploy.

Yes, it is probably possible to remove internet explorer from the system, but not the Trident engine, which makes up 99% of Internet Explorer. Without this engine, basic functions of the Windows Operating System, like help, would cease to function.

Because of this, why in gods name with Microsoft include a barebones engine when some of the core functionality of the operating system already runs on a fully fledged mordern engine? They wouldn't, because you start getting the problem of deciding what needs to be in the core engine, and what needs to be in IE.

[Animus404]

They've probably already worked out what is needed for the OS to function without the rest of IE.
They were planning on shipping the E version after all.

[Singh400]

They've probably already worked out what is needed for the OS to function without the rest of IE.
They were planning on shipping the E version after all.

Just out of interest, I checked it out.

And you can remove Internet Explorer, via OptionalFeatures.exe. And you are left without Internet Explorer.

Screenshot below...


(click here if you can't see it)