News - BFG starts denying RMA support

[Tonka777]

Oh dear. I'll add my name to the list of those who chose BFG because of the lifetime warranty, in fact, it was the first time I spent > £100 on a GPU. Not impressed, this makes makes buying from a reputable brand just as dodgy as buying something valuable on ebay, either seller can disappear/go under and your stuck with a useless product should you need to return it.

On the other hand, now I know I cannot invalidate my warranty, maybe now is a good time to look into fitting an after-market cooler...?

If the parent company is still in business, why cant they be forced to issue full refunds if no repair is available? It seems like they are going to get away with stitching up many customers far too easily.

[xXDeltaXx]

I guess this is why it took them almost a month to set me up with an RMA and a second month to tell me they'd changed their minds and cancelled it...
So, like many others; got a few hundred pound card which is only fit for a paperweight... and -£40 for shipping to Wales for an RMA to be told this unit is not occupied by them...

[TAKTAK]

What about the EU 2 year warranty though?

The fact is that a two-year guarantee applies for the sale of all consumer goods everywhere in the EU (Directive 1999/44/EC). In some countries, this may be more, and some manufacturers also choose to offer a longer warranty period.

When you buy a new product, it should look and function exactly how it was advertised. But do you know what your rights are if your new coffee machine leaks, or if a green door is delivered instead of the blue one you ordered?

The vast majority of purchases and transactions in Europe take place with no reason for complaint. However, if you do have reason to complain, you should be aware that the following rights and responsibilities apply everywhere in the EU:

• If the item you bought does not look or function as it was advertised, or if it is not satisfactory, you have the right to have the item replaced or to get your money back if the replacement was not completed in a reasonable time at no extra cost.

• If you buy goods that turn out to be faulty, manufacturers must compensate you for any personal injury or damage caused to property.

• When you buy goods or services by post, telephone, fax or through the Internet from a professional trader, you have the same rights in relation to guarantees as if you had bought them in a shop.

http://ec.europa.eu/publications/boo...4/index_en.htm

Or is the SoGA based around this, with the 6mth burden of proof reversal?

[jim]

AFAIK, that applies to the 6 year restriction in the UK.

After 6 years, you can no longer take the case to court - so the SOGA is no longer enforceable. In other words, that's the maximum "warranty" provided by the SOGA.

That EU directive says that it should be a minimum of 2 years, but it's already 6 in the UK anway. As far as I know, at least!

[Saracen]

What about the EU 2 year warranty though?



http://ec.europa.eu/publications/boo...4/index_en.htm

Or is the SoGA based around this, with the 6mth burden of proof reversal?

It's basically a misinterpretation of terms.

There is no EU two-year warranty in the sense that most people understand it in the UK, and it's led to a lot of confusion.

Yes, it's the modified SoGA. That EU directive has no direct binding effect in the member countries, except to bind member states to introduce national laws that implement at least the minimum and mandatory elements of the directive. That was done in the UK by the The Sale and Supply of Goods to Consumers Regulations 2002, which amended the SoGA .... as have several other bits of statute and regulation over the years. That's where the six months switch in the burden of proof was implemented, and it's where the statute specified that risk in the goods remains with the seller (in a consumer contract until delivered to the consumer was implememted.

The two-year thing is to establish a minimum period throughout all EU states during which a minimal and coherent set of consumer rights exist, such as satisfactory quality, etc, and states that didn't already have at least that length of period had to increase it to at least two years. It was already six years in England and Wales (and 5 years, but from a different trigger point) in Scotland, so no changes where necessary in relation to the two-year thing.

In the context of that directive, "warranty" is meant in the sense of the legal term, not the commonly understood consumer interpretation, which is actually a subset. The "warranty", meaning either express or implied, is effectively a promise undertaken. The impact, for example, of the Sale of Goods Act is to embed implied warranties in all consumer contracts on satisfactory quality, fitness for purpose, etc. The consumer contract doesn't have to explicitly stipulate those, because they are implied by provision of statutes.

I've lost track of how many articles I've seen (including in some publications that ought to know better) that interpret that EU directive as meaning every consumer purchase has a two year guarantee (ignoring that guarantee and warranty aren't quite the same thing), and that simply isn't what it means. Hope that clears it up?

[tickedon]

Not worth it.

[BobF64]

I suppose the real question is "what does lifetime mean?".

Ive seen a lot of cases where "lifetime" means "until we decide its reached the end of its life".

In terms of a company going bust, surely that is the end of its lifetime anyway.

[live2give]

that sucks hope my card does not fail !!!!

[joel_spencer]

Hardly surprising but very dissapointing, I know a fair few people who did buy cards for the lifetime warranty as between that and the game bundled most card makers are identical. The company you bought it from may well cover the card though as it was sold under that warranty, e.g. ebuyer sold me a viewsonic monitor, viewsonic reneged on the warranty and ebuyer repaired it (had that failed they would have issued me a full credit refund). Obviously depends on the company but that was a big thumbs up to ebuyer in my estimation.

[GoNz0]

indeed ebuyer would be of some help although im unsure about the uk 10 year warranty, i doubt they would help after the 1st year. within the 1st year you would get a full refund. another popular company would give you a large reduction in the new value of the card leaving you feeling fleeced.

[Saracen]

*sigh*. Obviously I cannot cover every permutation in a paragraph compared to several I did not say there was a one year cut off, indeed, I specifically said you could take a claim under SOGA after that...

Generally though, most reputable retailers take responsibility for the first year, and after that you rely on whatever you can. As you said, depending on the terms one might offer better cover, but it's often easier to take the action against the retailer (as many manufacturers may be based outside the UK - iirc, BFG's EU base is in the Netherlands?)

The main point of my post was really to point out that many people think they only have a year, when in fact, they have rights far extending that. Obviously you can put it better and provide details of the ins and outs when you have the time to write out considerably more

You said, and I quoted,

For the first year, the retailer are 100% liable for any repairs, replacement or refund if they can't do the former.

As I said, that simply isn't the case. You also said

For the first year, the retailer are 100% liable for any repairs, replacement or refund if they can't do the former. The sale of goods act would also allow you to make a claim after one year, ....

which is true, but misleading, as there's no difference in the SoGA cover at 7 months, 11 months, 13 months, 19 months and so on. There is no one year point in the SoGA - it's like any other time up to 6 years, other than where the burden of proof shifts after 6 months.

The mistake people make is confusing the incorrect notion (as you said) that sellers have "100%" liability for one year, which they don't. And then that the SoGA cover takes up after that, as could be inferred from your comment. The two are completely distinct, and overlap.

The guarantee may last one year, but it might be more that that or it might be less, and it doesn't necessarily cover you for "any repairs, replacement or refund if they can't do the former" repairs, etc - it covers you for what it says it does and only what it says it does.

And the SoGA doesn't mean sellers are "100% liable for any repairs, replacement or refund if they can't do the former" either during the first year either. They are liable for "inherent" faults, subject to the burden of proof.

My point was the difference between your recent comment ....

Generally though, most reputable retailers take responsibility for the first year, and after that you rely on whatever you can.

and the original one that I quoted ....

For the first year, the retailer are 100% liable for any repairs, replacement or refund if they can't do the former.

The former is certainly, for most relevant product, the case, but the latter is not.

[tickedon]

Not worth it.

[joel_spencer]

Just fyi Gonzo, this was a three year warranty and Ebuyer still honoured it as I was within the period by about a month, Viewsonic claimed it was 2 despite me sending the invoice with a clear mention of the three years.

[GoNz0]

thants nice to know

you won't get that with companies that give free shipping with 20 posts

[Rob_B]

Out of interest (as they have been very good so far) I've contacted the company I bought my GTX260 from (Currys eBay outlet - techfurb) to see what their stance is. I bought the card after confirming the 10yr warranty still applied in the EU with BFG so now that's not the case I curious to know the position, doubt I'll get anywhere but as I said they have been pretty helpful so far so fingers crossed.
If not then I'm sure I'll get over it

[wesleyaldred]

Just to confirm as always Saracen is 100% correct on his posts, after 6 months the burden of proof reverts to a consumer and the law stipulates simply that after this time frame you need to proove an item contained an inherant fault, without this the answer under legislation is quite simple and is worded exactly, this is a flow chart from the DTI:

"Is the problem due to something
present (e.g. a fault, something
affecting durability or a
misdescription) at the time of sale?"

"No"

"There is no legal
right to redress."

Many people totally misunderstand the legal side of things but actually it is very straightforward. People should try and get facts correct before jumping in with posts that are totally wrong, misleading and confuse far more people than they help.