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Thread: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    You should not be considering these figures as including the 300 series and Fury. These cards were "released" june 24. That is near the end of q2.

    January, February and March (Q1); April, May and June (Q2); July, August and September (Q3); and October, November and December (Q4)

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    It does seem there is much fanboyism, not so much on this forum but go elsewhere and it seems many have a strange loyalty to nvidia.

    For me personally my last 6 cards have been ati/amd to which I have never had any problems, but will admit the last call was very marginal (970 vs 290x) but overall in marginal cases I will just pick AMD as they need the money and a monopoly is never a good thing. (and I wasn't rewarding nvidia for there 970 lies).

    Hopefully directx 12 may open peoples eyes if early results are anything to go by.

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    Quote Originally Posted by shaithis View Post
    Er, this threads title kinda says something
    It says nothing whatsoever about drivers? Besides, its OEMs who buy the vast majority of cards from AMD/Nvidia, not end-uesrs. Marketing has an awful lot to do with it and market share is often completely at odds with things like performance - it's quite possible for people to buy something sub-par just because it's popular or well-marketed.

    Quote Originally Posted by shaithis View Post
    My understanding of GCN is that they hardly differ. Perhaps my understanding is incorrect but as far as I knew the differences between GCN 1, 1.1, 1.2 etc were minimal compared to the differences between Maxwell and Kepler, let alone throwing Fermi in there also.

    As for "cutting support"...I was replying to talk about dx12 drivers.
    A lot of the difference between Nvidia's architectures are at the block level. That's not to detract from the work of the engineers but to claim (as many people do) that Nvidia has all-new architectures while AMD has had the same one since 2011 is not correct. For some time I don't think ATI/AMD even made public their uArch codenames; in fact I don't recall hearing about Terascale until well after GCN was released; they were referred to as VLIW4/5, though that's more a description of the type of architecture rather than a name.

    GCN was hugely different to Terascale and AMD's move to a SIMD architecture while Nvidia had been using and incrementing SIMD-type architectures before that; both have their advantages and disadvantages. But like I say a lot of the differences between recent Nvidia architectures have been reorganising compute blocks/tweaking ratios like AMD has also been doing e.g. geometry/raster units per shader array rather than 1:2 along with increased ACE units, bridge-less Xfire, additional DSPs, etc. Not to mention joint developing and re-architecting their memory controllers for HBM...

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    Quote Originally Posted by cptwhite_uk View Post
    The problem is people don't buy AMD even when they offer best products at a similar price point. I remember trying to convince people a 7870 was an amazing high-med range card a couple of years ago. It was powerful, frugal and quiet. Yet people were still defending the nVidia equivalent that was ~ £20 more and ~ 10% less performance as the better option.

    When people have that mindset (AMD = Bad drivers and crashing) it's going to be an uphill struggle for them to regain market share they've lost.

    Yet the final result will be terrible for consumers if AMD were to lag behind by a significant margin or completely fall leaving only nVidia to buy from.
    That is the market though. When you have the fringe features like Physx, 3D Vision and CUDA, people would pay the small extra for those features or "just in case" they wanted to use those features in the future.

    I've said for 2 years that AMD need to do their own scheme like nVidia where they go out and work with game devs. Just reading the old stuff from Batman Arkham City (yes, I do mean City) tells a massive story, nVidia were happy to help and AMD were not.......here we are 2 years later and we are seeing a slew of titles with heavy GamesWork usage.....I doubt that is coincidence! The 2 titles where AMD did work closely with devs (BF4 and TR), it showed.

    This means the problem is now compounded. If AMD had worked closer with devs, if they had put more effort into their drivers and if they had continued to push Mantle........I believe that they would be in a much better position today....unfortunately they did not and (IMO) completely dropped the ball and tried to use games bundles to sell cards instead (which probably cost them more than working with devs would have!).

    And your correct, the outcome for customers will almost certainly be bad and without a major change in fortunes soon, we are likely to see AMD fail. If that happens, I'd like to think that another company will buy the GPU division and do a better job with it than AMD have.......
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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    Quote Originally Posted by semitope View Post
    You should not be considering these figures as including the 300 series and Fury. These cards were "released" june 24. That is near the end of q2.
    ^ What they said. Still bad though, and tbh I don't expect the 300 series or the Furys to have done much to that number. Sad.

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    Quote Originally Posted by shaithis View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by cptwhite_uk View Post
    The problem is people don't buy AMD even when they offer best products at a similar price point. I remember trying to convince people a 7870 was an amazing high-med range card a couple of years ago. It was powerful, frugal and quiet. Yet people were still defending the nVidia equivalent that was ~ £20 more and ~ 10% less performance as the better option.

    When people have that mindset (AMD = Bad drivers and crashing) it's going to be an uphill struggle for them to regain market share they've lost.

    Yet the final result will be terrible for consumers if AMD were to lag behind by a significant margin or completely fall leaving only nVidia to buy from.
    That is the market though. When you have the fringe features like Physx, 3D Vision and CUDA, people would pay the small extra for those features or "just in case" they wanted to use those features in the future.

    I've said for 2 years that AMD need to do their own scheme like nVidia where they go out and work with game devs. Just reading the old stuff from Batman Arkham City (yes, I do mean City) tells a massive story, nVidia were happy to help and AMD were not.......here we are 2 years later and we are seeing a slew of titles with heavy GamesWork usage.....I doubt that is coincidence! The 2 titles where AMD did work closely with devs (BF4 and TR), it showed.

    This means the problem is now compounded. If AMD had worked closer with devs, if they had put more effort into their drivers and if they had continued to push Mantle........I believe that they would be in a much better position today....unfortunately they did not and (IMO) completely dropped the ball and tried to use games bundles to sell cards instead (which probably cost them more than working with devs would have!).

    And your correct, the outcome for customers will almost certainly be bad and without a major change in fortunes soon, we are likely to see AMD fail. If that happens, I'd like to think that another company will buy the GPU division and do a better job with it than AMD have.......
    Another myth. AMD works with devs. The thing you might say is that nvidia sabotages AMD performance when they work with devs so their efforts give more fruit.

    Most people never have issues with AMD drivers. Right now AMD drivers are even better in win 10 than AMD drivers. I wonder if the idea that nvidia drivers suck will catch on. Game bundles do help sell hardware and nvidia is doing similar right now. AMD had a much better bundle going but the major problem was still buzz. They didn't have a major noisy release last year, so they started losing sales. Especially since there were so many second hand AMD cards from the mining craze so that new sales for those wanting AMD cards was smaller

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian224 View Post
    I switched back to AMD a few months back (R9 280 replacing my GTX760 which my son wanted for SLI). Hardware wise I prefer AMD, largely as my Sapphire card lets me run triple DVI monitors without an unreliable active adapter. A pity therefore that when I tried to run an old game that works perfectly with the 760, I find that AMD doesn't support it, so I instead of considering a second card for crossfire I have bought an SLI capable motherboard as I know I will have to go back to NVidia for my next card.

    In the final analysis, it doesn't matter how good AMD's hardware is if it isn't supported by game developers and users cannot run games optimised for NVidia hardware as well, if at all.
    What is an sli capable motherboard? How much effort did you actually put into getting the game to work?

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    I suspect another thing ala marketing is general tone in reviews. If reviews are primarily where people learn about GPU releases, then seeing the site complain about re-releasing or beta release drivers then people will likely associate that with the card rather than seeing the card for what it actually is. Noisy releases help to create hype for cards, and even if an existing product performs fine, interest probably declines compared to a shiny new one with lots of media attention.

    It's unfortunate in terms of brand image, but we often see products improve over time, but this obviously isn't generally reflected in reviews that people go to read.

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    So the decline, and nvidias gain, starts about the same time as Lisa Su became CEO, I wonder if that has anything to do with it.

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    Got myself an R9 390 last month to replace my 660ti, I often changed between the companies depending on what is available and good value at the time but I can sadly see a possible future without AMD cards. Saying that, they may get a 2nd lease of life with HBM cards down the line.

    Would be bad to see them go tho.

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    I do not have any driver problems with AMD and I have been a long time Crossfire user. But, there's no arguing that NVIDIA is making the best cards for the last couple years. AMD is still valid because I can get similar performing video cards for the same price point, but that does not help when NVIDIA year after year can say "We are the King." and every one believes it.

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    Quote Originally Posted by shaithis View Post
    Personal experiences are evidence of issues with certain setups. Just because you don't run dual monitors, blizzard titles, use a 7.1 external amp etc etc does not mean their drivers are fine, it just means you were lucky enough to use the drivers in the most mainstream way and therefore didn't have to put up with their shoddy coding for anything that AMD could sweep under the carpet until later.....
    Are you seriously going to try to say that Nvidia does better multi-screen? If so I can assure you I have a whole slew of information proving otherwise.

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    Quote Originally Posted by Brian224 View Post
    In the final analysis, it doesn't matter how good AMD's hardware is if it isn't supported by game developers and users cannot run games optimised for NVidia hardware as well, if at all.
    I'm gonna let you into an amazing secret...most games are developed on AMD hardware because AMD hardware (especially GCN) has the highest market share. The only thing Nvidia does today is bribe devs like CD Projekt and many of the worst Ubisoft teams with CrapWorks. That's why so many CrapWork games are absolutely horrible on launch - the devs have literally accepted last-minute Nvidia bribes in the $millions.

    Those $millions, btw, are paid by the same Nvidia buyers who pay more for the same or less performance. Nice little earner for Nvidia - they're basically making you pay to hobble the games you play, however they hobble AMD cards even more so you feel forced to buy Nvidia instead.

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    Come on ATi. Pick up the pace, don't become extinct!

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    this is sad

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    Quote Originally Posted by tekgun View Post
    So the decline, and nvidias gain, starts about the same time as Lisa Su became CEO, I wonder if that has anything to do with it.
    Explain how, and why.
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    Valar Morghulis

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    Re: AMD discrete GPU market share eroded to less than 20 per cent

    Quote Originally Posted by semitope View Post
    Another myth. AMD works with devs. The thing you might say is that nvidia sabotages AMD performance when they work with devs so their efforts give more fruit.
    Maybe I've misunderstood what shaithis said/meant, but I don't think he was saying AMD don't work with devs, I think he meant AMD don't put as much effort into working with devs as their competitor, and it shows.

    What is a myth though is that nvidia sabotages AMD performance, that's unless you have information to the contrary.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbo75 View Post
    I'm gonna let you into an amazing secret...most games are developed on AMD hardware because AMD hardware (especially GCN) has the highest market share. The only thing Nvidia does today is bribe devs like CD Projekt and many of the worst Ubisoft teams with CrapWorks. That's why so many CrapWork games are absolutely horrible on launch - the devs have literally accepted last-minute Nvidia bribes in the $millions.

    Those $millions, btw, are paid by the same Nvidia buyers who pay more for the same or less performance. Nice little earner for Nvidia - they're basically making you pay to hobble the games you play, however they hobble AMD cards even more so you feel forced to buy Nvidia instead.
    Most games are developed on AMD hardware? That's not the title of this thread seems to indicate.

    I've also never seen any evidence of Nvidia paying money to devs, would you have any evidence to backup those accusations?
    Last edited by Corky34; 20-08-2015 at 09:04 AM.

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