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Thread: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

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    Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    And AMD halts the production of Vega reference cards to leave room for partners.
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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    saves buying a new M/B

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Intel needs to learn from this, practically issuing a new socket with each iteration of virutally the same core CPU architecture.

    I guess when you've sort of had a monopoly on performance processors, there's money to be made. Wonder if Intel and EA follow the same sales strategy

    I'm really psyched for Zen 2. If they can sort out some of the issues from the Zen, single thread performance, gaming, etc. My PC's already several years old, so the Zen 2 should be just in time for an upgrade.

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Quote Originally Posted by ksdp37 View Post
    Intel needs to learn from this, practically issuing a new socket with each iteration of virutally the same core CPU architecture.
    <SNIP>
    How about the stop gap solution that is Z370? Motherboards using that chip (set) will be outdated in about 6 months.

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Seriously, this whole motherboard/socket compatibility thing is just a smoke screen thrown up by the AMD fanbois and AMD are leveraging it for marketing purposes.

    When you upgrade and you dump between £500 and £1000 on your next rig then personally the only upgrade that I'm going to consider in the subsequent years is going to be either a graphics card or a larger SSD. Everything else I bought I would hope that I'm going to get a good 4-5 years out of. If you already built something based on a Core i3 or i5 then an upgrade to next years CPU doesn't hold sufficient benefit since framerates in games just aren't constrained by CPU. Everyone seems to pick on the fact that each new generation of Intel CPU only gives a modest uplift anyway, so that in itself is telling you that the bang for your buck lies in a next gen GPU upgrade and not your CPU, in which case motherboards, chipsets and sockets are all a moot point unless you're after something specific like the latest gen USB - in which case just buy a cheap add-in card to provide that must-have feature.

    An extreme example, but I just upgraded my Core i7-3930K (which was 6 years old) to a Core i9-7900X. Yes it's a lot of money but I'm not planning an upgrade to a motherboard or CPU for another 6 years, so I'd certainly hope there would be a chipset and socket update between now and then and the more the better, because that tells me that my chosen CPU brand is continually thinking about architecture from front to back and not holding onto anything legacy. There has to come a point where maintaining socket compatibility starts to hold a newer architecture back, and I honestly believe that AMD are playing this worthless card to pander to AMD fans at the potential cost to their own architecture down the line. To be honest, they're only making a commitment to the same socket for another couple of years which isn't far from what Intel have done anyway!

    Despite all the multi-core hype most people seem to have finally realised that where gaming performance is concerned then IPC is still the defining factor, so even if you bought last years quad core i5 it's still a tough call to honestly justify an upgrade to a hex core i5 other than for sheer bragging rights.

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Quote Originally Posted by rainman View Post
    Seriously, this whole motherboard/socket compatibility thing is just a smoke screen thrown up by the AMD fanbois and AMD are leveraging it for marketing purposes. ...
    Really?

    The last 4 desktops I built have all had a CPU upgrade in their lifetime. In the Intel cases, I've *had* to buy second hand because it was impossible to buy a new CPU for the motherboard in use.

    This Christmas someone is getting a completely new subsystem because my only upgrade option for their system would be a 5 year old second hand chip. That subsystem is on socket AM4 because that gives them the posibility of upgrading in 2 - 3 years' time ... which they almost certainly will.

    Your use case isn't the only one. AMD are pushing platform longevity because some people really care about it. It's a long way from being a smokescreen.

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Quote Originally Posted by scaryjim View Post
    Really?

    The last 4 desktops I built have all had a CPU upgrade in their lifetime. In the Intel cases, I've *had* to buy second hand because it was impossible to buy a new CPU for the motherboard in use.

    This Christmas someone is getting a completely new subsystem because my only upgrade option for their system would be a 5 year old second hand chip. That subsystem is on socket AM4 because that gives them the posibility of upgrading in 2 - 3 years' time ... which they almost certainly will.

    Your use case isn't the only one. AMD are pushing platform longevity because some people really care about it. It's a long way from being a smokescreen.
    If you're upgrading CPU's within a couple of years then one REALLY has to question just what you bought in the first place. Yes, an AMD CPU from 2 years ago probably warrants an upgrade, so I suppose it's a good thing their maintaining compatibility but all that does is highlight just how terrible their platform was 2 years ago. I guess if you're an AMD fanboi then it's something you might care about - but I don't think anyone with a 2 year old Core i5 has anything on their mind other than the next GPU.

    As for 2-3 years, lets not stretch it - they've already stated that 2020 will bring about the next socket change.

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Quote Originally Posted by rainman View Post
    Seriously, this whole motherboard/socket compatibility thing is just a smoke screen thrown up by the AMD fanbois and AMD are leveraging it for marketing purposes.

    When you upgrade and you dump between £500 and £1000 on your next rig then personally the only upgrade that I'm going to consider in the subsequent years is going to be either a graphics card or a larger SSD. Everything else I bought I would hope that I'm going to get a good 4-5 years out of. If you already built something based on a Core i3 or i5 then an upgrade to next years CPU doesn't hold sufficient benefit since framerates in games just aren't constrained by CPU. Everyone seems to pick on the fact that each new generation of Intel CPU only gives a modest uplift anyway, so that in itself is telling you that the bang for your buck lies in a next gen GPU upgrade and not your CPU, in which case motherboards, chipsets and sockets are all a moot point unless you're after something specific like the latest gen USB - in which case just buy a cheap add-in card to provide that must-have feature.

    An extreme example, but I just upgraded my Core i7-3930K (which was 6 years old) to a Core i9-7900X. Yes it's a lot of money but I'm not planning an upgrade to a motherboard or CPU for another 6 years, so I'd certainly hope there would be a chipset and socket update between now and then and the more the better, because that tells me that my chosen CPU brand is continually thinking about architecture from front to back and not holding onto anything legacy. There has to come a point where maintaining socket compatibility starts to hold a newer architecture back, and I honestly believe that AMD are playing this worthless card to pander to AMD fans at the potential cost to their own architecture down the line. To be honest, they're only making a commitment to the same socket for another couple of years which isn't far from what Intel have done anyway!

    Despite all the multi-core hype most people seem to have finally realised that where gaming performance is concerned then IPC is still the defining factor, so even if you bought last years quad core i5 it's still a tough call to honestly justify an upgrade to a hex core i5 other than for sheer bragging rights.
    Wow what a load of total rubbish.
    Firstly your forgetting people who are on a tight budget and can only afford an R3-1200 or athlon for the time being with their new build. In two or even three years they can buy a fresh Ryzen 2 CPU with a lot more performance.

    Secondly that last part about quadcore i5's vs hexcore i5's is hogwash. It's obvious that you didn't see any new benchmarks.
    I'd be furious if I bought a i5-7600k around a year ago. Those minimums are getting really bad.

    For reference just go check benchmarks of the latest games and stop talking out of your ass.
    Last edited by peterb; 05-12-2017 at 07:52 PM. Reason: Language

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Quote Originally Posted by rainman View Post
    If you're upgrading CPU's within a couple of years then one REALLY has to question just what you bought in the first place.
    As someone who doesn't come from money I research into getting a strong base platform but cheap out on my initial capital expenditure so I can get enough of what I want now to then build up on it in the future.

    Your use case is for people who have the Capital Expense capability in the first place to buy the bleeding edge right there and then. This year I was sorely tempted to get an Asus Prime Mobo but only get an R1500 then upgrade in Zen2.

    However, considering the language and what you highlight in your posts, you seem like you just don't like AMD and people who support them. Or have a lot of money and find it impossible to think how us lower classes operate.

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Quote Originally Posted by rainman View Post
    If you're upgrading CPU's within a couple of years then one REALLY has to question just what you bought in the first place. Yes, an AMD CPU from 2 years ago probably warrants an upgrade, so I suppose it's a good thing their maintaining compatibility but all that does is highlight just how terrible their platform was 2 years ago. I guess if you're an AMD fanboi then it's something you might care about - but I don't think anyone with a 2 year old Core i5 has anything on their mind other than the next GPU.

    As for 2-3 years, lets not stretch it - they've already stated that 2020 will bring about the next socket change.
    Buddy your not listening/reading correctly. They promised the same socket to 2020, no where do they mention that the'd change it on that mark.

    I can personally attest that my i5-4460 was giving me a horrible experience even when only recording with shadow play/relive. Lets not even start with lossless.
    I also have a lot of stuff running in the background. (two AV's, network, hardware monitoring)
    Not to mention multitasking on my system.

    Your scenario barely exists and only applies to casual or budget orientate gamers that literally only has games on their PC's and could be confused with consoles (which by the way has 8 <mod removed>cores)
    and yes by budget I mean entry level, the quad core i5 are now considered entry level by enthusiasts that actually do more than one <mod removed> thing on their PC's at a time.

    It obviously depends on what games you play, but never generalize your use case with that of everyone else.
    Last edited by peterb; 05-12-2017 at 07:44 PM. Reason: Language

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Quote Originally Posted by KN1GHT View Post
    Buddy your not listening/reading correctly. They promised the same socket to 2020, no where do they mention that the'd change it on that mark.
    Correct, so why does that also mean that they won't? They committed to 2020 as an arbitrary number, or perhaps you think they've already got their pipeline planned for the next 48 months? For their sake I hope they have! Come on, join the dots man.

    I can personally attest that my i5-4460 was giving me a horrible experience even when only recording with shadow play/relive. Lets not even start with lossless.
    I also have a lot of stuff running in the background. (two AV's, network, hardware monitoring)
    Not to mention multitasking on my system.
    So, lets re-visit my initial argument against being overly concerned with socket changes. I was implying that you get more bang for your buck on planning an upgrade to a GPU on a 2 year old mid-spec Intel platform than worrying about a socket change within the same time frame.

    So why <mod removed> are you using your 4 year old CPU as an argument against that. I upgraded a high spec CPU at 6 years (and to be completely honest I didn't really need to) so I would think it would stand to reason that a more budgeted oriented platform would be coming up for an upgrade a bit sooner. So at 4 years for a 4th gen i5 (and almost the cheapest variant of multiplier locked SKU you could have bought as a desktop part too) doesn't sound to me like you did too bad out of it. If your use case has changed then maybe it's time? Only you can know that, but lets not try and use your FOUR year old bottom of the range i5 part to prove my argument to not upgrade after TWO years.

    Your scenario barely exists and only applies to casual or budget orientate gamers that literally only has games on their PC's and could be confused with consoles (which by the way has 8 cores)
    and yes by budget I mean entry level, the quad core i5 are now considered entry level by enthusiasts that actually do more than one thing on their PC's at a time.

    It obviously depends on what games you play, but never generalize your use case with that of everyone else.
    My own use case is unimportant and only dictates my own starting point and my own technology choices. If you have a solid requirement for a particular level of performance then you buy the right tool for the job, it's really simple. I'm actually focussing my upgrade opportunities around the common business practice of making an asset purchase and depreciating it over a 4 to 5 year term and ensuring that what I buy lasts long enough to be effective over that term. Doing anything else has other implications because you're making an additional purchase before the asset is fully depreciated. Anyone making a business decision to purchase and then purchase again on the same asset within a couple of years would generally need a solid justification - which would most likely be as a result of a change in use, in which case all bets are off as you are now chasing a solution for a different application.
    Last edited by peterb; 05-12-2017 at 07:45 PM. Reason: Language

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Quote Originally Posted by rainman View Post
    If you're upgrading CPU's within a couple of years then one REALLY has to question just what you bought in the first place. Yes, an AMD CPU from 2 years ago probably warrants an upgrade, so I suppose it's a good thing their maintaining compatibility but all that does is highlight just how terrible their platform was 2 years ago. I guess if you're an AMD fanboi then it's something you might care about - but I don't think anyone with a 2 year old Core i5 has anything on their mind other than the next GPU.

    As for 2-3 years, lets not stretch it - they've already stated that 2020 will bring about the next socket change.
    Just did a quick check of your last score of posts or so.

    Nothing but attacking AMD or defending/bigging Intel, sprinkled with some router related posts.

    Including Threadripper, Vega, now Ryzen 2.

    My suspicion was aroused when you used the work Fanbois. Only "fanbois" ever use that word.

    Thus it is clear that regardless of what AMD produce, no matter how good, you will trash it. The same in reverse for Intel.

    This makes your opinion completely worthless to anyone and everyone if the subject involves AMD or Intel
    "In a perfect world... spammers would get caught, go to jail, and share a cell with many men who have enlarged their penises, taken Viagra and are looking for a new relationship."

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Narf narf narf!

    There will be always be one!

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Quote Originally Posted by badass View Post
    This makes your opinion completely worthless to anyone and everyone if the subject involves AMD or Intel
    Well if my argument is invalid you should have no trouble driving a bus through it. So why don't you 'man up' and engage, counter the argument and tell me I'm wrong? Instead of taking the easy way out ... ?

    I'm no sycophant and on any one day I'll buy whatever I feel is the right choice for me. If I have a downer on AMD then it's only because I truly feel that their offerings are second-rate - at this point in time. No one wants AMD to whoop Intel more than me, because we desperately need competition and it's currently a monopoly. For you, if you think that AMD are doing enough and it fits your budget then that's fine. But AMD being "close enough" to Intel or Nvidia just isn't enough. It's not competition and it won't drive down Intel or Nvidia's pricing. If you can't see that and you honestly think I'm just blatantly AMD bashing then you really are a fanboi ... and yes, fanboi is the correct term. AMD HAVE to do more, for all our sakes. They are obligated to hold Intels feet to the fire and make the market work properly, because there is no one else to do it.

    Join the debate or gtfo.

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Quote Originally Posted by rainman View Post
    If you're upgrading CPU's within a couple of years then one REALLY has to question just what you bought in the first place. ...
    I bought what I could afford, and was appropriate for my needs at the time. If the money I have available or my needs change, I can upgrade.

    I expect a computer platform to last at least 4 or 5 years; I've been known to keep desktops for a lot longer than that. In that time you could easily see two or three rounds of upgrades.

    Not everyone can drop the cash on a high end platform up front. So here's the bus I'll drive through your argument: for the cost of an i7 CPU you can buy mid-range CPU, mobo, RAM and GPU that will give a reasonable 1080p gaming experience at mid- to high-quality in most recent games (and a good experience in older games, which many people still play). For many people that's a no-brainer.

    And here's comes another bus (isn't that always the way?!) - like I said, don't assume that what works for you works for everyone. You might not care about upgrade paths, and that's absolutely fine. But I care about upgrade paths when I buy new computers. So either, you're wrong, or you're trying to tell me that I'm lying to myself and my views are irrelevant. So which is it?

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    Re: Ryzen 2 supported on AM4 confirms AMD product manager

    Quote Originally Posted by rainman View Post
    It's not competition and it won't drive down Intel or Nvidia's pricing
    But it already has...
    Feel free to message me if you find any bugs or have any suggestions.
    If you need me urgently, PM me
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