Need some help, getting confused lol

[NovaSphere]

Bit of a long post, sorry!

Well I've recently made a topic about my upcoming build (will be buying all in ~2 weeks, after my holiday)
Thing is, I haven't stopped reading, aswell as on this forums as on the internet, reading almost every review I could find and simply checking other people's builds and ideas.

The setup I ended up with is below in my sig, I was going for that, but that hasn't stopped me from checking other things. Though, the more I read, the more I checked, the more I started to doubt.
I always wanted a really good Nvidia card, I don't know why, but now I'm getting the feeling I'm going to a "to much based setup" on the Nvidia card, if you know what I mean. Making the rest of my setup fall behind just because I wanted that card so badly.

Now ATI came with their cards, and even though I'm a Nvidia 'fan', I can't deny this new 4800 series are damn awesome, they seem so damn nice, every reviews praises these cards.

So my doubt is big, I'm actually leaning towards the HD4870 now... In my sig is my original setup, I would have like 30 euro left if I would go with that setup, but now if I take away the GTX260 and put an ATI card in place, the HD4850 or the HD4870, I would save way more money... To upgrade other parts of my setup.

A little list of what I want to do with my setup, what I'm expecting and about my doubts;
- I play (or want to play) a lot of games, I use my PC for school work, but that's kind of all. I don't have any graphic related work or anything like that.
- My budget is arround 800 euro, but I need to buy it from www.centralpoint.nl
All this shops prices are without VAT, but I don't have to pay VAT when I order at this shop, also I'm getting a 10% discount on my end price.
- I have never overclocked something in my life (my computer now is far not good enough for anything like that), I'm not buying this PC to go on an overclock enterprise, though I'm tempted to try to overclock someday.
- I'm currently going for a single graphic card setup, but as I prefer Intel chipset based motherboards, in the future an upgrade to buy another card to go for crossfire is a nice thought. (and a nice option)
- I hardly know anything about motherboards, in my original setup I was going for the Asus P5Q Pro, since it seemed ok and was able to handle that setup, but still something tells me different...
- I'm probably going to get Windows Vista Premium or Ultimate from a friend, both are 64-bit, I know about the 32-bit limitations with memory, but I've also heard 64-bit seems to have some problems with certain drivers or programs that don't work or won't run smoothly?
- I will be buying with this setup a new monitor (as stated in my previous setup) which will be a 20" running on 1680x1050.
- When looking at the ATI HD4800 series, both cards seem to have a little 'heat' problem, something with the fan not running fast enough, and needed a BIOS update or something to fix it, any info on that?
- About the processor, I'm currently going for the Dual core E8400, but as I've read on this forums aswell as on some sites, many people plee for the Q6600, while others go for the Dual core... I'm really not so sure about my choice anymore, at this very moment, what would be better to get, a Dual or Quad core? And which one?
And when looking to the future, better to get a Dual or Quad core? And again, which one?
- I'm probably still going for the Sonata III, which includes the earthwatts 500W PSU. Unless I save a lot of money to be able to buy a seperate case and PSU.
- The harddisk and the memory are probably the only things I'm sure of.

I'm sorry for the long post, I'm also sure I will be having a lot more questions in the future, but this is kind of everything that's on my mind or bothering me =p

If anyone is able to answer or help me with some or even all of this questions/doubts, Id greatly appreciate it!

[Mithrandir]

Is it suppose to be http://www.centralpoint.nl rather than www.centralpoint.com?

If so and you're after an nVidia counterpart to the 4870, what about the 9800gtx? €186 for the MSI version

Scrub that. I think the 4870 is [much] faster than the 9800

[NovaSphere]

Is it suppose to be http://www.centralpoint.nl rather than www.centralpoint.com?

If so and you're after an nVidia counterpart to the 4870, what about the 9800gtx? €186 for the MSI version

Scrub that. I think the 4870 is [much] faster than the 9800

Yes was supposed to be .nl corrected it now, thanks for the heads up.

[Zhaoman]

Some quick answers for you Novasphere

Processor: a q6600 is a better investment for the future if you decide to overclock it heavily and run many intensive applications at once.
the e8400 is a better upgrade for the future because it is energy efficient and generally faster than the q6600 (at stock speeds), and if you decide to overclock it generally overclocks better too.

Mobo: you can't do crossfire on it because it has only one 16x pci-e lane; but, to answer your other question, it is absolutely capable of handling a good overclock.

GPU: both the 4870 and the GTX260 perform at around the same levels, the reviews vary from source to source but they generally average out at the same speeds; which means both of these cards would handle anything you throw at it for a long time at 1680x1050. The deciding factor should be price.

Your other choices are very good, and to be honest even if you went with your current setup I don't think you will have any regrets. I'm sure the other forum members will provide an even more in depth analysis

[NovaSphere]

Some quick answers for you Novasphere

Processor: a q6600 is a better investment for the future if you decide to overclock it heavily and run many intensive applications at once.
the e8400 is a better upgrade for the future because it is energy efficient and generally faster than the q6600 (at stock speeds), and if you decide to overclock it generally overclocks better too.

Mobo: you can't do crossfire on it because it has only one 16x pci-e lane; but, to answer your other question, it is absolutely capable of handling a good overclock.

GPU: both the 4870 and the GTX260 perform at around the same levels, the reviews vary from source to source but they generally average out at the same speeds; which means both of these cards would handle anything you throw at it for a long time at 1680x1050. The deciding factor should be price.

Your other choices are very good, and to be honest even if you went with your current setup I don't think you will have any regrets. I'm sure the other forum members will provide an even more in depth analysis

Thanks for the answers.

I'm kind of looking into the ATI cards now, and I'm wondering if this would be possible, and what would be better;
Get 2x Sapphire ATI Radeon HD 4850 512MB and run them on crossfire on this motherboard: Gigabyte GA-EP45-DS3
or get a single Gigabyte? or Asus? or Sapphire? Radeon HD 4870 512MB and run it on a different motherboard?

Would the CF be possible? Would my original setup (with the case, PSU etc.) be enough to power that system? Would it fit? What manufacturer would be best to pick for the ATI 4800 series?
What would be better to do? ~.~

[NovaSphere]

Would like the hear some more opinions

Currently I have either the setup written in my signature.

Or;
2x ATI Radeon HD 4850 512MB in Crossfire - on a Gigabyte GA-EP45-DS3 motherboard.
(Don't know which manufacturer from the card, I guess Sapphire is good)

Or; ATI Radeon HD 4870 512MB Single card - on a Asus P5Q Pro or Gigabyte GA-EP45-DS3 motherboard, or any other better motherboard, since I will save money if I got for this single card.
(Don't know again which manufacturer from the card, I guess again Sapphire would be good)

Sapphire, Gigabyte and Asus all 3 make these ATI cards, Asus is a little more expansive for both cards, Sapphire is cheapest on both, and Gigabyte is in the middle.

Still having the same questions/doubt from the first/previous posts ^^
Which setup would be the best? Especially curious on the CF setup, would my PSU be enough to power this? Won't I get problems with the heat? etc.
Is the motherboard good for CF and for a single card? Any other good motherboards out there for a single card setup, or maybe for a CF setup?

Any help appreciated

[NovaSphere]

Would like the hear some more opinions

Currently I have either the setup written in my signature.

Or;
2x ATI Radeon HD 4850 512MB in Crossfire - on a Gigabyte GA-EP45-DS3 motherboard.
(Don't know which manufacturer from the card, I guess Sapphire is good)

Or; ATI Radeon HD 4870 512MB Single card - on a Asus P5Q Pro or Gigabyte GA-EP45-DS3 motherboard, or any other better motherboard, since I will save money if I got for this single card.
(Don't know again which manufacturer from the card, I guess again Sapphire would be good)

Sapphire, Gigabyte and Asus all 3 make these ATI cards, Asus is a little more expansive for both cards, Sapphire is cheapest on both, and Gigabyte is in the middle.

Still having the same questions/doubt from the first/previous posts ^^
Which setup would be the best? Especially curious on the CF setup, would my PSU be enough to power this? Won't I get problems with the heat? etc.
Is the motherboard good for CF and for a single card? Any other good motherboards out there for a single card setup, or maybe for a CF setup?

Any help appreciated

Little bump ~.~

[staffsMike]

Get the HD4870 single card as it's more than enough for 1680 x 1050, in fact on Hd4850 would be just as good really, and get a better case with the saving.

[NovaSphere]

Get the HD4870 single card as it's more than enough for 1680 x 1050, in fact on Hd4850 would be just as good really, and get a better case with the saving.

What's wrong with the Sonata III though =p?

And if id Pick the HD4870 or the HD4850 in CF, in both cases would my PSU be enough for the job?

[staffsMike]

PSU will be up to the task of either of those cards, you might need a molex to PCie power adapter for the HD4870 though (seem to remember it needing two PCIe power's)

Sonata III is average in most senses of the word, nothing strictly wrong with it, but with these new hot running video cards you want the best cooling you can get really. Something like the coolermaster CM-690 and a 550W corsair VX or 520W Hx would work well.

[Webby]

If you did decide to go down the crossfire route (wouldn't really recommend it over a single 4870 though) then you will be better off going for an X38 or X48 chipset as these provide full duel 16x PCIe while the P45 will only offer 4x (even if it has duel 16x slots).

Other than that the Sonata 3 case is all right but nothing special (good on a budget though) for the money you would save buying a 4850 over the 4870 you could get a better PSU and case combination.

[Zhaoman]

You need to keep in mind that to make CrossFire work at best levels you need a motherboard with 2 PCi-E x16 lanes. The Asus P5Q pro only has one PCi-e x16 lane and one PCi-E x8 lane.

For you, I think the best option is to buy a HD4850 now with the P5Q Pro. Then after a couple of months upgrade it to a HD4870 X2 or a 55nm GTX280.

In fact, I think that you would be more than happy with an HD4850 and realise that you don't need to upgrade at all. Remember that the 4850 was competing with nVidia's top end card, the 9800GTX. Only because of the pricing of the 4850 did nVidia drop the price of 9800GTX. If 4850 wasn't released, the 9800GTX would still be considered a top end card and would still retail at £200.

The HD4870 provides 20% more performance for 50% more price.

500w is plenty for CrossFire/SLi, but if you plan on overclocking heavily then a bit more power will make it safer. Most CrossFire/SLi systems don't draw more than 350w.

[NovaSphere]

You need to keep in mind that to make CrossFire work at best levels you need a motherboard with 2 PCi-E x16 lanes. The Asus P5Q pro only has one PCi-e x16 lane and one PCi-E x8 lane.

For you, I think the best option is to buy a HD4850 now with the P5Q Pro. Then after a couple of months upgrade it to a HD4870 X2 or a 55nm GTX280.

In fact, I think that you would be more than happy with an HD4850 and realise that you don't need to upgrade at all. Remember that the 4850 was competing with nVidia's top end card, the 9800GTX. Only because of the pricing of the 4850 did nVidia drop the price of 9800GTX. If 4850 wasn't released, the 9800GTX would still be considered a top end card and would still retail at £200.

The HD4870 provides 20% more performance for 50% more price.

500w is plenty for CrossFire/SLi, but if you plan on overclocking heavily then a bit more power will make it safer. Most CrossFire/SLi systems don't draw more than 350w.

I understand the thing about the PCIe a bit more now lol
Well it's good to know that PSU would be enough, I'm looking into buying a single HD4870, and a better motherboard, already read for future CF or overclocking. With the saved money from not going CF straight away I'm looking in getting a different PC case and another PSU.

At the moment I'm looking at the PSU Antec 650 Watt Power Supply EA 650, it should be more than enough for this system, but also enough for any future changes. Would go for the single HD4870 on a Gigabyte GA-EP45-DS3 motherboard, it's a bit of expansive motherboard for this I think, but from what I've read it's a very good one also, running a X48 chip and it's able to run CF on both x16 I believe.
Which leaves me some money for a case, thinking of the Cooler Master CM690, but not sure yet about cases, don't need some fancy one, but prefer a good looking one though

(650W PSU because I'm really getting interested in giving Overclocking a try, aswell as room for future upgrades)

If anyone else has something to mention or advise, please do so, always good to hear more opinions.
Anyhow, thanks for the replies ^^