When watercooling goes bad.. [added EM pics]

[dangel]

Can't remember where I seen it, but I do remember when searching for info that people on various forums with similar set-ups seem to get differing results.

I added in one length of XSPC tubing about 6 months ago with the existing Masterclear tubing installed 5 months previously, and it still appears free of any build up.

Ah good to know. Well my new res is here and i've got some alternate innovatek tubing to try so hopefully I will get some time to swap it all out - that combined with the new fluid might solve it. If it doesn't i'm going back to redline water wetter because really it's never given me any problems. Half tempted to run it on plain water this weekend to avoid doing a build till next week as i'll only have a small amount of time due to finishing our dining room in time for xmas..

Have to say though that HPD cleaner did make the pipes crystal clear again.

[Macadee]

Still using Valvoline Zerex with deionized myself, bought a job lot years ago.

[Pob255]

Didn't Cray used to cool their supercomputers with hydrogen peroxide?

I think I am starting to see why

Actually if I remember correctly they used Fluorinert which is a very stable fluorocarbon (FC) compound, basically a hydrocarbon fluid (oil) with fluorine combined into the molecules.
ie no corrosion or organic microbes to worry about.

[dangel]

Sounds wonderful - where can I get some?

XT-1 has turned up, along with another bottle of HPD just in case (plus i'll use it when i change the fluid again) and some innovatek tubing (but only 3m of it so i might be short of enough).

Haven't had any time to get my 'sample' down to the lab though but i'm pretty set on plasticiser given all the evidence.

[Pob255]

contact m3 http://www.3m.com/product/informatio...ic-Liquid.html or ebay http://www.ebay.com/itm/3M-FC-40-FLU...-/110716728982

But I'm not sure what UK environmental and hazardous material laws and regulations you need to deal with.

Or if it would work in normal watercooling parts for that matter

[dangel]

Given my level of chemistry i think i'll stick with conventional stuff

Decided to rebuild later today - don't want to risk re-contaminating the system now it's clear..

[Pob255]

You know what you could do is use a scientific approach.

You know actually test and monitor results

Start off with just water no added things, run that for a little while and see what happens.
then add a coil
then remove the coil and put in the additive
then both coil and additive (coil before additive as that doesn't require draining and flushing out the system)

How long did it take for all that crud to form btw? if it's just a day before you start seeing effects that'll be ok, if it take a month before you start to see signs then that would make step by step testing more tricky and long winded.

[dangel]

A couple of months to get that bad.

Speaking of the scientific approach... here's some images using some scanning electron microscopy of the buildup (scraped off the coils):





At a lower mag:





Note the crystalline structure..

[dangel]

And here's the composition of the materials (via X ray):





Lots of zinc..

[dangel]

I won't be using silver coils - i'm sticking with this premix (so i can't stuff up the chemistry) and some new tubing. If it reoccurs then.. we'll see.

Hopefully the above is of interest to people wondering what this stuff is..

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Seems to mostly Zinc oxide! Supposedly it is used as a coating for metals and plastics after a quick Google search. Maybe,it is the tubing then? Have you examined the surface of the tubing??

[dangel]

Seems to mostly Zinc oxide! Supposedly it is used as a coating for metals and plastics after a quick Google search. Maybe,it is the tubing then? Have you examined the surface of the tubing??

Problem is i've cleaned the system now - but when i strip it down i'll see if i've got some remaining deposits and maybe strip some tubing for a look. Going to struggle to have time next week though as i'm away on business

[scaryjim]

Too much zinc for just zinc oxide, although I imagine it's got a fair amount of zinc oxide in it, along with a mix of other metal oxides and some metal powder (perhaps from the scraping?). Definitely some kind of chemical reaction occurring though (unless you've deliberately added ZnO to your loop?!). Also a modest amount of copper in there. Whatever you had in that loop, I'd strongly suggest you don't do it again - looks like the loop has been partially eating itself!

Be interesting to see some NMR Spectroscopy results Also I'd check whether any of your fittings are zinc coated. Tubes sound like the most likely culprit though...

[dangel]

Don't do it again? No **** lol!!

It may be a while but i'll take some of this tubing and analyse it (probably after xmas now) to see what's actually in it to begin with - given someone else had the same problem with same tubing i'm hoping that's all it is. At some point i'll open the blocks too but i'm hopeful there's no damage. Minor metal traces are to be expected (the blocks are copper) but the zinc here is way beyond the norm. Still it's interesting to have some real info versus guesswork isn't it?

When I said "scraped" i meant practically fell off when pushed gentle with fingernail. This stuff turns to powder at the lightest touch.

Just heading off to begin draining and stripping the blocks and rad and then it's plumbing time (at therefore not gaming time shucks)

Please feel free to add thoughts though this is an extremely interesting (although annoying) thread (imho)

[Pob255]

% by weight zinc is a lot heavier than oxygen
zinc oxide is ZnO so one part Zn one part O
molecular mass of Zn is 65
molecular mass of O is 15
so roughly for every 100g of ZnO 81.5g would be Zn and 18.5g

So yes it looks like You've got zinc oxide, question is where it came from.
Personally speaking the tubes sound very unlikely, as ZincOxide is primarily used in metallurgy, in welding, soldering and for anti-corrosion measures.
To me the block or rad would be a more likely candidate, could be fluid however

edit: only other thing I can think of is that zincoxide is used as a pigment, have you used coloured fluid in the past?
That or some chemical reaction is capturing raw zinc and it's getting dumped out of the fluid as oxide
Could be someting like the silver acting as a catalyst.

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Plastics, such as polyethylene naphthalate (PEN), can be protected by applying zinc oxide coating. The coating reduces the diffusion of oxygen with PEN. Zinc oxide layers can also be used on polycarbonate (PC) in outdoor applications. The coating protects PC form solar radiation and decreases the oxidation rate and photo-yellowing of PC.

That is from Wikipedia.