Entry Level Workstation Build, sub £1000

[ste852]

Hello everyone, I need some help.

My sister has asked me if I can build a computer for her husband for him to use for his uni work. Now I'm fine with building gaming PC's, but workstation ones are kinda new territory for me so I was wondering if people can help advise me on what parts are best to order. Or even just throw together a list of parts in PC Part Picker or something.

He needs to be able to use the following programs.

Solid Works
Fusion 360
Photoshop

Their budget is £1000 for a full tower PC minus the case. If people can help me out here it would be much appreciated.

Thanks.

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Zen3 is out next month,so it might be worth waiting for a few more weeks??

WRT to the CPUs,Intel and AMD trade blows depending on the Solid Works workload:
https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/ar...formance-1816/

However,AWD-IT sells the Ryzen 9 3900 non-X for less money than the Core i7 10700K,and the Ryzen 9 3900 is close in performance to the Ryzen 9 3900X:
https://www.tomshardware.com/uk/revi...eview-eco-mode
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qi96epj7SP0

Solidworks got some updates after 2018,which helped with AMD GPUs:
https://techgage.com/article/amd-rad...uper-proviz/5/
https://www.engineering.com/DesignSo...cs-Engine.aspx

So if they are running a newer version of Solid Works(2019 and onwards) an AMD GPU looks better value,if its an earlier version Nvidia is better. However,the best choice might be one of the RTX Quadros but these cost a lot of money. The consumers cards will run but AFAIK but are not officially supported. So maybe get a stop-gap GPU now,and see if a better one can get added at a later date??

Not sure if the newer versions of Fusion 360 use a GPU for accelleration,but the 2018 version didn't:
https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/fusio...n/td-p/8348518


This is what I would look at:
https://www.awd-it.co.uk/msi-mag-b55...ocket-am4.html

When you add the Ryzen 9 3900,it should come to around £487. 32GB of this RAM:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Crucial-Bal...rs&sr=1-9&th=1

3200MHZ RAM is the maximum officially rated speed for the Ryzen CPU. That will be around £125. The optimal RAM speed will be 3600MHZ,so another £10~£15 for that if you don't mind doing some tweaks in the BIOS.

This 1TB NVME SSD would do the trick:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/ADATA-SX820...mputers&sr=1-1

This 4TB HDD for storing files:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Toshiba-X30...mputers&sr=1-2

So far the total comes to around £850.

WRT to the GPU AMD and Nvidia are refreshing their ranges also over the next few months,so maybe an RX570 8Gb will do as a stop-gap GPU:
https://www.awd-it.co.uk/asus-rog-st...xoCKaMQAvD_BwE

Maybe if you can get a decent deal on a GTX1660 or GTX1660 Super,it might be worth considering?? However,the newer AMD and Nvidia GPUs will have raytracing support so perhaps it will be a useful addition to rendering workloads. However,it will be a few months until the whole range is released for both companies.

A decent Gold rated PSU should do the job:
https://www.box.co.uk/Seasonic-Core-...hoCRrgQAvD_BwE
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Corsair-Cer...mputers&sr=1-1

So the total will be just above £1000 with an RX570.

I didn't suggest a case,as I suspect one has already been chosen?? You also would need a copy of Windows too.

Edit!!

The AWD-IT bundle will come with the AMD stock cooler. The Ryzen 9 3900 is only a 65W TDP CPU,but you could add a better CPU cooler.

If you want to go below £1000,look at the MSI B550 A-PRO instead of the B550 MAG Tomahawk,and perhaps 16GB of 3200MHZ DDR4 for now?

[DanceswithUnix]

Does the budget include a monitor?

I would say largely build it like a decent gaming rig as most of the same rules apply. Cat's list is a pretty good start.

I would ask if there is any requirement for lots of storage. Games and video chew through disk space pretty fast, but engineering usually doesn't. Our entire company runs of a NAS with only a couple of TB storage to back us up. I suspect you can lose the hard drive. One can always be added later.

Some people like their workstations to be robust. If that's the case, ECC ram is needed which adds a bit to the cost and is a bit slower: amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07BGDG5ZP/ and on a budget needs to be paired with an Asus or Asrock AM4 motherboard to get support.
Other people don't give a monkeys about ECC ram, in which case Cat's link is good.

As a baseline, a Ryzen 3600 and 16GB of ram should be usable.

[ik9000]

how complex in solidworks? There are huge assemblies with rendering and then there are more basic use cases. Needs differ between the two. you can run solidworks on quite modest specs if you don't need realistic rendering and fast FE of large multi-part assemblies.

Edit: Just to give some context. My work machine is an i7-6700 with 32GB RAM and a lowly R5-430. It runs FE packages fine. Clunky on the graphics side when things get too detalied but otherwise fine. RAM usage rarely hits anywhere near 32GB that I've seen. My laptop has i7-6750(?) and iris HD530(?) graphics 16GB RAM and runs photoshop comfortably. My wife's has only 8GB RAM and it still runs fine on a 7250U processor. My win7 machine handles photoshop on an i7-870 (no typo), 16GB of DDR3 and a GTX460 1GB GPU.

For uni work chances are they won't be pushing the limits on the projects they'll be working on. I would say 16GB RAM (2x8GB), any modern processor of quad-core 8 thread and better, and a graphics card of min 1GB buffer will suffice.

[ik9000]

re mobo. How long to keep the machine? Can I suggest keeping the tomahawk if at all possible. The extra cost spread over a year or two becomes insignificant and it is a much better board from what I can gather.

[Xlucine]

CAD and basic FEA is pretty simple to run on modern hardware, a haswell i5 got me through uni. Any modern reasonably high core count CPU will be more than enough, and any modern GPU will happily render solidworks. If you're doing CFD (and not just an "intro to CFD" class) then you will always want more cores and more RAM, but generally unis have some on-campus HPC for that kind of work. My skylake U-series laptop could open the CAD for my final year project, but I wouldn't recommend a dual core chip with integrated graphics for uni engineering work.

I second the query about storage levels, the files for my third year dissertation only came to ~5GB total and that was including full node-by-node FEA output for Modal Assurance Criterion comparisons. The 4TB spinning rust isn't strictly necessary

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

The thing is a relative is asking the OP to not only spec,but build the PC. Hence I don't think the relative is really into PC hardware and building PCs. So it will fall on the OP to push any upgrades for the system too. At least if you go with a good spec now,its out of sight,out of mind for the next few years. Things such as disks and GPUs might be easy enough to just plug in - a CPU not so much for most people. Even with RAM,again sure you could go with less now,and then upgrade later on. But the issue is you might end up running two different sets of RAM,which means you will need to tweak BIOS settings,which again the OP will need to handle. Also,AFAIK dual DIMMs should be easier to run,and DDR4 pricing is currently quite low.

Its different if you want to muck around with PCs,and upgrade them as you grow your needs. It's what I do,but I know people who will only upgrade once every 5~10 years.

Edit!!

Interestingly enough the Ryzen 9 3900 from AWD-IT is core for core cheaper than a Ryzen 5 3600. So say over a 4 year course,I am uncertain whether trying to save £150ish quid makes any real sense. It should realistically cover all bases. The RX570 8GB also is probably the best value GPU out there at £130ish. Even a GT1030 or RX550 is £60~£80 and are a waste of money. A GTX1650 is £130.

Its a shame you can't buy a Ryzen 7 4700G,because it might have been a good compromise in this scenario. Maybe waiting next month(or the month after) for the Ryzen 5000 series,might have the APUs officially launched with the new CPUs?? It could also push down current Zen2 pricing.

The ECC RAM might be an option if required. I hadn't really thought of that TBF.

[ste852]

Thanks for the input guys.
A little more information on the type of work my brother in law will be doing. He is studying Horology and needs to create each individual component of a watch or clock, save them each individually and then put them all together for a final assembled version. Whether this is being rendered graphicly I'm not sure but I don't think so since he is making do with a very basic laptop for the moment.

CAT
That's some awesome info you have thrown my way, all be in a little intimidating lol, Bottom line is though from having a quick look through everything is more cores = better (within reason) and less of a focus on the GPU, Originally before I started pricing things up I was hoping to go for something like a R7 2700 on a X or B4xx Mobo with 16GB or RAM and an mid range GPU, but since it seems I can cut back on the GPU more the newer CPU's are an option? Lots of storage will be a must a think though.

DancexwithUnix
Budget doesn't include a monitor as it will be linked up to his TV, not ideal I know but it's what he want's to do the work on.
Yes there is a requirement for storage, I was thinking of getting him sorted with 2TB for now and then add to it later on.
I don't think he is too fussed about ECC ram, it was worth a mention though.

IK9000
As I mentioned at the begining of this post he is doing Horology so all the solidworks will be as complex as what a watch or a clock will be, I'm not sure myself how complex that is lol.
As for how long he will use the machine for will probably be about 3 years, he will most likely keep the same machine for the duration of his course.

Xlucine
Unfortunatly his uni doesn't have very good on site computers, which is suprising to me since they just splashed out on a new CNC machine for the student to learn on. But ultimatly my brother in law has a strong work ethic and will be wanting do do everything he can at home to make more time at uni for more hands on learning instead of computer based stuff.
Did it really only take that much storage to get you though Uni? I was originally thinking he was going to need a fair amount or storage but i'm not so sure now.

CAT
Your spot on, I will be having to maintain and do all future upgrades to this PC so I will be wanting to get him sorted for the time being and then leave him to it for as long as possible.

[ste852]

Oh is Win 10 Pro worthwhile for this or will Win 10 Home be fine?

[ik9000]

Pro every time IMO

[ste852]

This is what I have come up with so far as a starting point.

https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/zwGz8M

[ik9000]

that OEM pro licence seems overpriced from what I can remember.
also going B450 and ryzen 2000 series is a false economy. Go B450 if you must (B550 is much better, and will be supported for another generation at least) but either way stick a 3000 series chip in it. They are much better processors. I'd rather have a 3600X than a 2700X and they are roughly the same cost to buy.
You're missing a graphics card. I don't think either the 2700x or 3600x have onboard GPU.

edit: yup. Overpriced win 10. See Scan's offering here:
https://www.scan.co.uk/shop/computer...windows-10-pro
OEM £135, full retail licence £185

[DanceswithUnix]

Yes there is a requirement for storage, I was thinking of getting him sorted with 2TB for now and then add to it later on.

For the cost of a 1TB SSD and a 4TB HDD you can get a 2TB SSD. I don't miss having a whining HDD in modern machines.

I would go for a Zen2 as minimum for engineering use tbh. The 3000 series has much larger caches and much better floating point units, so I would expect a 3600 to be a better choice than a 2700X. For a machine at home they are also easier to cool, that is part of what makes that 3900 CPU that Cat recommended so interesting, you get plenty of cores but still in an east to cool low TDP.

OFC in 2 weeks time AMD will announce new CPUs. That could drive prices down on existing parts, or introduce new parts that are a better bet. If you can wait, I would wait.

[ste852]

IK9000
There is a GPU in the List, there is a RX580 in there. but yeah I agree on the over inflated price for win 10 Pro, Thanks for finding it cheaper.

DanceswithUnix
Well in order to keep cost's down and storage capacity up I'm opting for a SSD boot drive and a HDD for storage.
I'll see how long my brother in law can wait for the system but he is already back at Uni so I'm not sure how long he can wait. but like you said if he can hold off for a few more weeks, prices might drop with new hardware being announced.

Updated parts list.
https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/bWn4FG

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

IK9000
There is a GPU in the List, there is a RX580 in there. but yeah I agree on the over inflated price for win 10 Pro, Thanks for finding it cheaper.

DanceswithUnix
Well in order to keep cost's down and storage capacity up I'm opting for a SSD boot drive and a HDD for storage.
I'll see how long my brother in law can wait for the system but he is already back at Uni so I'm not sure how long he can wait. but like you said if he can hold off for a few more weeks, prices might drop with new hardware being announced.

Updated parts list.
https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/list/bWn4FG

The Ryzen 9 3900 is £325 on AWD-IT. This is why I ignored the Ryzen 7 3700X. So 50% more cores for £40 more. Also AWD-IT had the RX570 8GB for £130,which is not much slower than the RX580 8GB,and the money saved is better put towards the CPU.

Also,I would just go with a larger NVME SSD,as its easy to plug in an extra HDD.

AWD-IT also are doing this offer with the MSI MAG B550M Mortar:
https://www.awd-it.co.uk/msi-mag-b55...therboard.html

You get a free Adata SU630 SSD too. The B550M Bazooka is a decent motherboard for the price:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wuPH9pCCK-E&t=651s

Also Ryzen is more picky with RAM,and the Crucial set uses Micron E-die so is a safe bet to go with. But even if the RAM defaults to a lower speed,it should still be OK I suppose.

Another thing is that Windows license is overpriced - many unis might do access to cheaper software.

Edit!!

This is what I would go for:

https://www.awd-it.co.uk/msi-mag-b55...therboard.html
https://www.awd-it.co.uk/asus-rog-st...hics-card.html

So a Ryzen 9 3900,MSI B550M Bazooka,Adata SU630 250GB and Asus RX570 8GB for around £580.

The RAM,the Crucial E-die set is around £125. So around £705. The Seasonic and Corsair both are around the same price,so that is £785. You can save a few quid going for the 550W version:
https://www.awd-it.co.uk/corsair-tx5...020133-uk.html

DVD rewriter is around £15,so thats around £800.

You can get another 1TB NVME SSD for applications,etc. The SN550 1TB is cheaper but slower than the Adata SX8200 Pro,but you save around £15:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/WD-Blue-SN5...1031566&sr=8-1

So roughly around £900 in total.

[DanceswithUnix]

Another vote for the RX570. I have personally bought a couple of these, they are fast enough for most uses (I have one in a VR rig), come with plenty of vram and the fans switch off doing boring desktop stuff to make the machine quieter:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/MSI-Radeon-...dp/B0785Q6DYP/


Edit: One user did decide they wanted to use an Adobe video editing system that was CUDA based, which was a bit of a change from "I want to play with OpenCL". But you can't win them all