Nice place, unless you are gay...

[DaBeeeenster]

The Scottish Tourism Board is understandably proud of Scotland's tradition of hospitality. "A warm welcome. Guaranteed," says its website, VisitScotland.com. They might think of altering that guarantee following the news that the owner of a Highland guesthouse refused a gay couple a double room because he didn't want "poofs" performing "unnatural acts in my home". "We do not have a problem with your personal sexual deviation, that is up to you," wrote Tom Forrest in an email to two gay male Londoners who had tried to book a double room at the Cromasaig guesthouse in Kinlochewe, Wester Ross. "You are welcome to our twin room if you wish, but we will not condone your perversion." Now that's what I call a warm welcome.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0...251168,00.html

What do people think about this? It's quite a funny article actually - worth a read...

[Rave]

LOL- well I read the article expecting to be outraged, and in fact it cheered me up a great deal. Having read scare stories in my teens about gay people being beaten up and victimised etc. I decided a long time ago that I'd always stand up against descrimination. In the ten years since, I have never once seen any active homophobia; admittedly I'm not gay, but I work and often drink in Central London so if it was widespread I think I would have come across some by now.

Whatever the Daily Mail would have us believe, I honestly think we are easily one of the most tolerant nations in the world.

Rich :¬)

[0iD]

I dont know, when I was at school my best mate turned out to be gay. I think he only told me in the end to stop me trying to pair him up with girls. Trouble was he told more than just me, word got out & his last year of school was unbearable for him. With exam pressure, bullying etc he ended up taking his own life despite my best efforts. Kids can be so ignorant & evil.

I think though we, as a nation are much more accepting of homosexuality & I, like Rich haven't witnessed much descrimination towards gays. I do however think it's a regional thing. The further south you get, the more gay tolerant people (seem to me) to get.

[Stolly]

I dont know, when I was at school my best mate turned out to be gay. I think he only told me in the end to stop me trying to pair him up with girls. Trouble was he told more than just me, word got out & his last year of school was unbearable for him. With exam pressure, bullying etc he ended up taking his own life despite my best efforts. Kids can be so ignorant & evil.

God thats a terrible story.

Not sure about tolerance towards gays decreasing as you move further north, in Manchester there is the famous Canal Street which is actually quite intolerant towards straight people since some bars only allow gays in. In Leeds as well there are/were some well known mixed / gay nights and now has an area that has bars with a large proportion of gay customers.

[Zathras]

The worst homophobia I've come across has actually been on certain message boards on the internet. Same goes for blatant rascism and support of far-right parties. Fortunately I've not come across such rampant homophobia in real life, nor have I met such bigotted people. One thing that does irritate is how quick people will bring up the sexual act when hearing someone is gay or seeing a couple together. If someone declares themselves as straight you don't imagine them getting the jiggy on do you? Well, most people don't. So why does it have to be the first thing people think about when hearing someone's gay? Why does one's distaste of the actual sexual act have to cloud their views of an individual? Personally I find the idea of someone such as DaBeeenster doing anything remotely sexual pretty abhorrent and disgusting, in fact think I'm just about to throw up just mentioning it, but that doesn't stop me thinking he's a top bloke.

[Saracen]

Personally, I don't care which way someone swings provided they don't flaunt it under my nose, and I don't want it flaunted under my nose whether they're straight or gay.

However, I've got some sympathy for this guest-house owner. SOME sympathy, I said, before you all jump on me.

Clearly, this bloke has some firm views on this matter and his website DOES make his stance clear. Whether we agree with his views or not, he's entitled to hold them.

So, if he's entitled to hold views, does it cause a problem when he expresses them. Well, providing the views are legal, it should not. So far, so good.

What about when his views impact on other people, like imposing conditions on SOME (gay) guests at his B&B? Well, then we're starting to get into the area of discrimination. But has anyone established WHY he holds these views? Maybe, just maybe it's a result of a firm religious belief and, as I understand it, some religions do take a dim view (officially at least) of homosexuality. Maybe this guy is very religious?

If so, then is his stance that gays are welcome, provided they have a twin room not a double, more understandable? After all, should we expect this chap (if he is religious) to compromise his religious beliefs?

Who's rights do we give prioirty to? The right of gays to share a double bed or the right of the landlord to uphold his religious beliefs in his own property? Should we be intolerant of his right to religious belief - after all, religion overrides many things in this country and many exceptions to other laws are made on religious grounds.

Note : I have no idea if the basis for this chap's stance is religious or not, but from the tone of his remarks, it sounded to me like it might well be.

Maybe this issue is not as clearcut as we would think, at first glance?

[directhex]

be interesting to get a pair of attractive lesbians to try & book a room, see the welcome they receive

[Rave]

Maybe this issue is not as clearcut as we would think, at first glance?

It seems perfectly clear cut to me- he's entitled to refuse bookings from gay people, and every non-bigoted person in the country is entitled to stay at another guesthouse.

Rich :¬)

P.S. OiD, sorry to hear about your friend. What a heartbreaking story.

[daniel_owen_uk]

be interesting to get a pair of attractive lesbians to try & book a room, see the welcome they receive

"Complementary video camera maam?"

I don't know about all this its a little unfair, am I no longer allowed to be against same sex relationships? Does that make me homophobic?

What is society saying "you can not like it if you want but tough you have to treat gays the same way as straight people anyway"?

Maybe its becoming an archaic way of thinking but personally I still believe that intercourse is godly designed for reproduction, and thus gay people are ungodly.

Homophobia is the fear of or contempt for lesbians or gay men, or the behavior based on these fears. What says this guy has any fear? Surely if he disagree's its his right to act upon those believes in his own house? If a Jew said he didn't want people to eat pork in his house nobody would blink an eyelid.

I am not homophobic I just don't agree with same sex relationships.

[Rave]

I am not homophobic I just don't agree with same sex relationships.

Well, let's say for the sake of argument that you run a guesthouse. If a gay couple turn up and have gay sex in their room how exactly does that affect you?

Rich :¬)

[Rave]

I don't know about all this its a little unfair, am I no longer allowed to be against same sex relationships? Does that make me homophobic?

Yes.

What is society saying "you can not like it if you want but tough you have to treat gays the same way as straight people anyway"?

Well, it depends what your descrimination against gay people entails. If you refuse to give them a job, that's against the law AFAIK. If you refuse to let them stay at your guesthouse, then you are within your rights.

Maybe its becoming an archaic way of thinking but personally I still believe that intercourse is godly designed for reproduction, and thus gay people are ungodly.

Right, well I hope you enjoy the dozen or so times you have sex in your life, make them count mate. I personally am an atheist, but I think that if God does actually exist, then he wouldn't have made sex so enjoyable if he didn't want us to to have it.

I am not homophobic I just don't agree with same sex relationships.

Well, yes, if you translate the word exactly from the Greek then it means someone who is scared of homosexuals. In practice, it has been widely used to describe those who simply dislike them for a long time.

Rich :¬)

[Alex]

There is a big difference between not liking homosexual relationships and not liking homosexuals though. I don't personally like the idea of homosexual relationsips, in fact I find the idea quite nasty, but it has never led me to dislike someone because they were homosexual, in fact one of my best friends is. Just clarifying.

[DRI]

As a gay woman I must say I've hardly ever experienced any sort of descrimination. I think people in general seem much more accepting of gay female than gay men. Is this because of men's general 'lesbian sex' fantasy? Working in a predominantly male environment for so long I just get that impression.

[daniel_owen_uk]

Right, well I hope you enjoy the dozen or so times you have sex in your life, make them count mate. I personally am an atheist, but I think that if God does actually exist, then he wouldn't have made sex so enjoyable if he didn't want us to to have it.

That made me and my girlfriend chuckle cheers m8 If he had made it horrible how long do u think the human race would last? Maybe I should have said primarly designed, slight oversight on my part.

ab1385 made a great point that I didn't clarify, I don't dislike gay or lesbian people at all, I simply just don't like same sex relationships. I also made the mistake of saying "gay people are ungodly" that sentence should read "gay relationships are ungodly".

I work in a company of 50 people with 5 lesbians, I get on with them as well as I do the rest of the people I work with and one in particular better than most of the straight people, and before you ask I am not attracted to her in any way.

My main point is that homophobia should be reserved for people that dislike (or fear/have contemp for) gay or lesbian people and its my worry that we are extending it to people that dislike same sex relationships.

Well, let's say for the sake of argument that you run a guesthouse. If a gay couple turn up and have gay sex in their room how exactly does that affect you?

It means, like I said, I have no right to enforce my beliefs in my own home.

[petrefax]

.....One thing that does irritate is how quick people will bring up the sexual act when hearing someone is gay or seeing a couple together. If someone declares themselves as straight you don't imagine them getting the jiggy on do you? Well, most people don't. So why does it have to be the first thing people think about when hearing someone's gay?.....

i have found, in my limited experience that some gay people do make an issue of this themselves, by wishing to discuss their sexuality at the drop of a hat - i am heterosexual, i have very rarely, if ever, felt the need to "discuss my sexuality"

i like women - there, i said it! i don't need to constantly discuss this & mention it at every opportunity, i don't feel compelled to mention to people i barely know that i am heterosexual, i just am - why then do some gay people feel the need to mention their gayness? it sometimes appears that poeple are trying to illicit a response

[Rave]

i like women - there, i said it! i don't need to constantly discuss this & mention it at every opportunity, i don't feel compelled to mention to people i barely know that i am heterosexual, i just am - why then do some gay people feel the need to mention their gayness? it sometimes appears that poeple are trying to illicit a response

Elicit. That may be true, but it's also irrelevant, as the vast majority of gay people don't act that way. To a certain extent, gay people have good reason to let people know they are gay; if an attractive lesbian goes to a party then the likelihood is that unless she tells everyone she's gay, she'll get chatted up by a bunch of chaps in whom she has no interest which would be tedious. She'd probably get chatted up anyway in fact, but I hope you see what I mean.

ab1385 made a great point that I didn't clarify, I don't dislike gay or lesbian people at all, I simply just don't like same sex relationships.

Well that doesn't really make any sense to me- if you don't dislike gay people why are you bothered about what they get up to in their private lives?

It means, like I said, I have no right to enforce my beliefs in my own home.

No, that wasn't what I asked. You clearly do have a right to enforce your beliefs in your own home. What I asked was how does what they do behind closed doors affect you?

Rich :¬)