Road to SFFs

[Biscuit]

I was thinking maybe 4.0Ghz; that'll be plenty fast; faster than anything I have owned if a smaller AIO will be fine I may get two and consider slapping it on the GFX (with NZXT G10).

Shouldnt be a problem with a 3570K or a 4670K. I got mine up to about 4.6 or 4.7 when i really pushed it but i think i have been lucky on the silicone lottery.

Really? I thought the stock fans were half decent I was considering the Corsair Air series (the apparently high static pressure ones) just because they are fancy looking.

It depends which model you get, you would have to look them up individually as they dont put the same stock fans on all models. The H100i used the Air series i believe but whatever those ones where i had on the 100... erggghhhhhh

Ah, how are those Piranhas? the specs on them look good do they live up to it?

Better than the stock ones, not as good as gentle typhoons or noctuas though.

[Pob255]

Ah thanks very helpful Biscuit Thermaltake Smart series is made by Sirtec (never heard of them) and most others like that Sharkoon one is made by FSP which is trustworthy

Be Quiet one is made by HEC, which is decent too.

Also it seems Coolermaster VS has teamed up with Seasonic, which is a good sign. So any one of those seem good I'll skip the G series.

I use this one it's more up to date http://www.realhardtechx.com/index_archivos/Page541.htm and links to reviews
The VS series is from CWT not seasonic, seasonic was the old VX series, avoid the VS series, they are built to budget and one of the worst CWT units in some time.
EDIT: ignore I thought you meant the corsair VS
The Coolermaster VS series is Enhance Electronics the V series is seasonic, both are good makes

HEC quality can vary their high end units are good but some of their budget units can be a bit ropey, anything 80+ bronze rated or better from them tends to be good.

One thing that would be good to look at it the silverstone modular psu's the reason being that they also make a short cable set esp for SFF cases
http://www.scan.co.uk/products/500w-...fan-atx-v23-ps
http://www.scan.co.uk/products/silve...es-100-modular
Granted not a super cheap option, although the short cable set might work on other psu's but I cannot guaranty it.
Best option would be to make/mod your own cables to length.

[Biscuit]

Thanks for that list Pob!

[mikeo01]

Shouldnt be a problem with a 3570K or a 4670K. I got mine up to about 4.6 or 4.7 when i really pushed it but i think i have been lucky on the silicone lottery.

It depends which model you get, you would have to look them up individually as they dont put the same stock fans on all models. The H100i used the Air series i believe but whatever those ones where i had on the 100... erggghhhhhh

Better than the stock ones, not as good as gentle typhoons or noctuas though.

That is very high, aren't Haswell suppose to top out around 4.4/4.5Ghz anyway? hmm well the H60 is not far off the H90 in **** testing; so its that or spend an extra £16 on the H100 (+ whatever replacement fans will cost, say another £16). Not too bad. That is whether I actually go for the Z87 or not.

H60 comes with the newer corsair fans (SGL or whatever they are called) and H100 comes with the bog standard looking ones.

Decisions decisions

I use this one it's more up to date http://www.realhardtechx.com/index_archivos/Page541.htm and links to reviews
The VS series is from CWT not seasonic, seasonic was the old VX series, avoid the VS series, they are built to budget and one of the worst CWT units in some time.
EDIT: ignore I thought you meant the corsair VS

HEC quality can vary their high end units are good but some of their budget units can be a bit ropey, anything 80+ bronze rated or better from them tends to be good.

One thing that would be good to look at it the silverstone modular psu's the reason being that they also make a short cable set esp for SFF cases
http://www.scan.co.uk/products/500w-...fan-atx-v23-ps
http://www.scan.co.uk/products/silve...es-100-modular
Granted not a super cheap option, although the short cable set might work on other psu's but I cannot guaranty it.
Best option would be to make/mod your own cables to length.

Thanks for the link very handy

I was looking at the Strider, but the price is slightly steep. Hybrid modular seems cheaper. I'll have a look around and check them on that list.

I don't think long cables would be a huge issue; but modding them is an option.

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

You might want to wait for Haswell refresh though. These will shift to a better TIM,which will help reduce temperature. Hence it will probably reduce the need for spending the better part of £100 for the cooler!

Avoid reference GTX760 cards as they throttle.

If you are looking at a compact fully modular 450W,this is nothing that really matches this:

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/450w-...0plus-gold-psu

However,it is very expensive.

gentle typhoons

They are now discontinued,so any remaining stock will be the last stock you can get.

Edit!!

An R9 280X will fit in smaller mini-ITX cases fine,so it will definitely be fine in a 250D.

You can get GTX780 and GTX780TI cards into pint sized Shuttle systems fine.

Regarding the CPU,there is this option:

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/intel...che-80w-retail

Lightly threaded games will see the CPU at 3.7GHZ and for multithreaded games,the HT will mean it will keep up with an overclocked Core i5. Plus you can use a cheaper motherboard and cooler too.

DX12 will see better threading,so I expect a locked Core i7 to keep up with an overclocked Core i5. For a game like Crysis3,HT shows a noticeable performance boost,ie,over 30% over a Core i5.

I expect the Xeon E3s to be better binned with regards to TDP than the normal consumer chips too.

[mikeo01]

You might want to wait for Haswell refresh though. These will shift to a better TIM,which will help reduce temperature. Hence it will probably reduce the need for spending the better part of £100 for the cooler!

Avoid reference GTX760 cards as they throttle.

If you are looking at a compact fully modular 450W,this is nothing that really matches this:

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/450w-...0plus-gold-psu

However,it is very expensive.



They are now discontinued,so any remaining stock will be the last stock you can get.

Edit!!

An R9 280X will fit in smaller mini-ITX cases fine,so it will definitely be fine in a 250D.

You can get GTX780 and GTX780TI cards into pint sized Shuttle systems fine.

Regarding the CPU,there is this option:

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/intel...che-80w-retail

Lightly threaded games will see the CPU at 3.7GHZ and for multithreaded games,the HT will mean it will keep up with an overclocked Core i5. Plus you can use a cheaper motherboard and cooler too.

DX12 will see better threading,so I expect a locked Core i7 to keep up with an overclocked Core i5. For a game like Crysis3,HT shows a noticeable performance boost.

Regarding PSU, are there any cheaper hybrid/semi-modular alternatives? A couple of the ones I've listed seem alright, the list Pob gave eliminated some of them I only need PCI-E cable for the graphics card and 3 SATA cables. I could opt for cheaper wired supply but I can't stand stuffing cables everywhere, drives me up the wall

Depends if the Haswell refresh will be cheaper or more expensive really. Lower temps are of course welcome


I was only mentioning the reference GTX 760 in regards to putting an AIO on it; otherwise I will pick up something with a lot better cooling.

Reason for the GTX 760 is the reduced power consumption (same as HD 7870's board TDP), hence opting for a lower power supply. My 280X apparently eats up to 250W according to reviews while the GTX 760 is considerably less. Which I'd rather


Hmm Xeon 1230 V3 may be decent choice; reduce my AIO to a H60 and save another £30 opting for a B85 board scrap the 4670K then 1230V3 seems better choice

[Biscuit]

That is very high, aren't Haswell suppose to top out around 4.4/4.5Ghz anyway?

Yeah but this is IVB and like i said, i got quite lucky. It wasnt 24/7 stable anyway so i sropped down to stock and havent been bothered trying to clock it again. Maybe ill give it a bump up to 4.2 or so and leave it

They are now discontinued,so any remaining stock will be the last stock you can get.

Yeah its a real shame, they were great fans and pretty much the benchmark. The Grand Flex that replaced them are apparently no-where near as good

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/intel-xeon-e3-1230-v3-s-1150-haswell-quad-core-33ghz-base-37ghz-turbo-8mb-cache-80w-retail[/url]

Lightly threaded games will see the CPU at 3.7GHZ and for multithreaded games,the HT will mean it will keep up with an overclocked Core i5. Plus you can use a cheaper motherboard and cooler too.

DX12 will see better threading,so I expect a locked Core i7 to keep up with an overclocked Core i5. For a game like Crysis3,HT shows a noticeable performance boost,ie,over 30% over a Core i5.

I expect the Xeon E3s to be better binned with regards to TDP than the normal consumer chips too.

This is what i would be looking at for sure. Overclocking intel chips is largely pointless these days, the only chips than can overclock are pretty much top of the range anyway so the benefits are minimal. Overclocking was only worth it if you could make a low-medium range chip perform like the big daddy extreme range toppers.

[Goobley]

Surely the E3-1220 V3 would be a better option? Save £30 for 200MHz... Well that's what I'd do.
I generally buy for architecture, a few multiplier notches between say the bottom i5 and the top one have never (in my limited experience) been enough to make a game go from unplayable to playable. There is, however, quite a large cost difference between the top and bottom SKUs of what is essentially the same part with different clock speeds.

With respect to the Xeons themselves, I think they're very good chips, and at some point in the future I'm probably going for one of those or a 4670S/4770S, depending on what's cheapest when my machine feels lacking in anything.

[mikeo01]

Ah lets forget overclocking, sure it is fun but you are right, probably pointless. My 3770 didn't batter an eye lid so I really doubt the chips considered will either. H60 will cool it fine so that'll save some quid. + A B85 board. I could pay £100 for few Mhz on Haswell, not worth it you are right should be bit better than a stock 3770 anyway. Awesome

Also E3-1220V3 doesn't have hyperthreading (1230 does) and it costs same as a 4670K

[Goobley]

Ah that's what I was missing, the £30 makes sense then.

[Biscuit]

E3-1230 + new generation Intel boards + 250D + H100 = Win

*Dons CTF Flame proof suit*

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

E3-1230 + new generation Intel boards + 250D + H100 = Win

*Dons CTF Flame and Mooseproof suit*

FTFY!

TBH,I think the cheapest AIO water cooler should be fine with the Xeon E3 1230.

[mikeo01]

Anyone know that the MSI Dragon AIO is like? I want to opt for Corsair for their excellent warranty and service (leaks etc); is a £10 premium worth paying? (£48.66 for H55).

H60 is same price as the MSI Dragon but it has that horrid ridged tubing. H55 has the nice flexible tubing and sturdier construction

[Biscuit]

Anyone know that the MSI Dragon AIO is like? I want to opt for Corsair for their excellent warranty and service (leaks etc); is a £10 premium worth paying? (£48.66 for H55).

H60 is same price as the MSI Dragon but it has that horrid ridged tubing. H55 has the nice flexible tubing and sturdier construction

H100 has the rigid tubing. Its not that bad for me... but that's in an ATX case at the moment i suppose.

No clue about the MSI dragon but most of the AIO are either made by Acetek or CoolIT. Similar to the way PSUs are not made by company who is on the badge, they have input into the design of the unit but they are actually manufactured by an OEM.

Here is a bit of a roundup of some of these coolers so you can get an idea of the differences between units. The ones you are looking at aren't on here but it might be worth a look anyway.

[mikeo01]

H100 has the rigid tubing. Its not that bad for me... but that's in an ATX case at the moment i suppose.

No clue about the MSI dragon but most of the AIO are either made by Acetek or CoolIT. Similar to the way PSUs are not made by company who is on the badge, they have input into the design of the unit but they are actually manufactured by an OEM.

Here is a bit of a roundup of some of these coolers so you can get an idea of the differences between units. The ones you are looking at aren't on here but it might be worth a look anyway.

I had a read of that earlier and I basically just went with the worst case scenario; the coolermaster Seidon 120V. Even if I pushed 150W it should be OK should.

Only considering the MSI one because of price; then again I wonder if MSI would be as nice as Corsair if it does leak...

THIS is an example of what makes me cringe about the rigid tubing. It is probably OK but it may need some bending and moving to get it in there.


Anyone heard of Enhance Electronics? They make the gold certified Coolermaster VS power supply; backed up by a good 5 year warranty. Can't be all that bad surely?


EDIT:

Regarding the GTX 760's power consumption, looking around and many reviews say different things. Some say it is on par with the HD 7870, some say it is around 50W more while others state 100W more. Isn't the board rated for 170W?

Either way how less power hungry is it going to be over a 7870. I don't particularly want to throw in my 280X as that is a pretty power hungry card so wondering how much "watts" I am going to knock off compared to the 280X?

[mikeo01]

Still awaiting Flubit to invite me see what discounts I can get.

Need to scratch that itch