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Thread: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

  1. #33
    The late but legendary peterb - Onward and Upward peterb's Avatar
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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    Most Linux setups will support raid - maybe not as shipped, but you can add the packages. The standard Linux file system is EXT4, and the standard RAID tool is mdadm. Other file systems like ZFS have their own RAID tools, Google is your friend.
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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    Quote Originally Posted by username2 View Post
    Do you know any good home plugs and what is the difference between cheap and expensive ones? I basically need just one Ethernet port, but I have seen there are some with built in WiFi signal extender, but they are like 80 quid!
    This one is the cheapest 300Mbps which I found do you think it is good enough?
    Personally I use a mix of Devolo (I have this kit) and TP Link (I bought these on a special offer a while ago to test the idea). Both of my kits have worked great separately, and together.

    Honestly home plugs are like any other product and they vary between make & model. Devolo and Solwise are pretty solid across the board but you do pay for that.
    If its a path you're looking into, you just have to do the legwork and look through reviews to find the good ones. When I was researching it, I looked through a lot of lists that compared the best 10 or best 16. They usually have winning catagories such as 'budget buy', 'best performance', 'best wifi'.... you get the idea.

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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    During this long break, from this thread, I was looking for some good 2nd hand components in the internet and this is what I have so far:
    £50 Powerline adapter 3x port 1200mbps (TP-Link TL-PA8030P)
    £50 Router 4x Gbit ports (Netgear D6300)

    Server: paid £150
    Storage 4x 1TB WD black 64MB cache
    Motherboard 2x Gbit port, 2x SATA (6Gb/s) , 4x SATA (3Gb/s) (no usb 3.0 tho) Supermicro [ X9SCA ]
    drives controller LSI sas 9211-4i
    500w PSU
    CPU XEON E3-1220 (8M Cache, 3.10 GHz) (and here is cpu Benchmark)
    2x 4gb ram

    WOOT 500w FOR NAS?!
    Now you will start thinking "woohoo, bro that is lots of watts for NAS!!1", and I will agree with you. However I did discover that linux OS has that advantage that I can make it slow down the disks when they are not in use. Also probably I will turn it off during the night.
    Load wattage will be about 260W but I highly doubt that I will ever fully utilize that CPU, according to my calculations it will be about £5-£10 a month to run this machinery, however I will try to go under £5 a month with like underclocking CPU and mentioned before HDD slow down.

    Scenario
    This server sitting in other room (thanks Biscuit about telling me about powerline adapters), drives connected into RAID10 with LSI adapter
    connected to new router via powerline adapters, passing data to my mini kodi machine.
    So compared to my build in the first post (even chassis not included) I have £130 left and got much more equipment!

    So I am thinking about getting MINIX neo U1 as passing device or Wetek Core both are about £100.
    I need something with HD stream capability and be strong enough to run Moonlight program (game streaming program).

    Question.
    SSD cache and/or SSD drive for OS.
    Both of them might be connected to spare sata 3 ports, while I am using RAID controller.
    Is it worth spending more money probably about £30 for each 120GB SSD for cache and OS?
    According to some tests 4 drives in RAID 10 are almost twice as fast, but can linux, probably ubuntu fully utilize benefits of them?

    Future.
    I would like it to be future proof, at least last 5 years, I want within connect to it CCTV system (one or two cameras), based on RPI, writing data to SSD and then sending it to cloud. but then that means server runs 24/7 and it won't be as energy efficient. However also I can send data straight to cloud thorough router or sending data to NAS and from NAS every hour or so. But I guess this is story for different topic.


    Good? Bad? Stupid? Awesome?
    Tell me what you think I would like to have 3rd person view on whole project or even small part of it.

  4. #36
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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    I have a similar powered box for my NAS. I use FreeNAS and a couple of plugins. To be honest, if I were you I'd look at ditching the LSI card and use ZFS, that way if your LSI card explodes, you can just plug in your drives into any other Intel box.

    Assuming you went with FreeNAS, with a Plex plugin, you could use your budget on FireTV sticks/set top boxes. They're passively cooled, therefore silent.

    If you're desperate to spend the extra budget, you could always add another 8GB of RAM. It's not necessary, but ZFS likes more RAM. You'll also need an 8GB USB stick to install FreeNAS on leaving 2TB of usable disk (assuming 4x1TB in RAID-6).

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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    I agree with Rob, although Im not sure if the LSI card can work in host only mode?
    This allows the network adaptor to basically just pass the sata through to the OS as if they were connected to the motherboard. I know some of them need a firmware mod to do so (inc the one I have and havent used).

    What model is the PSU? Wattge aint so important but the make and model is, especially if you're trusting it with your backups.

    As for the player, I would once again, suggest the Raspberry Pi. All in with case, power supply you're looking at ~£50 or less depending on model and that can do Moonlight and Kodi just fine. If you need something to control it with, have a look at the FLIRC on Amazon. Once thats set up, it will keep the missus happy... trust me

    SSD cache and/or SSD drive for OS.
    Depends on which OS you go for?

    Is it worth spending more money probably about £30 for each 120GB SSD for cache and OS?
    See above answer, all depends on you're OS choice.


    According to some tests 4 drives in RAID 10 are almost twice as fast, but can linux, probably ubuntu fully utilize benefits of them?
    In theory yes, Ubuntu can fully utilise the capability of the drives but the speed of the drives isnt going to be you're limiting factor, its going to be your network.

    I wouldnt spend ANY time thinking about this.


    Once again, look at freeNAS, unRAID, openmediavault and any other dedicated NAS software rather than Ubuntu.

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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    Once again, look at freeNAS, unRAID, openmediavault and any other dedicated NAS software rather than Ubuntu.
    So are you trying to say that, SSD would be an unnecessary expense?
    I can get an USB stick just for the system but cheap small probably 120gb would assure me that I can use that in the future and it won't cause me any troubles.
    In terms of OS I was willing to choose Ubuntu and utilize that RAID card but I guess I can also use other Raid OS, certainly I won't use Windows.
    There is currently promotion on RPI3 on Amazon, full set for £43 plus the dongle you mentioned which is roughtly another £24 which makes £77 in total, or I can have high end machine for £85 with remote and dual band, 1 Gbit connection and so on. (Minix NEO u1)

    As b0redom and you suggested I will probably try to sell that raid card and get some more RAM instead. I was just tempted to use it while I have it, but probably I won't need so much throughput

    The PSU is some Supermicro 500w 80+ bronze (I guess it is PWS-501-PF) I trust supermicro and I believe it is good enough.

    I know you are trying to convince me for other TV boxes like RPI3 or Amazon stick, but I want to make sure it will be capable for that Moonlight full HD game streaming and I don't think any of them would be good enough.

    And b0redom, no I will not use Plex, I will use kodi, connected through network to my NAS.

  7. #39
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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    SSD is a completely pointless purchase for a home based NAS IMO.

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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    I would personally not combine the two, the NAS will likely have fans and you'll notice the hard drives spinning during quiet scenes, even 2.5"ers.

    I took the route of building a NAS, locating it in the attic where you won't hear it and then installing Kodi on a silent Amazon FireTV box. works brilliantly and you can run multiple "HTPCs" from different rooms from your central NAS.

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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    Quote Originally Posted by virtuo View Post
    I would personally not combine the two, the NAS will likely have fans and you'll notice the hard drives spinning during quiet scenes, even 2.5"ers.

    I took the route of building a NAS, locating it in the attic where you won't hear it and then installing Kodi on a silent Amazon FireTV box. works brilliantly and you can run multiple "HTPCs" from different rooms from your central NAS.
    as they say '+1'

    get a rpi2/3 as your playback device with libreelec.

    build your nas and store it somewhere on a concrete floor. mine is unfortunately on a wooden floor upstairs and i can hear an individual drive boot up when I watch a movie. having that in the room where i watch would be rubbish, but sometimes needs must!

    i use:

    Windows 10
    Stablebit DrivePool/Scanner
    and use ultravnc to remote in if i need to.

    Tried linux, but didn't like it's available drivepooling (it works fine, but the control of file placement wasn't there like it is with drivepool).
    Hope this is not Chris' blood?!

  10. #42
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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    Quote Originally Posted by username2 View Post
    So are you trying to say that, SSD would be an unnecessary expense?
    I can get an USB stick just for the system but cheap small probably 120gb would assure me that I can use that in the future and it won't cause me any troubles.
    I'm sayng it depends on your OS and what it can do with an SSD. On Unraid its far from unnecissary and the cache drive gives you a significant boost for uploading files to it, it will then transfer them to spinning drives when you're not using the server.

    Why not start with a USB stick and then consider an SSD in the future? This isnt the kind of element you really need to 'future proof' as its something that can be upgraded reasonably easily.

    Quote Originally Posted by username2 View Post
    In terms of OS I was willing to choose Ubuntu and utilize that RAID card but I guess I can also use other Raid OS, certainly I won't use Windows.
    Im not sure why you keep going back to ubuntu. Seriously, make you're life easier and just go for an OS thats prepackaged for exactly what you need.
    If you want to experiment with ubuntu you can probably run a virtual machine
    Quote Originally Posted by username2 View Post
    There is currently promotion on RPI3 on Amazon, full set for £43 plus the dongle you mentioned which is roughtly another £24 which makes £77 in total, or I can have high end machine for £85 with remote and dual band, 1 Gbit connection and so on. (Minix NEO u1)
    Not sure I would class the Minix as a "high end device" but I do see you're point.
    Personally I would still go for the Pi as you have much more flexibility with OS choice for it, but perhaps look at a Zero if you want to shave some pennies.

    As for the FLIRC, you understand that it allows you to use your normal existing TV remote to control the Pi?
    Depending on the television you might not actually need it if your TV supports CEC.

    Quote Originally Posted by username2 View Post
    As b0redom and you suggested I will probably try to sell that raid card and get some more RAM instead. I was just tempted to use it while I have it, but probably I won't need so much throughput
    If you went down the FreeNAS route, you would most likely get the same throughput anyway.

    Quote Originally Posted by username2 View Post
    The PSU is some Supermicro 500w 80+ bronze (I guess it is PWS-501-PF) I trust supermicro and I believe it is good enough.
    Should be solid, if not a bit noisy?

    Quote Originally Posted by username2 View Post
    I know you are trying to convince me for other TV boxes like RPI3 or Amazon stick, but I want to make sure it will be capable for that Moonlight full HD game streaming and I don't think any of them would be good enough.
    There is a moonlight build for the Pi. Honestly I havent tried it (requires Nvidia) but all it really does is decode incoming video and send controller inputs the other way... Doesnt need much oomph or bandwidth.
    I think we are all talking from positions of experience here, we're not trying to lead you down a dark path full of trouble, we're trying to make you're life easier and cheaper.

    Quote Originally Posted by username2 View Post
    And b0redom, no I will not use Plex, I will use kodi, connected through network to my NAS.
    As I mentioned before, look at the Emby media server. It gives you all the same capabilities of Plex (transcoding/steaming/organisation/shared library etc) but the plug in for Kodi is very well done. The normal Kodi libraries will populate with data provided by Emby and will share watched/resume status etc. If you are using a laptop in the kitchen (for example) then you dont have to install Kodi to share the same stuff, you can use the web browser which is also an excellent experience.

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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    Also just to add on a bit about Emby and why its worthwhile. Im currently out of the country and still accessing all my media through the "questionable" hotel internet connection as its transcoding down to SD resolution at home

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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    Quote Originally Posted by b0redom View Post
    SSD is a completely pointless purchase for a home based NAS IMO.
    Could you tell me why do you think so?

    I would personally not combine the two, the NAS will likely have fans and you'll notice the hard drives spinning during quiet scenes, even 2.5"ers.
    Yeah, I did mentioned in my previous post, that I already did dump this idea and I will use powerline adapters.

    I'm sayng it depends on your OS and what it can do with an SSD. On Unraid its far from unnecissary and the cache drive gives you a significant boost for uploading files to it, it will then transfer them to spinning drives when you're not using the server.
    If you went down the FreeNAS route, you would most likely get the same throughput anyway.
    I didn't decide yet, what OS I will use, I just have most of experience in ubuntu, so I think it is coded as default linux in my brain
    Are you suggesting then that I should use FreeNAS?

    Personally I would still go for the Pi as you have much more flexibility with OS choice for it, but perhaps look at a Zero if you want to shave some pennies.
    It does not make much difference for me if I am going to spend 40 or 80 pounds on that machine, I just want to make sure it will be fully operational of steaming HD games from second computer. I just don't want to regret that I have could buy something more expensive but much more responsive. I heard that Minix neo U1 is capable of that and setting up everything what I want on Android will be very easy.
    At this moment I have some dual core machine, I think I will give it a go with linux and see what happen

    There is a moonlight build for the Pi. Honestly I havent tried it (requires Nvidia) but all it really does is decode incoming video and send controller inputs the other way... Doesnt need much oomph or bandwidth.
    I think we are all talking from positions of experience here, we're not trying to lead you down a dark path full of trouble, we're trying to make you're life easier and cheaper.
    I know that Moonlight is still in beta release and is not very well optimalized that is why the end machine needs more that just capability of playing HD content

    In terms of Emby why I shouldn't just use network file sharing?

    Should be solid, if not a bit noisy?
    Whole NAS will be in a spare room, so the noise is not a problem anymore

    I think we are all talking from positions of experience here, we're not trying to lead you down a dark path full of trouble, we're trying to make you're life easier and cheaper.
    I really hope so, but you know, my parents were always saying "do not trust strangers in the Internet"

  13. #45
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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    Quote Originally Posted by username2 View Post
    Are you suggesting then that I should use FreeNAS?
    FreeNAS (or an alternative NAS OS) and Ubuntu both have the potential produce the same results, but FreeNAS (or an alternative NAS OS) will likely get you there a lot quicker and be easier to manage as it's purpose built for the task.
    For example, a NAS OS will likely have the RAID software pre-installed with a software GUI thats accessible via web-browser to set up and manage it. In ubuntu, this is not necissarily the case.

    Quote Originally Posted by username2 View Post
    In terms of Emby why I shouldn't just use network file sharing?
    You could and it would work fine; its the way I did it for years. I recently switched to Emby and discovered there are advantages that I utilize that I would now can't live without. I listed a few of these in my previous post.

    I feel like we are going in circles now though.

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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    Quote Originally Posted by Biscuit View Post
    I feel like we are going in circles now though.
    Sorry, my didn't want to bore, don't feel, like you need to answer all my posts

    I just want to say, that I am new in the topic and I really appreciate your help, that is why I am keep asking new things.

    Currently I am looking into using that tape drive I have, probably I will have to use something else than FreeNAS, but maybe I will just get rid of that LTO drive... I need to do more reading

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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    I did manage to eventually set it up with hardware specified previously and below
    Storage 4x 1TB WD black 64MB cache
    Motherboard 2x Gbit port, 2x SATA (6Gb/s) , 4x SATA (3Gb/s) (no usb 3.0 tho) Supermicro [ X9SCA ]
    500w PSU bronze supermicro
    CPU XEON E3-1220 (8M Cache, 3.10 GHz) (and here is cpu Benchmark)
    2x 4gb ram

    I did also add 120gb ssd for data sheet and for Jails
    I did remove the LSI sas 9211-4i drives controller (if you want ti buy it PM me )

    with FreeNas it is possible to spin down disks if no one is using them at the moment. Important note: It is necessary to move data sheet to other drive (it is usually created on the first created volume on the FreeNas) it is nothing hard tho

    I am running my server only when I am at home, and turning it on via Wake On Lan.

    On ssd with datasheet I have my Jails like my home apache server (so I can monitor system without logging to GUI), I am running there script to output details of the system (like temps of hdds and cpu, speed of the plates of the drive).
    Little note here I had to put a fan outside the case in the front of the drives bay because unfortunately those hot swap drives are not very well designed and they like to heat up, up to 50C degrees.
    With fan and drives spinning down at the times of no use it is reasonable.

    I did created couple of users so they can access their backups only plus shared resources.

    However I have problems with apple IOS backups, with my android phone I am using FolderSync app to sync to the remote folder, but with apple I dont have much luck. I did try to use Resilio/Bittorrent Sync but it doesn't work well. If you have any ideas, just post them here.

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    Re: HTPC(kodi) + NAS(hardware raid)

    Considered XPEnology?

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