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Thread: NT4 domain how to replace with a 2000 server?

  1. #1
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    NT4 domain how to replace with a 2000 server?

    I'm not sure how I'm meant to replace an NT4 box with a 2000 server as when I try and add the 2k box to the current nt4 domain it wont allow it as its not running active directory.

    The PDC is running active directory though. How do I demote the NT4 machine and replace it on the network with a new 2k server with the same name? I've really minimal hands-on with NT4 and don't really understand how its domain properties work, how do you make an NT4 box a domian for a start???

    I've created a fresh domain but integrating it into the existing is the problem.

    Some1 help me with my confusion.
    The situation's looking...

  2. #2
    Oh no!I've re-dorkalated! Jiff Lemon's Avatar
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    The "proper" way would be to take the BDC off offline, then Upgrade the existing PDC to win2k.

    You creating a whole new domain or looking to migrate the existing one?

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    Hi, the right thing to go will be upgrading your NT4 box (SP4 installed).
    Otherwise , there is other tools for migrating and moving user accounts from NT4 to W2K. Don't forget that there is no Active Directory on NT, only on win 2000/2003. Once you have your W2K domain controler, he will take a PDC role.
    The more you live, less you die. More you play, more you die. Isn't it great.

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    F.A.S.T. Butuz's Avatar
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    Ok. 90% of the time when a company ends up having big problems with upgrading to Win2k/Win2k3 Active Directory it is because they did no planning, and didnt actually know why they needed to upgrade from NT4 (apart from simply having the latest kit).

    So - i ask you, why do you need to upgrade from NT4 domains to Win2000 Active directory? What do you intend to gain?

    There are many different ways of doing the upgrade. Starting from scratch, or upgrading the old NT4 PDC by simply inserting the windows 2000 server CD, or running your old NT4 domain along side your new Windows 2000 domain and sharing the recources of both.

    Any of these methods can be frought with difficulty if you do not have a plan or idea as to which is best for you.

    Cheers

    Butuz

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    As it stands we have 4 domains, 2 are NT and 2 are 2k, one of which is the PDC.

    What I want to know is how are the NT domains registered on the network if the PDC is running AD and they NT boxes don't?

    I need to replace and existing domain server running NT4 with a 2K as we have new software that demands a 2k box. The thing I'm not sure about is managing an NT boxes domain properties, i.e how to change its domain name and create a domain.. or is this only possible when INSTALLING a fresh NT4?
    The situation's looking...

  6. #6
    Will work for beer... nichomach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bleek
    As it stands we have 4 domains, 2 are NT and 2 are 2k, one of which is the PDC.

    What I want to know is how are the NT domains registered on the network if the PDC is running AD and they NT boxes don't?

    I need to replace and existing domain server running NT4 with a 2K as we have new software that demands a 2k box. The thing I'm not sure about is managing an NT boxes domain properties, i.e how to change its domain name and create a domain.. or is this only possible when INSTALLING a fresh NT4?
    Bleek, forgive me for saying this, but I think there's some confusion in your mind as to the difference between a domain and a domain controller. The domain is a logical grouping of 1 or more servers. In NT, servers may be either a Primary Domain Controller (1 per domain), a Backup Domain Controller (as many per domain as you like) or a member server (again, as many per domain as you like). In 2K or later, servers may be either Domain Controllers or Members. There is no PDC, although one of the servers may emulate this role. If your "PDC" is running Active Directory, you have already upgraded it to 2000 Server, and it's a Domain Controller, not a Primary Domain Controller. If it's still running NT4, then it's not running AD.

    The determination as to whether an NT box is a domain controller or just a server is made at installation. In order to change a DC into a Member, you should do a clean install of NT4, same for vice versa. You don't have to format, and you can install into the same folder, but you will have to reinstall any apps on the server and also reapply all service packs and patches.

    If you are upgrading a domain in place (i.e. upgrading the existing boxes), then you always upgrade the PDC to 2000/2003 first. You can run the domain in mixed-mode for a while (not advised for an extended period) allowing your NT4 BDCs to remain NT4, i.e. you DON'T install AD. If your PDC is running Windows 2000 with NT4 BDCs, this is what you should have been doing. Installing AD on your PDC when you still have BDCs on NT4 has rather stuffed you, if that's what you've done. OK, assuming you have a former PDC which has been upgraded to a 2K DC (remember, not PDC cause in AD there's no such thing) with AD installed, assuming you have all the services working on that box, but you've still left NT4 BDCs hanging around on the same domain, you don't have much option but to reinstall NT4 on them.

    What I would do is reinstall NT Server on the afflicted BDCs, but choose to make them ordinary servers, not Domain Controllers. NT4 workstations and servers can be members of an Active Directory domain, but they don't have to be yet if you don't want. Once that's done, upgrade them to 2000, and apply whatever SP level your current DC is on. At this point, they will still be members, not DCs, or standalones if you didn't join them to the domain during installation of NT. If the latter, you can now join them to the domain in the usual way and then proceed with the next step; if the former, just proceed. Once you've got them working as 2K member servers, you can use dcpromo to install AD on them and make them DCs within the domain that they've joined.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by nichomach
    Bleek, forgive me for saying this, but I think there's some confusion in your mind as to the difference between a domain and a domain controller. The domain is a logical grouping of 1 or more servers. In NT, servers may be either a Primary Domain Controller (1 per domain), a Backup Domain Controller (as many per domain as you like) or a member server (again, as many per domain as you like). In 2K or later, servers may be either Domain Controllers or Members. There is no PDC, although one of the servers may emulate this role. If your "PDC" is running Active Directory, you have already upgraded it to 2000 Server, and it's a Domain Controller, not a Primary Domain Controller. If it's still running NT4, then it's not running AD.
    Unfortunately I've been recently employed and not that familiar with the setup, there is a DC that was once an NT4 box, its now running AD.

    The determination as to whether an NT box is a domain controller or just a server is made at installation. In order to change a DC into a Member, you should do a clean install of NT4, same for vice versa. You don't have to format, and you can install into the same folder, but you will have to reinstall any apps on the server and also reapply all service packs and patches.
    Its a brand new server so the old kit wont be used, so the above wont be needed.

    If you are upgrading a domain in place (i.e. upgrading the existing boxes), then you always upgrade the PDC to 2000/2003 first. You can run the domain in mixed-mode for a while (not advised for an extended period) allowing your NT4 BDCs to remain NT4, i.e. you DON'T install AD. If your PDC is running Windows 2000 with NT4 BDCs, this is what you should have been doing. Installing AD on your PDC when you still have BDCs on NT4 has rather stuffed you, if that's what you've done.
    This was done by previous employee's.

    OK, assuming you have a former PDC which has been upgraded to a 2K DC (remember, not PDC cause in AD there's no such thing) with AD installed, assuming you have all the services working on that box, but you've still left NT4 BDCs hanging around on the same domain, you don't have much option but to reinstall NT4 on them.

    What I would do is reinstall NT Server on the afflicted BDCs, but choose to make them ordinary servers, not Domain Controllers. NT4 workstations and servers can be members of an Active Directory domain, but they don't have to be yet if you don't want. Once that's done, upgrade them to 2000, and apply whatever SP level your current DC is on. At this point, they will still be members, not DCs, or standalones if you didn't join them to the domain during installation of NT. If the latter, you can now join them to the domain in the usual way and then proceed with the next step; if the former, just proceed. Once you've got them working as 2K member servers, you can use dcpromo to install AD on them and make them DCs within the domain that they've joined.
    I only need to upgrade one machine, its actually not an upgrade but a straight swap... so in other words I can just take the old machine off the network and run dcpromo to add the new 2k machine to the network. So thats pretty easy and I shouldn't worry about anything else for the time being as the exisitng NT box isn't required.
    The situation's looking...

  8. #8
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    Heres a querie.

    If i have a domain with an NT4 box, is there a way I can add the new 2k box to this domain then remove the NT4 box to leave the 2k box to run the domain?

    This sort of thing was never covered in my MCP training. Altho I do have the MSoft reference books for 2000 server etc... not sure if it'd be in those. Will have a browse.
    The situation's looking...

  9. #9
    Will work for beer... nichomach's Avatar
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    Yes, but you MUST upgrade the NT4 PDC to 2K. Then add your new 2K box as a DC to the domain, and ensure that any required services like DNS and what have you are up and running. Then you can remove the old NT box.

  10. #10
    Oh no!I've re-dorkalated! Jiff Lemon's Avatar
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    Not had time to properly read and digest it all, but I suspect you have one AD domain, one 2k child domain and the NT domains are trusted domains.

    I'd hold back on doing anything if you can - You could quite easily end up in a world of Poop without proper planning!

  11. #11
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    I've decided to create a new AD domain along side existing as I don't have the means or time to upgrade the NT4 domain and its obsolete anyway. I also really needed to keep the NT4 box functioning as its got around 60gb of critcal data on it, really don't want to touch it till the new server is online and working with the migrated data.
    The situation's looking...

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