AMD XP2800 replacement

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

At some point in the next month or two I am thinking of modding my old Shuttle SN41G2 with a mini ITX motherboard. It currently has a flexATX nForce 2 motherboard with an XP2800 in it.

The computer will be used for mostly internet,word processing,light image editing and watching video on.

I already have DDR2 DIMMs to hand and a suitable hard disk and optical drive.

Will the Ion motherboards with an Atom 330 be much better??

If not what Intel or AMD based motherboards would you suggest??

A PCI-Express slot would be useful but even a PCI slot would do the job TBH however I am not really up to speed with mini ITX motherboards ATM.

I don't have a big budget but if a motherboard,CPU and a new PSU could be had for under £150 it would be great. If I could re-use my Shuttle PC40 it would be great:

http://www.directron.com/pc40.html

[s_kinton]

Scan have a good bundle deal for an Atom 330, but if you want to do image editing I cant imagine its going to have the horsepower. http://www.scan.co.uk/Products/Gigabyte-GA-GC330UD-MOBO

My second HTPC is mini-itx and I built it using the Zotac 8200 ITX WIFI board with a 45w AMDx2 4850e. Low power and very quiet. The board has a PCI-e port too.

Intel have by far the best range of ITX boards out there, but they are by comoparison more expensive. Be careful when you're looking though, as some boards take SO-DIMM memory.

For a cheaper replacement PSU, take a look at 1U PSUs. I use the Seasonic 250w in one of my HTPCs and its silent. You could reuse your PC40 case too. http://linitx.com/viewcategory.php?catid=150

www.linitx.com is a great website for ITX specific builds, with great service and prices.

[jim]

I don't know about you, but I have a feeling I'd find an Atom rig frustratingly slow. I've used a couple of netbooks with Atom (admittedly the 230 with a single core) and it was abysmal, really disappointing to use.

I would be tempted to go with a proper motherboard but on Mini-ITX scale - you've got two Zotacs, the 8200 for AMD, and the 9300 for Intel. Obviously the latter has better integrated graphics, especially if you get the latest I-E revision which is overclocked to 9400 levels. However with the 9300 you'll obviously be spending a bit more on the processor - I'm sure you are more than aware of the situation AMD vs Intel in the low-end battle.

It can be difficult to source those motherboards though, Mini-ITX isn't that widespread and since Zotac mucked up with their various revisions (sorted out now) it makes it pretty tough to get hold of the one you want. In the end, I found that the AMD board was harder to obtain, so you could save money with the Intel. Combined with the fact that the integrated graphics are much better, despite the more expensive processors it seemed like a better deal.

All depends how the market is at the time I guess

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

I have an E2160 which can be used as a stop gap although it would be nice if a 785G mini ITX motherboard was actually available in the UK! I would ideally want a new processor though with lower idle power consumption if possible.

The 8200 based one with wireless looks interesting as I could use an X2 235e or an undervolted Sempron 140 even!!

Does the 8200 motherboard have nvidia core calibration??

One of my friends has the first revision of the Zotac 9300 motherboard and it did not support undervolting which I would like to have as an option. Does the newer version have undervolting abilities??

I know that there is a DDR3 J&W 785G one out there but they are as common in the UK as a Moose with common sense!

I wish AMD had more mini ITX based motherboards out there!!

[scaryjim]

Will the Ion motherboards with an Atom 330 be much better??

afaict it depends on your work load. A quick scout of reviews and forums suggests that if you're mostly using single threaded software an Atom will not be up to it: your XP2800 will burn through Hexus.pifast in ~ 70s whereas a 1.6GHz Atom will take 200s according to Tarinder.

Personally. I'd be tempted by a Via VB8001 - it uses a 1.6GHz Nano and has a PCIe x16 electrical. It should also run from your existing PSU by the look of it (it only needs a 20pin ATX power connector) saving you a little more money which would enable you to slot in a low power gfx card e.g. 4350 / 4550 / 8400GS / 9400GT / GT210 (all can be got for up to ~ £35).

[scaryjim]

... or an undervolted Sempron 140 even!! ...

I assume I don't have to reiterate how chuffed with my undervolted Sempy I am...

[jim]

One of my friends has the first revision of the Zotac 9300 motherboard and it did not support undervolting which I would like to have as an option. Does the newer version have undervolting abilities??

I remember reading that it was added as a feature, yes - originally Zotac thought that nobody would want to undervolt, and the only possible effect would be a loss of stability, so they changed it after getting a load of abuse. Having said that, I would obviously advise you to check that if you're interested

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

afaict it depends on your work load. A quick scout of reviews and forums suggests that if you're mostly using single threaded software an Atom will not be up to it: your XP2800 will burn through Hexus.pifast in ~ 70s whereas a 1.6GHz Atom will take 200s according to Tarinder.

Personally. I'd be tempted by a Via VB8001 - it uses a 1.6GHz Nano and has a PCIe x16 electrical. It should also run from your existing PSU by the look of it (it only needs a 20pin ATX power connector) saving you a little more money which would enable you to slot in a low power gfx card e.g. 4350 / 4550 / 8400GS / 9400GT / GT210 (all can be got for up to ~ £35).

That motherboard looks interesting as it has both a mini PCI and PCI-Express slot. IIRC,there is also a dual core Nano too. The last mini-ITX motherboard I had was a C3 and I tried to run epiOS on it!!

I assume I don't have to reiterate how chuffed with my undervolted Sempy I am...

I know!!

I remember reading that it was added as a feature, yes - originally Zotac thought that nobody would want to undervolt, and the only possible effect would be a loss of stability, so they changed it after getting a load of abuse. Having said that, I would obviously advise you to check that if you're interested

I will have a gander.

[scaryjim]

... IIRC,there is also a dual core Nano too ...

Possibly, not too sure on that one. It looks like the new nano 3000 series should be very good though, and the Hexus coverage from CES2010 suggests that it will be featured in a lot more products, including pico-ITX boards: those could be *very* interesting

[Pob255]

Looking around the Zotac nForce 8200i-ITX is your best bet for an AMD mITX motherboard, looking around I did find a J&W 780g + 700sb but it's £100 and SO-DIMM

Personally I'd be willing to give the atom 330 + ION a go, I don't have much speed issues with my eeepc 901 and that's running underclocked as it's on battery most of the time.
The main time it shows it's weekness is in video playback, the dual core 330 and ION graphic chipset should sort that out.
The main thing you have to remember is that it's not a powerhouse, don't try to run 6 things at once or edit giant image files.

[simonw]

One of my friends has the first revision of the Zotac 9300 motherboard and it did not support undervolting which I would like to have as an option. Does the newer version have undervolting abilities??

I remember reading that it was added as a feature, yes - originally Zotac thought that nobody would want to undervolt, and the only possible effect would be a loss of stability, so they changed it after getting a load of abuse. Having said that, I would obviously advise you to check that if you're interested

I believe the new I-E board will undervolt by -0.1V, I guess it is better than nothing though.

[circuitmonkey]

At some point in the next month or two I am thinking of modding my old Shuttle SN41G2 with a mini ITX motherboard. It currently has a flexATX nForce 2 motherboard with an XP2800 in it.

The computer will be used for mostly internet,word processing,light image editing and watching video on.

I already have DDR2 DIMMs to hand and a suitable hard disk and optical drive.

Will the Ion motherboards with an Atom 330 be much better??

If not what Intel or AMD based motherboards would you suggest??

A PCI-Express slot would be useful but even a PCI slot would do the job TBH however I am not really up to speed with mini ITX motherboards ATM.

I don't have a big budget but if a motherboard,CPU and a new PSU could be had for under £150 it would be great. If I could re-use my Shuttle PC40 it would be great:

http://www.directron.com/pc40.html

I have nearly an Identical rig as a back up XP machine, although the only moding I did was to removed the dying PSU and place a massive ATX PSU on top to keep the thing running.

I've often thought of trying to upgrade the rig to something current as it's a nice looking and small case but didn't get much further then figuring out that it was flexATX and nothing was really going to fit (mounting wise)

[circuitmonkey]

I have nearly an Identical rig as a back up XP machine, although the only moding I did was to removed the dying PSU and place a massive ATX PSU on top to keep the thing running.

I've often thought of trying to upgrade the rig to something current as it's a nice looking and small case but didn't get much further then figuring out that it was flexATX and nothing was really going to fit (mounting wise)

Ok, so flex atx uses a subset of micro atx as does mini itx, no reason it shouldn't mount, bad initial research on my part

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

The new Shuttle J series can mount mini ITX motherboards!! Shuttle also made noises about selling their motherboards separately a while back but it seems nothing happened!!

The problem is that mATX motherboards tend to be bigger than a flexATX ones so hence the need to use a miniITX one to replace the flexATX one. The other alternative is to find a flexATX motherboard from a later Shuttle and mount this instead of the old one.

OTH, IMHO it would cooler to mod a G2 series case to fit a mini ITX motherboard as they tend to be easier to get hold off and probably cheaper than the Shuttle motherboards.

[circuitmonkey]

Actually, I'm reverting back to my initial statement, mini-itx will need custom mounts installed to fit inside the shuttle, the original motherboard for my sn45g doesn't appear to be flexatx at all. still I like the idea of moving my signature rig from my M59 (which I just bought) to a my old shuttle case. Fitting the 9800gx2 and keeping my quad cooled might be a bit of a task, maybe a h50 would do the trick. on second thoughts I doubt I could find a PSU to fit inside the shuttle to power it all

[scaryjim]

CAT - I had a sudden thought: if your Shuttle genuinely takes FlexATX motherboards, then Via do a couple of iDOT motherboards that might be an option. They only use C7 processors @ 1.5GHz, so they won't have stellar performance, but the higher spec one sports both PCIe x16 and PCI. The only real downside is that they support a maximum of 2GB DDR2 (2x1GB), but that's not a huge problem in a low spec system, I wouldn't think...

EDIT: Having googled up images of your Shuttle I don't think that'll work at all - while the motherboard appears to be flexATX size it runs the "wrong way", as it were...