Zak's Theory of Car Power Relativity - 2017 edition

[Zak33]

Drive a small 19 year old hatch, every working day for 3 weeks.
1.4i 60ps, low end torque design. Maintain average fuel consumption's, including daily dense traffic of over 40 mpg with that old car. Light foot, preserve the old girl and fuel consumption, 3k revs max and change gear. No point going higher, asthmatic old girl.

Remove 26 year old Japanese VTEC bullet from garage, MOT Insure and tax
Change driving from 3k change to 8,250 change, last dyno'd at just over 160bhp


Relativity. Relativity.

Expand this theory as desired people.

[DanceswithUnix]

Sounds like you just change up when it is worth it in both cases

[Zak33]

the speed difference is ... astonishing.

I've driven s many cars over the last 26 year, but it's all relative.

300+ps quick stuff seems fast as hell, after 170ps diesel exec motorway beasts... then you drop to a 120ps petrol and miss the diesel grunt etc etc.

But if you force the issue... come down.. riiiiiight down to slow... for a while.

then move up again it's sizzling.

Relativity. Relativity.

266% more horse power, similar weight

[dave87]

Power isn't important, it is how much fun you can have with it.

I have a 987 Boxster, which if you are being lazy will be outdragged by most diesel rep mobiles these days. Yet get to some twisty corners, or a track and it comes alive. Even more so if you know what you are doing, which I definitely don't! Similarly, Zak's VTEC hooligan car, will be massively fun with relatively little power.

Drove a friend's Nissan GTR (R35). Barely scratched the surface, but it was already too quick to enjoy on the road without a prison sentence. Also massively heavy (but with very clever electronics) which means it is incredibly capable but you rely on the electronics a lot to make it quick on a track, or at least the way he drove it.

[Zak33]

Drove a friend's Nissan GTR (R35). Barely scratched the surface,

one day...one day

[DanceswithUnix]

266% more horse power, similar weight

You get a similar change from reducing the weight.

I used to drive a 190bhp 2.5l V6 as a daily driver, fairly quick but 1490kg luxury car held it back.
Switch to the kit car, older 3.0l V6 so delivering the same power, but into nearly half the weight and all lower down for when you get to a corner. Both relaxing to drive at low revs thanks to both having the wonderful Busso engine, but plant the loud pedal and the difference is huge.

Now in my daily drive I get 170bhp from a 1.4l petrol in a smaller 1280kg car which handles better and has all the usual modern luxury features, but it just isn't the same as the V6.

[Hoonigan]

I drive a Civic Type R, around 200BHP, so plenty of grunt and certainly a very fun drive. But I also recently went on a track day, to which I drove in the Civic; on the way home, the Civic felt unbelievably slow and it's now taking a while to get that feeling back

Cars I drove:

Nissan GT-R (525BHP)
Lamborghini Huracan (595BHP)
Lamborghini Gallardo Superleggera (580BHP)
Audi R8 (550BHP)

It is definitely all relative. I also drive my girlfriend's Kia Sportage, 1.7 diesel, around 130BHP, and often find myself pulling out of junctions and expecting power, but getting absolutely nowhere. It's almost dangerous when you're used to having instant power from a VTEC engine.

But you can't beat that VTEC shift! 4000 RPM - 7000RPM in 3rd gear, that kick onto the high-lift cam!

[DanceswithUnix]

But I also recently went on a track day, to which I drove in the Civic; on the way home, the Civic felt unbelievably slow and it's now taking a while to get that feeling back

I don't think it matters what you drive, after a while it becomes the new normal.

OTOH, my wifes first car was an Uno 45. Almost no power at all, but skinny tyres so it slid around all over the place. Was genuinely wonderful fun as you could explore the handling limits at 20mph Modern cars are kind of too good.

She's gone from 45bhp all those years ago to 250bhp, don't think she could go back!

[CAT-THE-FIFTH]

Drive a small 19 year old hatch, every working day for 3 weeks.
1.4i 60ps, low end torque design. Maintain average fuel consumption's, including daily dense traffic of over 40 mpg with that old car. Light foot, preserve the old girl and fuel consumption, 3k revs max and change gear. No point going higher, asthmatic old girl.

You might want to try a commute on train plus a few km walk every day,then wait upto an hour for a train at like 9pm - it could be worse!!

At that point I think even an asthmatic Austin Metro might have been a revelation.

[Moby-Dick]

Its one of the reasons I've put the Aristo on ebay - its not really a track car , but too quick for the public roads. Its temporary replacement , a Mk V Golf R32 is fun - not the quickest car I've driven but has an exhaust note that you can't help but giggle a little bit to.

[Zak33]

what's an Aristo?

a Lexus?

[Moby-Dick]

yeah - JDM version of the Lexus GS300 , however it wasn't available with the 2JZ-GTE Twin turbo Straight 6 in the UK

[Lowe]

Was genuinely wonderful fun as you could explore the handling limits at 20mph Modern cars are kind of too good.

This is why I love my GT86. Lots of fun, has to be worked to get the power and will let you explore the fun side of handling without getting into licence worrying territory. Gets even better when it rains.

[Bagnaj97]

will let you explore the fun side of handling without getting into licence worrying territory. Gets even better when it rains.

Can't the same be said of any car if you fit budget ditchfinder tyres?

[Lowe]

Can't the same be said of any car if you fit budget ditchfinder tyres?

Still depends on the car to a certain extent. Won't be much fun if you're FWD, or if the traction control / stability system is intrusive.

[Zak33]

Can't the same be said of any car if you fit budget ditchfinder tyres?

god no!

you need suspension compliance, proper caster and camber and good throttle controls, sharp steering and feel.

Putting ditch finders, for example, on a Shogun 3.2 won't give you the same over all sexual-power-sliding-love-in at all.