Hamilton faces Japan win inquiry

[bigblue]

It's probably the same in Spain as what it is here. It's just the way the media works. Little dig here and there, and it's reported as being a full-on tantrum.

Actually, I think the Spanish press are actually a little less rabid. Obviously they blame Hamilton for some of the debatable stuff that our tabloids blame Alonso for, but they still seem fairer overall. Maybe I'm just not reading downmarket enough Spanish papers Pinch of salt notwithstanding, it's is quite interesting to see some different theories to why things have turned so sour at McMerc. And some of those theories make a lot of sense, so hopefully we'll have the air cleared when Alonso is back at Renault. But I very much doubt it.

He did let his guard slip very publicly today though. He clearly was not happy on his in-lap. You could see his head moving as if he was shouting, quite forcefully, down the radio. He appeared to be having a bit of tantrum. All conjecture on my part,

And I'd wager that your conjecture is at least partly based on stories you've seen on F1 forums, many of which the Great British public are blisfully unaware of. Again, pinch of salt needed, but they seemingly come from reliable sources, and if they were about Alonso we'd be reading all about it in The Sun no doubt.

I started this year incredibly excited about F1, but as it stands I've never been more disenchanted. Time for eBay with all the unopened merchandise I think !

[Saracen]

Subjective, for the first emphasised part, perhaps. The 2nd, no way. How can speeding and then slowing unnecessarily not be deemed potentially dangerous?

Of course the second part is subjective, because the criteria one person uses to judge if it's potentially dangerous or not vary. Simply driving an F1 car in a race is potentially dangerous, so there has to be a degree of potential danger that triggers this rule. Who judges where, and what, that is? It's not like there's a firm definition, like "if you do more than x-mph in the pit lane", or "if you cross that line exiting the pit lane". It's down to judgement of what is or is not deemed potentially dangerous.

Plenty of drivers didn't feel the need to drive in this way, so I wouldn't say they were that extraordinary.

Well, the stewards said

What has become apparent is the view clearly expressed by all drivers and team managers alike that the conditions at Fuji were exceptionally bad and worse than those previously experienced when the race starts behind the safety car.

Because of those views, the stewards accept that it may be inappropriate to impose the penalty normally applied for an offence such as this.

Sounds extraordinary to me. If the drivers all agree, and team managers all agree, and the stewards accept it, I think that's good enough for me.

You state subjective earlier, so here we'll use it against him. It's certainly not necessary to do it. It might harm his performance if he didn't, but that's the way the cookie crumbles. Regardless, it's well known in carbon brakes that glazing comes when you lightly touch the brake pedal, skimming the surface at low heat levels.

It may not be necessary in your opinion .... but you weren't in the car.

And yes, that's what causes glazing .... which may well be why Hamilton was trying to keep braking as heavily as possible, to avoid it.

He didn't have any degradation... he would have limited heat in them, but so would everyone else.

That others may have had the same problem doesn't mean Hamilton didn't have brake degradation. Carbon brakes need to be kept HOT to work properly. The cooler they get, the less responsive and consistent they get.

The use of carbon brakes requires a little time to get used to .... during the first milliseconds after pressing the brake-pedal; it feels like nothing is happening. This delay is in fact the length of time required by the disc/caliper tandem to reach operating temperature, which increases by 100°C per tenth of a second for the first half-second of braking, after which it can reach up to 1200°C. After that short period, deceleration is immediate, and brutal.

So ..... with the lack of speed due to the safety car deployment, and the water, brakes will be cooling more than would normally be expected. The cooler they get, the bigger the lag before they really kick in.

So in saying he didn't have any degradation, my question is .... how on earth can you know that? What temp were his brakes at that moment?

Oh, and that quote about brake operation .... that was Alonso, by the way.

I've been massively impressed with Hamilton's racing, obviously Sunday included. He's been exceptional all year, but where I differ from most F1 fans is that I don't support any individual. I've been a massive fan of the sport for 20 years now, only missing a single GP since 1989, and as such I'll give an opinion on anything, no matter who it's regarding. Nationalism has no place for me. Bias never comes into what I write. I just say it as I see it. I'm not about to jump on Bernie's bandwagon.

I would hope you would give an opinion on anything. But nationalism has no part of my view on this either, and I'm CERTAINLY not jumping on the poison dwarf's bandwagon. Nor, do I have any bias. I no longer give a fig what happens in F1. The 'spying' saga was, for me, the last straw. They can punish Lewis or not, they can boot McLaren out of F1 or not, they can fine who they like however much they like or they can abandon F1 completely to the dustbin of history as far as I'm concerned, and I'd don't give a flying fig either way.

[this_is_gav]

And I'd wager that your conjecture is at least partly based on stories you've seen on F1 forums, many of which the Great British public are blisfully unaware of. Again, pinch of salt needed, but they seemingly come from reliable sources, and if they were about Alonso we'd be reading all about it in The Sun no doubt.

It came from watching the footage.

It may not be necessary in your opinion .... but you weren't in the car.

No, no. It's not necessary full stop. If it's detrimental to his performance, then tough luck. He has no justification to start bending and breaking rules just because his performance might suffer.

That others may have had the same problem doesn't mean Hamilton didn't have brake degradation. Carbon brakes need to be kept HOT to work properly. The cooler they get, the less responsive and consistent they get.

I'm well aware of that, thank you, but again, tough. Others had to put up with it. Is he allowed prefential treatment? These are some of the worlds best drivers. They can put up with with braking 10m earlier into turn 1...

So ..... with the lack of speed due to the safety car deployment, and the water, brakes will be cooling more than would normally be expected. The cooler they get, the bigger the lag before they really kick in.

Read above. Anyway, the main problem with cool brakes, especially in the wet, is that they just snatch sooner.

Regarding degradation over others, perhaps I phrased that poorly. Perhaps retardation would have been a more appropriate term. Thought it was quite clear what I meant anyway.

[this_is_gav]

All conjecture on my part, but it appears McLaren have fuelled Hamilton lightly, while they've dumped a hell of a lot in Alonso's car, and he's not happy about it. Either that, or we may be hearing him 'suggesting' that they've given him dodgy tyres or incorrect pressures or something. Hamilton's lap was bordering on epic, but there's no way he was 6 tenths faster on merit. Alonso had had a slight edge on him all through the weekend.

"The team has told me that yesterday in qualyfing I was so slow cause there was a mistake, they put to much pressure in the tyres".

Just too predictable.