What are these things for?

[mediaboy]

What are these things?

Standard Attainment Tests? or simply Stupid and Tiresome?

These stupid things (SATs, year 9 level) have been harped on about pretty much permamently for the last 6 months of my school life...

What's the point in them? I mean, yes they provide the government something with which they can compare schools with, but is there any point in putting teenagers... and younger people (11 yr olds, and I think it's 7 year olds, but not entirely sure) under the sort of stress that they are forced into.

These don't influence your life.
When I go and apply for university in 4-6 years I'm not going to be asked "What did you get in your SATs? where you predicted all 7s?" (I am actually predicted 100% across all my subjects, so don't think this thread is because I can't do it..) However, I might be asked "what did you get at GCSE?"



UCAS

In fact, it's almost a certainty. Tell me if I'm wrong, but GCSEs and Higher count towards UCAS points (or the UCAS tarrif) and nothing below that counts.

Quoting from wikipedia, you can get UCAS points for the following;

AS and A-Levels.
Vocational AS and A-Levels
Scottish qualifications
BTECs
OCRs
CACHE diplomas
Art and Design foundation Diplomas
Leaving Certificate (Established)
Wlesh Baccalaureate Core
Advanced Placement Exams
Advanced Extension Awards
Core Skills
Key Skills Qualification
Free-standing Mathematics Qualifications
Certificate in Finacial Studies
Assosiciated Board of the Royal Schools of Music
and International Baccalaureate. (from this year onwards)


This means, that... before I even start my GCSEs etc. I've got 100 points for Music Exams alone.

However, having 90%+ in all my school exams for the last 10 years of my miserable school life counts for nothing. It's irrelevant, not applicable and certainly not interesting.



How much time should I spend revising?

So why should I bother? It's a waste of my time to spend 210 minutes a week revising (which is... for your information... advised. 10 minutes every day for 10 days)

Of course, that 3 1/2 is before adding on my homework and adding on GCSE preparation time (for a short course I'm doing.)

All in all, I'm given around 1-2 hours/subject/week. I have 11 subjects, of which 9 give me homework. This week, they all told me to revise. That's another 9-18 hours this week, or 90 minutes/day.

My prep is about another 90-150 minutes/week.

This week, thereforce, I'm expected to do up to 24 hours revision or preparation, not including time I'm supposed to add up to by myself.

So altogether I'm looking at spending most of my free time revising. It is, however, limited.. due to other commitments, such as the fact I work part-time for another 6-10 hours a week, occasionally even hititng 20 hours a week when the weather's good and fate shines upon me.



Do I have this time?

Giving you a brief rundown of my day let me give you an example of the free time I would have, for instance, on a Monday (my current "free" day)


7:30. Wake up
8:00. Have Breakfast
8:25. Go to school
8.45. School starts
15.30. School ends
16.00. Get home
17.00. Go to work (choir on monday's. I sing part-time in a choir, for which I recieve £5/hour)
19.00. Get home
19.30. Have tea.
21.30. Go bed.
22.30. Get some sleep

Of course, according to government figures I should have 9 hours sleep. This means that my routine for beginning/ending the day is about right.

What happens in between is up to me.



Now, the argument for me revising is that I can't be busy all the time, and I can't be doing stuff all the time.

Well no. Of course not. I could have 30 minutes less sleep and not worry too much. I can get by quite happily with 6 hours sleep, and manage with 4 (tested and tried before you start commenting. I was terse in the morning, but about 3 hours after waking up I was back to my normal self.) Of course, I didn't sustain it, is was too much of a drag on me to not lose my temper with people around me...

But yet again, I could be waking up at 3 in the morning and not be worrying. But there wouldn't be any point in waking up that early. American's (why is it always american's who do pointless research?) have wasted millions of pounds on proving that the human body is less responsive during the hours of 12am to 6am. In other words - the first quarter of the day.


But I might wake up at 6am you say. Do 2 hours work before breakfast and that's it.

Yes, wonderful... let's wake up 2 hours early. 6 weeks into the routine I'd have adapted. But over time I'd suffer. I'd lose my temper more often (last time I lost my temper I smashed a hole in one of the school walls. If they had chosen to press charges and make me pay for damages I would have owed in the excess of £2000) and become shorter and terser with teachers.

My schoolwork would begin to suffer slowly, as I wouldn't be learning more. It'd probably take a year or so for it to be noticeable, as I'm so far ahead of everyone else I could probably sleep through most of my lessons and still come out with semi-decent marks in all my tests.. one of the benefits of reading through a few GCSE past papers for science (all three sciences), english language and mathematics. I know vaguely what would be useful to know and could probably get at least a C in one science and maths.

Of course, it's all theoretical. I might be less intelligent that what I'm giving me credit for. It's been remarked on before that I am "arrogant and consider's himself beyond other pupils." I beg to differ, as I know for a certainty that other's in my year can keep up with me in subjects, and that I am transceded in some. My PE suffers, as it does not interest me, and in other subjects people have a natural talent (like I apparently have for maths.. according to my teacher.)

Of course, 2 hours gets me 10 hours a week... not really anywhere near the 24 hours they advise for a year nine/year 10 student (mixed due to part GCSE course)

So let's pretend I've done these 10 hours, and look at other ways of getting aonther 14 hours crammed in.


Some more techniques

One advised technique was subconscious learning. However spending money to get resources - such as Postit notes - to use for revision purposes. Yes it may not seem like much to you big earners, but having just spent all my money on a computer (plus £200+ of my parent's money.. which I am now paying back) I don't have money to spend. Neither will either my parents or my school refund me for any materials I use.

So that rules out subconscious revising (the "CD player and headphones method", and the "stick it on your mirror method" - although I don't have one - and a few other similar ones.) as I simply don't have the money or funding available to get the items required.

What other method's are there? I already spend 3 hours a week teaching (or reminding them of the subjects) my friends maths and science (the subjects I excel at) for free, whilst helping other peers revise for a small cost (small... as in really small. £1 for spending an hour at school teaching/revising basic topics with them). I don't give up my time for nothing to those not in my friendship groups.. after all, I could be working elsewhere and earning £5/hour.

I have to admit though, due to an honest conscience, that as of yet only 1/100 of my entire year group (of approximately 200) is willing to pay me to help them revise, as the rest feel that teachers are better than me to teach them the subject... even if the teacher's do use the official methods which take three times as long as a proper method.

Mindmapping needs resources, as do quite a few other techniques, and to be honest, I don't see the point. It's not as if it's going to do much but irritate the hell out of me at the fact that I have to trail through stuff that I was doing back when everyone else was still trying to add 5 and 5 and come out with the right answer.

I was working in base 3 and working out the Fibbonachi sequence mentally (to the 67th digit, before someone interrupted me) when everyone else was doing their times tables. I was busy planning fair experiements when everyone else's science lessons were dependant on playdo (the good old days eh... all of 12 years ago) and I was building websites and writing basic HTML when everyone else was trying to find the right button to turn on the PC.



Learning

My techniques for learning are simple: Find a book on it. Read it. Use the knowledge to do something. Find something else to learn.

Where I can't find a book I find someone that knows the topic, and start asking questions about it. It's alot quicker than waiting for school to teach you about something..... which generally takes 4-5 years, depending on what it is (z co-ordinates are a doddle... but they're A level or higher I was told... 4 years into the future. As is doing stuff like factorising equations and multiplying out complex brackets of algebra... which is only a year away (foundation or intermediate maths))



Of course, I've got Special Needs.
I'm not, however, like the Special Needs that many people stereotype the word is. I am commonly refered to as the "Special Case" along with the 18 other pupils (exactly 18...) in my year who keep up with me, or transcede me.

We have booster lessons for GCSE RE, and we're all predicted 95% or higher in our SATs... with 4 of us predicted 300% (100% in all of our tests)

We do however, still have to sit through maths and english and science lessons. It's pointless.
And I know for a fact, that they all find revision equally pointless. Along with SATs. We were doing A-Level stuff last year (we weren't told, but instead of writing answers to questions we wrote essays.. which is apparently A-Level.. not sure about this though) and we mostly get bored and talk about off-topic stuff. Like what we had for dinner last night.

19 cleverest people in the entire school and we still talk about last night's episode of Eastenders (for the record; I hate this show) what we had for dinner, how we're going to cause Armageddon and what might happen if you were to stick a kilogram of Francium into a fluid kilogram of Hydrochloric Acid. We decided that not being the country would be a good idea for those that are interested (with Francium being the most reactive Alkali Metal, and Hydrochloric Acid being a fairly powerful acid.)



Conclusion

Getting back onto the topic: what is the point of these tests? They take up time, they don't earn us money, they don't give us anything later on in life? Why should we waste our time doing them when we might as well just be out earning money or doing something worthwhile... like preparing for the IT GCSE that I'm probably going to do on my own, and the German GCSE that I might be doing at the end of this year.

At least these are useful things, that might count towards something!




Sources


Ten Revision Tips
BBC - Schools Parents - Homework: How much?
UCAS - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[muddyfox470]

SATs provide a useful benchmark for your school and the government to see progress in your education.

Sure it's stupid you have so many exams through your education at school but it has been the same for all of us, you will just have to grin and bear it. SATs mean nothing in the grander scale of things, but it can tell you that you need to do more work etc.

I don't know why you are complaining anyway because they are easy!

[Whiternoise]

Personally i didn't find them stressful at all.. they seemed rather pointless and easy and it seemed a waste of year 9 doing them.

I think you're getting worked up over not a great deal. From the sounds of it, you're in your GCSE years. Fine. Revision wise, depending on what subjects you do, you needn't do nearly as much as you're saying. I got decent grades (A's and 2 B's) from doing a lot of revision near to the exam time. But nowhere near as much as you said you're planning on doing. Oh and they won't even ask for your gcse's mostly, it will be "Oh, you got all A*s that's nice, now what A level grades did you get?" Since you appear to be a bright student, why not just take an A level or two early? That might satisfy your need for proper work

The most effective form of revision is thus:

Take the specification from the relevant website
Make notes based on what the spec says
Learn these notes
Get full marks in the exam

And with regards to your question about Francium and HCl, it would be a valiant attempt, but it would be impossible to isolate the Francium in a 1kg lump to drop into the acid. If you could isolate a kilogram, you would probably be dead from radiation poisoning before you could put it into a container to go in the acid vat.

The point of these tests, as you surmised early on is that they are a convenient way for governments to benchmark schools and for schools to predict your GCSE grades and to ensure that everyone is up to a basic standard of education.

As a final point, you can hardly complain that you're being set that much revision if you're loading yourself up with part time work and so forth

EDIT: I voted no simply because i think there are better ways of benchmarking kids than exams. SATs may be a convenient method for countrywide examinations and as the best current method, but i think that schools should make up their own minds as to how they do it. Kids should spend more time preparing for GCSE and A level rather than SATs. GCSE Maths, for instance could easily be taught and finished in a year.

[staffsMike]

Dude..Wait until your less than 2 weeks away from the end of your degree and then talk to me about stress..

SATS!! .. enjoy it while it lasts mate!

They also counted towards what set you were in at my school, which also meant which level of exam you took which in turn meant what grade you could acheive overall.

[shadowmaster]

Personally i didn't find them stressful at all.. they seemed rather pointless and easy and it seemed a waste of year 9 doing them.

I think you're getting worked up over not a great deal. From the sounds of it, you're in your GCSE years. Fine. Revision wise, depending on what subjects you do, you needn't do nearly as much as you're saying. I got decent grades (A's and 2 B's) from doing a lot of revision near to the exam time. But nowhere near as much as you said you're planning on doing. Oh and they won't even ask for your gcse's mostly, it will be "Oh, you got all A*s that's nice, now what A level grades did you get?"Since you appear to be a bright student, why not just take an A level or two early? That might satisfy your need for proper work

Agree.

GCSE's are quite easy and you don’t need that much revision to do well in them. As long as you understand the material and organise some light revision you should be fine. I did a quarter of the revision you are saying but got very good grades. Also GCSEs don’t play that big of a part in your ucas application for uni. It does depend somewhat on the course you choose. For example if you choose medicine, or apply for oxbridge, then they play a part otherwise don’t worry too much about them. A good set of A levels and decent personal statement would normally get most people into their choice of uni.

In regard to KS3, not too sure. I never did them but don’t they lead into GCSE's? The highest you can get (correct me if I am wrong) are Levels 8, 7, 7 in maths, science and english. I have been told that a level 8 at KS3 equates to a grade B at gcse, and level 7 to a grade C at gcse. My maths teacher told me this a couple years ago but I don’t know if he knew what he was on about. If this is the case then they are probably not worth it, makes more sense to start learning some GCSE stuff in year nine.

[explicitlyrics]

Sounds really annoying to say it but I have my finals in less than 2 weeks and I am cr*pping my pants! I have to say I didnt find school stressful at all, they always told me to do 2.5+hours work a night but I think that is just to make you feel bad. I rarely did more than 10mins work a day and only did work for 1 of my 4 A-levels yet I comfortably got 4 A's.

As I said, its just a way of making you do SOME work (if they said do 10mins then most people would do none). You definitely dont need to start working at 6am and be working till 11pm, your social life would vanish very fast! Dont worry about results in Year 9/10 and even GCSE's dont make much difference if you go on to A-levels.

[Agent]

Dude..Wait until your less than 2 weeks away from the end of your degree and then talk to me about stress..

Think we're in the same boat by the sounds of it....

Why after 4 years have I still not learnt: When they give you a year to do a project, there is a good reason for it

[Rave]

In my entire life I reckon I've probably done about 5 hours of actual revision. I spent hours and hours in my parents' study doing 'GCSE revision': which actually consisted of reading a mountain bike magazine so many times that I basically had it memorised word for word (I was well into mountain biking at the time, to be fair).

End result: A*s in Physics, Maths, and Chemistry, 4 As, a B and two Cs in English Language and Literature (which is a bloody joke, but I'm over it now). Nowadays that's not an especially impressive set of results but in 1995 an A* in Maths put me in the top 1.8%.

You've basically answered your own question: of course SATs make no difference to your life, the school are encouraging you to do well because they want good league table scores (or good scores in whatever comparator they use now).

[sim_uk84]

Having been through university I would say that most degrees aren't even worthwhile nevermind year 9 SATs lol. But in all seriousness you should treat them as more of a stepping stone to your GCSEs which in turn get you to your to A-levels and then university if you so desire. So although SATs mean bugger all by themselves, they're a means to an end. Having said that, I really wouldn't worry about having to be strict with revision and so on, I don't think anyone expects you to sacrifice on sleep or every last spare minute you have to cram in schoolwork.

[Rosaline]

Why after 4 years have I still not learnt: When they give you a year to do a project, there is a good reason for it

You and me both
Going absolutely loopy here with the stress, but very much looking forward to the real world (TM)!

As for the topic at hand - SATs are used to judge any streaming for GCSEs. The year 9 SATs themselves are well placed, however many of the newly introduced earlier ones are just making things silly, especially compared to some education systems on the continent.

[iranu]

From your post you are obviously very bright and have pretty much reasoned the answer for yourself. SATs are about government and statistics. The system is already being criticised for turning out drones who can pass exams and nothing else. Don't sweat it too much, whilst the desire to do well is probably driving you to do the revision it's of absolutely no importance to the rest of your life. Your teachers will already know you well enough to decide which streaming (set?) to put you in. If people are pressuring you then it's a good idea to speak to them and your parents about it. It's your life and your well being is more important than the school's league table position. Personally I didn't worry about exams when I was 14 (although there wasn't the same amount of pressure then). Make sure that you have a balanced week, all work and no play is not good. Enjoy yourself and give yourself more freedom and then put the harder effort in for GCSE and subsequent A-levels/Highers. I know it's a cliché but you are only young once. Try and enjoy it.

Dude..Wait until your less than 2 weeks away from the end of your degree and then talk to me about stress..

SATS!! .. enjoy it while it lasts mate!

Listen to Mike. Finals are nerve racking, nothing I've done before or since compares (well maybe a bungie jump but I'm scared of heights), and oh how sweet did that first pint taste after my last exam, a great sense of freedom.

Reminds me of my viva, at the end of an hour and a half of being grilled.

Chemistry bod from another university: So what are you going to do now?
iranu: Well it's 5 to 11, so the pub will be open.
Chemistry bod from another university: No, I mean what are you going to do with the rest of your life? Do you have a job to go to?
iranu: Errr, no. (whilst thinking oh sh*t! that means I've blown any case for upping a borderline mark).

I've not done too badly.

[mediaboy]

Why did I expect these sorts of comments?

OK, I'll answer them as best as I can.


I'm not complaining abuot stress: I'm complaining about the system in general. I don't care tuppence about my SATs. Most of my year does. Meaning that I get stress from all my friends who are stressing out.

The stress is second-hand.. because they percieve me as someone they can complain and panic too, every single crying fit, every single giving up and everything else is aimed at me.

Sure, it's not stressful... but having 50 people come and panic at you? It's like in other situations: the person in charge gets stressed because everyone complains to him... or if he seems unapproachable, the rest of the team handling the situation gets the stress. It's life.


iranu - nice to know that you've got more important things than chemistry exams on your mind.... you can always pop down to the pub...


SATs used as streaming for GCSEs? Every single school I've been to and looked at as possible places to go to next year tell me that I will take a test in my choices before being "setted."

Making SATs irrelevant.


I do beg to differ about GCSEs being irrelevant.. they count as UCAS, meaning that I can apply to a different higher education place!!! Yay... I have even more possible choices.. more work

Why is it that everything is measured in points? Apart from the obvious league tables that is.

Predicted As and higher for my GCSEs in one-two years (based on current levels in Year 9... which I am in, not year 10-11) so I could probably sleep through next year to catch up on sleep

Agent - when they give you a year to do a project, do it in 6 and spend the other 6 doing something else...

I have a vague recollection of a year 7 IT project; do a powerpoint about your life. It was supposed to last a fair while... about 14 weeks (a school term at this point) and I did it in one lesson and spent the other 13 doing all the other Year 7 work. Having completed most of the work for my year 9 curriculum previous to this year, I now am in the middle of spending 6 hours a day being bored out of my mind by teachers... not that that's anything new mind.

Doubt it'll change as I get older either.

shadow - you're ABOUT right. The highest grades you can get on the paper's is 7,7,8 (english, science, maths) but you can then go onto a practical science test (test conditions, you must prove/disprove a situation) and a spoken english exam, both of which can be considered as "level 8" although you are unlikely to have this as an official grade.

EP (classwork mark only) equates to an A or higher.
Level 8 equates to a B
Level 7 equates to a C
Level 6 equates to a D
Level 5 equates to a E
Level 4 and below equates to a F

Means I can probably do music, maths, science, english and most other of the subjects I'm learning at the moment, come out with 11 GCSEs (all above pass marks) before going on to do another 11 next year.... that'd be funny, but expensive, and I'd also have to go away and look at some of the test papers for them... or do an entire year's coursework in 11 subjects in under 4 months (I count down the day till I can finally burn this RE book of mine... a promised reward if we get an A or higher)


explicit - I don't have a social life anyway, as all of my friends ARE spending 1-2 hours a day+ extra revising for SATs. Meaning that I can't convince them to do anything interesting.

We are planning to have an after-SATs thingy... At our own expense and at my effort (because I'm the only one that they think has "free time") we're planning on spending the weekend after doing one thing after another, starting off with paintballing.

The main problem with this idea is that all of the paintballing arenas in the area are fully booked at these times... Presmably everyone else had the same idea


whiter - to suggest that I'm "loading" myself with part time work would be right. It means I can spend most of my weekends doing something useful... instead of staying at home and getting stressed out by the steady trickle of people that either ring me or talk to me on MSN about these exams...

Very few people realise that there is no point in them.



Just for a final point;

why should the government tell me what to learn... when they can't work out the average inflation rate (approximately 200% over 4 years) without coming out with their new magic number; 2.75%?

[Mblaster]

UCAS

In fact, it's almost a certainty. Tell me if I'm wrong, but GCSEs and Higher count towards UCAS points (or the UCAS tarrif) and nothing below that counts.

Even GCSEs really make little difference, they don't count towards points for UCAS (95% sure on that, my little brother is going through the process now), and as long as you can get the 5 or more A-C grades needed to progress to college/6th form then that's enough. Also, once you get to uni you'll not be listing all your grades anyway. Just the over all number and the ones relevant to your choice of job.

How much time should I spend revising?

So why should I bother? It's a waste of my time to spend 210 minutes a week revising (which is... for your information... advised. 10 minutes every day for 10 days)

Personally, I didn't do any revision until I got to a-levels, and I'm glad I didn't waste my time. I can't see any personal benefit out of revising for your SATs, once they're done, you'll never look at the results again, and nor will anyone else.

Conclusion

Getting back onto the topic: what is the point of these tests? They take up time, they don't earn us money, they don't give us anything later on in life? Why should we waste our time doing them when we might as well just be out earning money or doing something worthwhile... like preparing for the IT GCSE that I'm probably going to do on my own, and the German GCSE that I might be doing at the end of this year.

At least these are useful things, that might count towards something!

Seems like you've already come to the same conclusion I did, you're better off spending time on something that will actually give you some benefit, or something you will actually enjoy, than to bother wasting time on revision at this stage in your education, since the results have no bearing on your future.

Side note: You could probably submit this as a piece of English coursework

[Steve]

I shall express my opinion in rhyme:

SATs in year nine: fine.
SATs before: no more!

The tests they do in primary school are pointless, but Yr 9 SATs are a bit of a warm up for GCSEs. Yes they don't count for much in the long run, but that's a good thing - it gives people a chance to get their act together.

[mediaboy]

Doing both GCSE+Year 9 SATs gives me a bit of an advantage. I can compare them


I can saw with 100% certainty that SATs are not a "warm-up" for GCSEs.


In terms of steps... Year 9 SATs are on step 1
GCSEs are on step 15 or 16... maybe slightly higher.

They put you on the staircase and say.. "walk uphill."
But they forget to teach you what "uphill" means.

[iranu]

Have you considered doing some part time paid or even voluntary work? It would get you out of the house, you could turn the mobile off, it would occupy your time/mind and you'd get some reward from it. Something else to chuck on the C.V./UCAS form too.

Taking up another hobby or sport that you enjoy is another good way to get away from it all.