Word of warning of cloning

[silent ben]

My computing teacher was talking about chip and pin the other day, and he had alot of information from people working on the technology. Supposdly there are 9 security levels built into the card so its "impossible" to break in and steal the ID number. Even if you did get the ID number, the card has to verify that it is real with the banks computer before any data is transfered.

The main problem i have with chip and pin is the idea is the card never leaves your hand so cant be cloned, but whenever i've been to a shop, the other customers give the card to the assistant who places it in the reader for them. I've actually had a mini-arguement with a cashier once because she wouldn't let me put my card in the reader in case i "did it wrong"

[Kumagoro]

Surely the security codes on the card are encrypted properly now... but then again
they probably arnt. I always check for card reader now and drum into my gfs head to
check too. Also they normally stick a camera above the keypad to record your input
too. If i ever come across one i would take it haha.

They should put photos on cards too... there should be lots of security features.

My ex once lost her credit card in london and the person who found it spent £8000
luckly she didnt lose anything. The thing that gets me though was that her signature
was in japanese and the chances of someone from east asia picking it up seems slim to
me....

[criss2002r1]

I think it could aggravate the situation more in some cases.
There is one major flaw with chip + pin: how do you know that the system that your punching your numbers in is even linked to the bank in anyway?
Heck, I could knock up a keypad that records what numbers were pressed on it.

What makes it bad is that there is so many models of the chip and pin handset, you can’t tell just by looking at one. How easy would it be to put some circuitry in there that records every pin entered? few meg of flash ram would store thousands of numbers.
Just wait for a customer to come up with a small purchase amount, pull the “cloned” chip and pin device out, print off a face receipt and your done.
Okay, so its not going to happen in the big high-street chains, but your local corner-shop might not think twice.

You wouldnt even need to goto all that trouble. A well placed security camera would do the job good enough.

Boom You nailed it Buddy I would be bustin me up a gas attendant cause thats the scam some how they seen your card or really just ur pin # cause then they could just bring the card # back up if its a 4or 5 digit pin u could see it from watching ur fingers on the pad or whatever... Im from the states and when MC and Discover thought they were smart with criedit cards containing a scannable IR chips so a person dont have to goto all that trouble of putting thier hand in their pocket... It was on for all the Techy scum bags I could spot them out in the mall just strolling along with thier IR readers bout 15 ft distance and bam you just read someones card... Worst thing in world Thief next is Lier and he dont trust the Thief.... Dude whatever you do dont let that slide cause there be more people like you Take Care wish you luck

[criss2002r1]

U say Chip if its a IR chip you can buy IR readers cheap 10ft 15ft I could read the card you would never know til you got ur statement ....Beware Demand that your Financial Institute encrypts the card

[TheAnimus]

erm ok.

Major thread revival, but i have to point out.

You can't clone the gold chip from chip + pin.

(feasably)

All you can easily clone is the magnetic stripe, this is why you REALLY should have a differen't pin on your debit card, than your debit card for cash point withdrawls, this is because in some 3rd world countries (say france) on the link/visa+ network, they only auth against the mag stripe in cash points. They don't auth against the chip. All card transactions now should use the the chip (via the pin) else the signature is just as fallable as ever (which is what i guess happened above in 2005).

[Stoo]

Sooooooooo ooooold.

Now, so closed