Tax On Tax

[badass]

Being British is putting up with these things.

Yep like everything else we dont agree with. Put up cos we cant be arsed with doing something about it.

Ooooh that company's screwed me over. Well its only £X and it'll be a lot of hassle to get it back.

Oh look that used car dealer's screwed me. I'll just write off the money and moan about it rather than taking the scum to court.

ooooh look Tony Blair's screwed us over again. Lets vote him in again then as there's no one better.

One of the reasons I'm gonig to be out of here in the next 5 years. You get rewarded here if you're a **** and screwed if you're honest and hard working.

[badass]

PS I dont have a problem with inheritance tax Just the way this country has become.

[Howard]

it doesn't annoy me that people come here from other countries so long as -

1. They make an effort to learn the language to a decent extent, and when I say decent I do not mean to the extent that we learn languages when we go on holiday for 2 weeks, please , thank you and where is the bathroom are just not good enough if you intend to live in a country no matter who you are.



2.They work for a living, and I mean really work like everybody else, to get into some countries you have to already have a job planned/useful trade, in this country it is literally an open house for anyone, people come here with no job and no money and they have to sign on benifits because they can't find a job for whatever reason.

3. You do not treat me like a visitor in my own country, you don't tell me to change my way of life, you came to this country and you should accept with that its traditions and everything that comes with it. Winterfest my ass.

I couldn't agree more.

[Rave]

3. You do not treat me like a visitor in my own country, you don't tell me to change my way of life, you came to this country and you should accept with that its traditions and everything that comes with it. Winterfest my ass.

As far as I can tell 'winterfest' is a myth, although the Sun and the Mail drag it out at every opportunity. In fact the Sun (on a slow news day I presume) actually had a 'Save Christmas' issue IIRC, in which they recycled several myths and half-truths to make it sound as if 'Christmas is under threat!!' when in fact it isn't in any way. Google couldn't find me any genuine example of someone proposing to replace Christmas with winterfest- can you?

Iranu: you ask why the government 'taxes twice'. I ask why you should get a load of money just because you're lucky enough to have wealthy parents. The government has to get it's income from somewhere. Income tax is actually a very fair tax IMO because it takes money from the richest people who can best afford to pay. As a result of it the aristocracy has nowhere near as much power as they used to in this country- good. Anyway, you can moan and fuss all you like, inheritance tax isn't going away, because the majority of people in this country aren't affected by it and would be poorer if it was abolished.

[Skii]

Tax on savings I just don't get.

[Swafe]

Iranu: you ask why the government 'taxes twice'. I ask why you should get a load of money just because you're lucky enough to have wealthy parents. The government has to get it's income from somewhere. Income tax is actually a very fair tax IMO because it takes money from the richest people who can best afford to pay. As a result of it the aristocracy has nowhere near as much power as they used to in this country- good. Anyway, you can moan and fuss all you like, inheritance tax isn't going away, because the majority of people in this country aren't affected by it and would be poorer if it was abolished.

Lucky to have wealthy parents? More like lucky your parents worked damned hard to get you a good inheritance, and if their money wasn't earnt by themselves, bar winning the lottery its gotta come from somewhere, probably their grandparents working hard.

I dont think its fair, and I dont think its selfish in the slightest, sure your getting a big wad of money as an inheritance, but no matter how great or small it is, it doesnt give them goverment to take money off you once tax has already been paid in full. You work hard to earn savings, paying in your wages into your bank account, when that rainy day comes for you to take it out, would you be happy that after a certain threshold, say 10 grand, you got charged 40% tax on the money you took out? Its a similar thing, sure its not your money as such, but its your familys, and when you come to inheriting it, it is as good as.

[Rave]

No, it's just not the same at all. You personally didn't earn it, therefore you are lucky to get it. I wouldn't care if my parents rubbishrubbishrubbishrubbishrubbished my inheritance on holidays/cars/cocaine/whatever, because they've fulfilled their obligation to me by paying for me for the first 18 years of my life.

For once the law is on my side here so I really don't feel the need to argue with all you people getting your knickers in a twist because the government's taking a bite out of your free money. Ah diddums

[Swafe]

The laws on your side, so your instantly, morally right?

I know *I* didn't earn it, and if my rents want to blow their money on whatever they want be it drugs, hookers, or even a holiday in wales, I'm fine with that, I just see the threadmakers point. The money should go to the next of kin, whether it be kids, adoptees or even cousins, not the government, they dont appear in my will or my family tree

[Rave]

Morally, my position is clear- you didn't earn it, therefore you're not entitled to it. I really don't see how that's complicated. I would have no problem with a 100% inheritance tax.

[Twigman]

surely its for the will maker (the desceased) to decide where the money goes? If they choose to give it to the government they can. Ohterwise the property goes to who ever you decide

As I understand it, if you are rich, get some Trust fund set up-ed ness thing. Yes that does make sense. If you are a rich mofo set up a trust fund thing and do all the nonsense you can and you can get away with paying little amounts of tax by playing the system. Its a massive business I believe.

[iranu]

I guess Rave should give back all those presents he was given as a child, all those pints of beer he's been bought etc etc ertc etc etc etc etc etc. Because he didn't earn it. Perhaps lottery ticket winners should give all their winnings to the government because after all they didn't earn it.

Give me a sound definition of "earning it"

It is not a question of earning it, it's a question of allowing individual people to choose what they do with their money - Rave does not understand how inheritance tax works. The tax is paid on the value of the estate. For example if I am the sole beneficiary of £500,000 estate I have to pay 40% tax (200k) on that estate before I am allowed to inherit it. If there are 10 people each getting 50k, the tax on the estate is still 40%. The estate of the dead person is taxed not the individual who benefits from it.

Secondly, why are you always looking at it from the inheritors POV - what about the person who owns the estate? Surely it should be upto the individual to CHOOSE how they distribute their estate/wealth on dying. I guess you simply prefer the communist ideal where the state owns everything and therefore the people own everything.

If I buy a car for my child should the government get it's slice just because my child is benefitting? He didn't earn it so therefore I should not be generous. Sh1t, the starving africans in Niger didn't earn the money I gave them (through oxfam) at the weekend. Perhaps I shouldn't have donated, after all they didn't earn it. Perhaps it would be good if the government took 40% of my donation.

After all the government earns it, don't they Rave?

The reason for inheritance tax was to ensure that a tax was paid by the very, very, very wealthy i.e. the top 1%. Beacuse successive greedy governments have not raised the threshold in line with inflation/cost indexes etc, more and more ordinary people (i.e. not awash with money) are being caught by this tax.

e.g. the pensioner who has lived in the same house for 40 years, has scrimpted and saved but still relies on the basic state pension and struggles to pay Council Tax. Just because their house is now worth £300,000 they are not rich. Nor for example is the pensioner's son who earns 12k per year and cannot afford to buy a house himself.

Why should he have to pay 40% tax when the property has been given to him in a will. £300,000 at 40% is £120,000 so he's left with £180,000. That is not alot of money in modern Britain if you are looking to buy a house. (Average price 190k) it's not gold taps territory

Perhaps Rave would prefer the pensioners son and his family to continue to rely on the State for hand outs for housing rather than - oh the shock, the horror, BENIFIT from a relative through chance. Good lord. We work for ourselves and our children not the sodding State. To be able to pass something on to others is not selfish, in the case of our children it's the most natural thing in the world.

Raves seems to want an idealised communist state where you are stripped of everything the day you were born, shoved into a government establishment where everyone gets exactly the same quantity of food, exactly the same care and attention, schooling etc etc and is then kicked out at 18 to make it or end up in the gutter. And when you do make it all your wealth is taken by the state when you die in order to start the whole wretched cycle again.

Rave you seem to be jealous of others who have a little money.

PEOPLE ARE NOT BORN EQUAL, GET USED TO IT, IT'S CALLED LIFE.

[schmunk]

e.g. the pensioner who has lived in the same house for 40 years, has scrimpted and saved but still relies on the basic state pension and struggles to pay Council Tax. Just because their house is now worth £300,000 they are not rich. Nor for example is the pensioner's son who earns 12k per year and cannot afford to buy a house himself.

Why should he have to pay 40% tax when the property has been given to him in a will. £300,000 at 40% is £120,000 so he's left with £180,000. That is not alot of money in modern Britain if you are looking to buy a house. (Average price 190k) it's not gold taps territory
.

Wrong:

£275,000 at 0% = £0
£25,000 at 40% = £10,000

Therefore the beneficiary is left with £290,000 and is able to move into a £300,000 house with only a £10,000 mortgage. I'd say that makes him pretty well off...

[schmunk]

The reason for inheritance tax was to ensure that a tax was paid by the very, very, very wealthy i.e. the top 1%. Beacuse successive greedy governments have not raised the threshold in line with inflation/cost indexes etc, more and more ordinary people (i.e. not awash with money) are being caught by this tax.

OK, where would you like the threshold and from where would you get the extra money that isn't being collected from IHT? Or are you suggesting that you could run the country on a smaller budget?

[schmunk]

PEOPLE ARE NOT BORN EQUAL, GET USED TO IT, IT'S CALLED LIFE.

Oh, how very humanitarian of you.

[smtkr]

Morally, my position is clear- you didn't earn it, therefore you're not entitled to it. I really don't see how that's complicated. I would have no problem with a 100% inheritance tax.

Morally, your position is unclear. While it is true that most people don't earn inheritance, neither does the government. It wouldn't be hard to argue that the money could serve better in the hands of a private individual than the government, who will likely spend it on a $400 hammer or something equally insane. I guess my question is, "who should the money go to?" While some people may indeed earn it by taking care of their parents when they are old, in a vast majority of the cases, no one earns the money. Personally, it makes sense to me to keep the money within the lineage, but I can understand a 50-50 opinion.

Luckily, none of it affects me because my parents are in the 'I hope Matt makes a good living so I can mooch off him when I'm too old to work and realize I never saved anything for retirement' group. Hopefully, my geographic distance will push this responsibility off onto my brother.

[Swafe]

But what if hes a student, got no money to his name or has debts? He inherits a house worth 300k, BUT, has to pay 10k in tax, bit harsh having to sell your inheritance without going into debt to the government