Little rant on the NHS

[Russ]

I think you will find that labour are just as likely to kill off the NHS. That is what it looks like from inside anyways.

insdie what? a box? do you work at a hospital?

badass - as for paying through the nose, you have no idea how much each operation would cost if you were private.

[menthel]

If you read my posts, as you obviously have not, I am a doctor who has spent the last 5 years working in various trusts good and bad, big and small. And some politeness wouldn't go a miss.

[Bazzlad]

insdie what? a box? do you work at a hospital?

badass - as for paying through the nose, you have no idea how much each operation would cost if you were private.

So Menthal having a view on the NHS and you're questioning what part of the NHS he works in, yet you make a MASSIVE unfounded, unresearched, sweeping statement of "Tories would probably have sold it", so I ask you Russ, what part of the Conservative Party do you work for to have that "Insider" knowledge?

Is it time to call the BBC and get an exclusive?

No. It's not. Enough with the [edit]poop[/edit] biased party views. We're here slagging off Labour for the crap job THEY HAVE DONE. Not the Tories for something they HAVE NOT DONE.

[Bazzlad]

ibadass - as for paying through the nose, you have no idea how much each operation would cost if you were private.

That's why people get Health insurance. And I wonder how that rate compares with the tax I pay now.

[UKMuFFiN]

errrr guys, I don't know if you wanna wrap it up here before it gets way out of hand. Many points of views have been expressed and I just don't want any fallouts. Right! Grrrrr.

[Russ]

So Menthal having a view on the NHS and you're questioning what part of the NHS he works in, yet you make a MASSIVE unfounded, unresearched, sweeping statement of "Tories would probably have sold it", so I ask you Russ, what part of the Conservative Party do you work for to have that "Insider" knowledge?

Is it time to call the BBC and get an exclusive?

No. It's not. Enough with the bull**** biased party views. We're here slagging off Labour for the crap job THEY HAVE DONE. Not the Tories for something they HAVE NOT DONE.

the part that sold british rail, british gas, british steel, british telecom etc etc etc to our rich mates for flumpence?

[Bazzlad]

the part that sold british rail, british gas, british steel, british telecom etc etc etc to our rich mates for flumpence?

Well genius why didn't they sell it then? If they sold all the other companies, why not the NHS? Cause they weren't/aren't going to.
Find me ONE quote stating the Tories want to sell the NHS. Go on. ONE.

Right, if you're hung up on the past, let me bring you to the present.

The pension tax raid
A massive influx of illegal immigrants.
An "illegal" war (I personally agree with the war, but am leaving this in for arguments sake)
The fuel crisis
The firefighters strike
80 NEW taxes (Every household has seen its tax burden increase by 45 per cent AND the CPS research does not include so- called stealth taxes. If all tax rises were included - there have been 80 since 1997 - the figure would be even higher. )
The HUGE rise in Council tax
People on disability benefit rising immensely
The NHS IN THE RED
The MRSA crisis
The joke that was the CSA
Postal voting rigging
Cash for peerages
Identity cards


From the top of my head (except the 80 new taxes).

And you want to counter that with an unfounded "The tories will sell the NHS" statement.

Well done.

[Bazzlad]

And of course, overcrowed jails, people getting off quicker, asbos, selling us off to Europe even more, BEING THE ONLY "BIG" COUNTRY IN EUROPE TO PUT MORE MONEY IN THAN WE GET OUT (France, Italy and Germany get more out than they put in) THE HUMAN RIGHTS ACT

[badass]

so your mom earns 90k and moans about having to work a little over time, pity pity

Gullible Sun reading Moron.

[badass]

But in relation to the NHS and my comment about the stupid amount of money that's syphned off into management and administration, I reckon I'm pretty well placed to comment as there was an investigation at a local hospital which we instigated and were therefore intimately involved in.

To avoid going off into tangents, lets assume we both have an equal amount of inside info on the NHS

Sure... here's what you said:

First off, we don't exactly pay through the nose. Go private... THAT'S paying through the nose.

I do have private health insurance. I would not consider myself to be paying over the odds.

If you are referring to the amount taken out of your wages through PAYE and NI, I bet what you actually pay in a year doesn't even come close to the costs incurred for the treatment needed for even a minor injury like a broken arm or having your wisdom teeth out.

That is IMHO irrelevant since most people dont break arms once a year.

Sure, private healthcare is there to make a profit, but the costs are going to be pretty similar for the actual equipment used be it anaesthetic, x-rays or whatever.

Agreed, but once again IMHO irrelevant. I am saying the NHS wastes a fortune on burocracy that we have to pay for.

Second, the second half of that sentence says that NHS treatment is more likely to kill us than save us, which, unless I'm being incredibly dumb, says that you think the NHS level of care/expertise for particular patient cases is so low that you're better off not being treated but the NHS are in some way masking this fact (if you take it in the context of the whole sentence).

The statement said "in some cases" I didn't suggest it is more likely to kill you than save you. Those some cases being if you're old and go to colchester general for example.

So first off, it's rubbish that we're paying through the nose. We're not. For what the NHS achieves against how much it costs the INDIVIDUAL taxpayer each year, it's a bargain.

And now I've hopefully shown you why that isn't rubbish.

Second, it's rubbish to say that the NHS is more likely to kill than cure, yes, there are mistakes and I'm in no way saying that the NHS is perfect, (because it obviously isn't), but I kinda think that someone might have thought something was up if the NHS started wheeling out lots of dead people when they should've been alive.

And second, as said above I never claimed it was more likely to kill than save.

[b0redom]

Not quite sure where you get this paying through the nose for it thing. I recently did a round the world trip. As I'm pretty accident prone, I required serious medical attention in quite a few countries:

I got an infected cut treated in South Africa, went to hospital, and they wanted my credit card after literally everything. X-ray sir? Credit card? Thank you. Cleaning cut? Credit card? Thank you. Dressing wound? Credit card? Thank you? You need crutches? Credit Card..... That cost well over 200 quid to get looked at, plus the antibiotics, plus the crutches.

I was taken off antibiotics too early in South Africa, and needed the cut looking at again in Thailand. That, again, cost the best part of 200 quid.

In China, I got sick, and the Doc told me I had hepititis - turned out it was just a very bad stomach upset/allergy - cost of blood tests, consultancy etc again over 200 quid.

In Peru, I got a parasite and stomach infection. There I only saw a doc, didn't need to go to hospital, and even then was stung for $150 US.

In any of those circumstances you'd probably be seen by the NHS pretty much immediately, and the drugs would have cost you, a fiver or so. Tell me that's not good value for money......

Bazzlad: You're a Daily Mail reader aren't you? Go on admit it.....

Tom

[Bazzlad]

No Tom. I just live in the real world, unlike someone who goes on a round the world trip without medical insurance. Good job.

Now with your statement, are you arguing with any of my statements I made about the Labour Government? Did I make them up? Or are you a "look the other way" type of person.

[Bazzlad]

Also, add up since the day you started work how much in NI you've paid.

I've never said the NHS wasn't good value for money. I have said that it's had millions after millions thrown at it by Labour and things have not improved. In fact, trusts are now millions in the red. If you think a valid counter argument to that is attempting to belittle me by sarcastically asking if I read the Daily Mail (a paper you obviously don't rate) you're very much mistaken.

Go outside and play tag.

[Ben_]

BUPA is the way

leave the NHS to the poor people

[b0redom]

Never said I didn't have insurance. I was just pointing out that the NHS is a pretty good service compared to what the rest of the world has.

Sorry if you take offence dude it was a tongue in cheek statement.

All your arguements are typical shock headlines:

80 new taxes? 45% increase (I presume that's not adjusted to take into account inflation?) Are you really suggesting that you pay 45% more tax as a proportion of your income?

Massive increase in council tax? Still much fairer than the poll tax.

Fuel Crisis - How would you fix it? Raise more money through tax to subsidise it? Cut tax on that and move it to somewhere else?

Firefighters strike - How would you fix that? More tax so we can pay them more? Privatise it?

Cash for peerages - I'm sure this has been going on forever, same as cash for questions.

Illegal Immigrants - How do you stop this? They're illegal. How you deal with them is a different matter

You have some fair points, I agree on things like ID cards - I don't see why that can't be rolled in to passports, but unfortunately that's the problem with having an opposition which is completely inept.

There's no credible alternative so they can bend the rules, and be made to look stupid with no come back.

[Bazzlad]

Never said I didn't have insurance. I was just pointing out that the NHS is a pretty good service compared to what the rest of the world has.

So do you believe if you were a native to that Country your health care would have cost that much? Or do you think they saw a rich tourist and got what they could?

80 new taxes? 45% increase (I presume that's not adjusted to take into account inflation?) Are you really suggesting that you pay 45% more tax as a proportion of your income?

Are you saying that we DON'T pay a significant amount more? I took statistics to back up my argument, I didn't make them an Independant research commision who independantly research do. I know I pay a LOT more tax now.

Massive increase in council tax? Still much fairer than the poll tax.

Which was when? 1990? Come back with a valid, UP TO DATE argument.
So you enjoy paying a massively increased Council tax? (With REBANDING TO COME - YUMMY)

Fuel Crisis - How would you fix it? Raise more money through tax to subsidise it? Cut tax on that and move it to somewhere else?

Simple. We have the cheapest petrol in Europe. Imagine petrol is a Pound a litre. We pay 25p for our petrol. The Government then take 75p. If we didn't have a Government who throw money around like it's nothing, giving out handouts to random people who appear on our soil etc then the solution would be to lower the tax until it calmed down.

Firefighters strike - How would you fix that? More tax so we can pay them more? Privatise it?

Pay them an increase in line with inflation. Difficult that one.

Cash for peerages - I'm sure this has been going on forever, same as cash for questions.

And that justifies it how? Murder has happened forever, I'm still not a fan of that.

Illegal Immigrants - How do you stop this? They're illegal. How you deal with them is a different matter

You obviously don't have a lot of vision. When labour came to power one of the first things they did was remove all port guards saying they weren't necassary. How to deal with it. Guards, Dentention centres and Planes. Thats how America and Austrailia do it, why should we be the soft touch?

The opposition being inept does not justify the mistakes Labour have made. Simple as.

They've wasted on the NHS, they're ruining our Country.
Not saying the Tories could do better, but it'd be a task to do worse.