Nvidia encourages retailers to look after gamers

[watercooled]

Not sure output can. Crypto currencies are like a electricity eating cancer that make GPUs look like money printing machines. If more money printing machines are released on the market, what would stop people from buying them as well? If GPU production went up a magnitude I doubt it would help gamers, but it might lead to rolling blackouts from electricity used.

It really is isn't it? The market just hurts everyone involved besides retailers - as others have said it's far too risky to substantially increase production like AMD did a few years ago and had to write-down stock. People don't seem to understand that the turnaround time from order to product for processors is measured in months - being able to accurately predict a staggeringly volatile market that far in advance is near-impossible.

It's not great business for the fabs for the same reason - they have a finite capacity they need to fill and if/when the market collapses again, they're out of pocked. Fabs cost on the order of billions and take several years to build, so 'just make more' is not that simple. And I doubt even doubling production would make a jot of difference at the moment.

I don't know what the environmental impact the fabrication causes, but the electricity demands are pretty catastrophic. And it's pretty painful to see so many carefully-engineered products dumped into a task which is entirely pointless by design. I just see the whole thing as horrid now. I can understand the argument for it being a good concept, but it's badly flawed in the real world when greed etc come into play.

It's really not decentralised in reality, it's not remotely anonymous, it's far too volatile, transaction fees are laughably high, there's no financial protection e.g. chargebacks, the processing time is stupidly high, and it's grotesquely power-hungry - something like 215kWh for ONE transaction for BTC! So... what's the attraction of using it as an actual currency again?

[elites2012]

only the dumb will blow that kind of unnecessary money on a video card. now if you really need one, then buy it, but most of the gamers dont need one that bad. to each their own!

[watercooled]

You're missing the point I think? The impact stretches right across the range from good value mid-range cards upwards - it's not just the silly-expensive top-end stuff.

[Xlucine]

Remind me, why are ASIC-resistant coins a good thing?

[Noli]

Wow, I'm actually surprised and impressed that Nvidia would take this stance.

I've got a little bit more respect for them now. I don't think this will change too much though.

It's the idea that is what's impressing me.

They don't care about you at all Knight.

Think about it: nvidia say that miners come first - what happens?
Miners don't care and just keep buying cards like they always have.
Gamers go mad with rage at this fundamental betrayal and vow never to buy nvidia again.

nvidia say that gamers come first - what happens?
Miners don't care and just keep buying cards like they always have. No change there then.
Some gamers say, "Hey, they're really *trying*. They love us. I have soooo much new found respect for nvidia."
They have just earned more brand loyalty for if / when the crypto craze dies down.

This brand loyalty is like being in love with Scarlett Johansson. It's not real and she doesn't care about you.
nvidia's job, like that of any other company, is to make money.
Being seen to butter up (certain) of their customers is just part of that... nothing more than good PR

[Lord Midas]

Looks like my new PC build is on hold. These kind of prices are prohibitive. It's not like my i5 3570k with RX480 isn't able to pleasantly play games anyway. I can wait.

[afiretruck]

Looks like my new PC build is on hold. These kind of prices are prohibitive. It's not like my i5 3570k with RX480 isn't able to pleasantly play games anyway. I can wait.

Good call. That RX480 should be able to hang in there a few more years, anyway.

[DanceswithUnix]

Remind me, why are ASIC-resistant coins a good thing?

Beats me, I would have thought mass production of something designed for the task was the correct way forward to "democratise" any technology.

[Corky34]

I'm only going on what I've read but apparently miners avoid dedicated ASIC's because there's little resale value in them so $ spent on them are lost forever versus reselling GPUs.

[SkywalkerLuke]

And there was me waiting for prices to drop a little before investing in a new graphics card for gaming... Looks like I may have to wait a couple of more years now with prices the way they are. Surely this is going to kill off the market for graphics card makers with the crypto market the only driver for sales?!

[Ozaron]

I'm only going on what I've read but apparently miners avoid dedicated ASIC's because there's little resale value in them so $ spent on them are lost forever versus reselling GPUs.

What sane human bean buys a GPU which has been forced into bitcoin slavery? It was my understanding they're only sold when newer, more effective solutions come along (not happening soon) or when they're near death. Or, I suppose, when the miner defaults and has their setup taken apart and sold.

[aniilv]

Why do bitcoin miners need cards like 1050ti? Because surely if its just bitcoin peeps fault then mid/low range cards should have no or almost no impact, yet 1050ti price is higher than it was at release like year ago.

[Corky34]

What sane human bean buys a GPU which has been forced into bitcoin slavery? It was my understanding they're only sold when newer, more effective solutions come along (not happening soon) or when they're near death. Or, I suppose, when the miner defaults and has their setup taken apart and sold.

People who want cheap graphics cards i guess, I've not looked but i suspect someone selling secondhand cards doesn't advertise the fact they've been used for mining.

I'd consider buying a cheap secondhand card if it was half, or less, than current retail prices as I'm unaware how 24/7 mining even effects a card.....Time to go do some reading.

[DanceswithUnix]

I'm only going on what I've read but apparently miners avoid dedicated ASIC's because there's little resale value in them so $ spent on them are lost forever versus reselling GPUs.

Don't see how, you can only mine Bitcoin these days with a dedicated ASIC or you will be making a massive loss. If no-one used ASICs then using a GPU would still be viable.

Why do bitcoin miners need cards like 1050ti? Because surely if its just bitcoin peeps fault then mid/low range cards should have no or almost no impact, yet 1050ti price is higher than it was at release like year ago.

It is down to work done per watt, and on that metric the lower end cards don't look all that bad. If you can't buy any Vega 56/64 cards then I guess they are just buying whatever they can lay hands on. You need 4GB of ram on the card though, so that sets a lower end of the range that is usable. However, if for the price of a few 1050ti cards you can buy a 1070 then you would buy a single 1070 and have room for expansion.

Either that or people who need to buy a graphics card for graphics are finding that is the card they can afford because all the better cards are gone, so it might be the gamers scrabbling over scraps that pushes up the price of scraps.

[DanceswithUnix]

AIUI if everyone across the board doubles the size of their mining operation then the system adjusts the difficulty so that the work rate remains the same?

If so, then the sane thing to do would be for all miners to just stop buying cards. But it is an arms race with people trying to increase their share of the "mining".

That would make crypto currencies a sort of Prisoner's Dilemma, but with lots of prisoners to guarantee we all lose.

[Corky34]

Don't see how, you can only mine Bitcoin these days with a dedicated ASIC or you will be making a massive loss. If no-one used ASICs then using a GPU would still be viable.

Mining Bitcoin is all but dead due to it not being cost effective no matter what you use, i was talking about cryptocurrency in general and generally GPUs can be used for different types of cryptocurrency whereas ASIC's are (afaik) dedicated to specific currencies. There's also the warranty thing that i forgot to mention, GPUs come with them and ASICs don't.