Virgin Throttling

[Weetabix]

It's the hours they class as peak that's really the kicker. 4pm till midnight is basically your full day if you work 9-5. And the download limits are a little low tbh. If I was to download BF2142 + Northern Strike from EA Link, even if it took me 5 hours at crappy speeds, that's me capped. Anything below their top package is now basically for web browsing only.

Considering they advertised the 10Mb package as something for 'the heaviest users of the internet', 3 gig is an absolute joke.

[MD]

is now basically for web browsing only.

Im sorry, but I cannot see how you can justify in any way, even for the middle tier class a 2mb connection as 'web browsing only'

[Weetabix]

Because they're paying for 4Mb for a reason. If 2Mb was sufficient for their needs, I'm sure people would have saved the money and opted for the 2Mb package.

edit> what about multi-user environments? Even with QoS, Joe Bloggs is gonna find it hard to play on his PC while his little brother is playing on his 360 as the upload takes a good hit too.

[Elessar_VPR]

4pm till midnight is basically your full day if you work 9-5.

Agreed, but that's why they are called peak times, as it's the same for most people.

And the download limits are a little low tbh. If I was to download BF2142 + Northern Strike from EA Link, even if it took me 5 hours at crappy speeds, that's me capped. Anything below their top package is now basically for web browsing only.

Okay...but you're not going to be doing that every day are you. A couple of months ago I monitored my usage for interests sake, over a 3 month period I probably averaged around 2.5-3Gb per month! Now admittedly I don't game online that much, but I download a fair amount (stupid Oblivion ) and was browsing a lot. Even capped at 350Mb a night before being throttled (which is far better than being shut off or paying through the teeth for any excess) most users will rarely be hit and if you are regularly, then you should probably consider being on a higher package anyway. Honestly I can't imagine regularly maxing out 3GB in an 8hour period, and if so only rarely, and hey even then you've still got a 10Mb connection which isn't exactly slow.

[Weetabix]

Agreed, but that's why they are called peak times, as it's the same for most people.

Why should I be bothered about stressing their UBR's? I've paid my money (there's cheaper equivalent speed ISP's out there) and I expect to get what I pay for. If their infrastructure is creaking then upgrade it. They've basically upgraded our speeds without upgrading their equipment to cope and have introduced throttling to 'pay' for the higher speeds, while the real cash from customers goes into the pockets of a gaffer.

Okay...but you're not going to be doing that every day are you. A couple of months ago I monitored my usage for interests sake, over a 3 month period I probably averaged around 2.5-3Gb per month!

Everybody's different tho. I run a gaming website and I'm forever downloading demos and patches. I also download a lot from Xbox Live and stuff for my PS3. Some of these things can be huge.

and hey even then you've still got a 10Mb connection which isn't exactly slow.

The 20Mb gets a 75% cap and I end up with 5Mb.

[jamin]

Everybody's different tho. I run a gaming website and I'm forever downloading demos and patches. I also download a lot from Xbox Live and stuff for my PS3. Some of these things can be huge.


The 20Mb gets a 75% cap and I end up with 5Mb.

So I take it that as a business user, you pay for a business package? No, oh hang on VM business packages dont have these restrictions..

In short mate, don't take the cheap option..... Have dealt with loads of business users in my time that think they can pay for a residential package and get a business service. This is part of the reason for these new restrictions.

[Weetabix]

So I take it that as a business user, you pay for a business package? No, oh hang on VM business packages dont have these restrictions...

It's not a business, nor is it hosted by VM. It's a hobby from which I don't make a cent. Anyway's that's besides the point. I used that as an example of one of the million ways anyone can easily use up the meager limit they imposed. Joost perhaps? Vuze? The VM XL package is one of the most expensive home packages going, why shouldn't we expect a little extra?

In short mate, don't take the cheap option..... Have dealt with loads of business users in my time that think they can pay for a residential package and get a business service. This is part of the reason for these new restrictions.

Blueyonder has never been the cheap option. How about you take a leaf out of your own book and don't sell bandwidth you don't have?

[Jay]

Virgin Media are introducing speed capping measures that for users who download large amounts from the Net during peak hours. Peak hours have been defined as 4pm to midnight which is much longer than for most other ISPs, who consider 6pm to 10pm to be the peak.

Virgin claim that only 5% of downloaders will be affected, but looking at the bands I’m not too sure:


M tier users who download over 350MB will have their speed capped at 1Mbps during peak
L tier users who download over 750MB will have their speed restricted to 2Mbps during peak
XL users who download over 3GB in peak hours will have their speed restricted to 5Mbps
Once a user hits the download limit for their tier then their speed will be capped for four hours. The bands look pretty low to me so I’m sure that it will affect more than 5% of users. Also, the way the scheme appears to be setup will extend the period of capping e.g. if a XL user hits the 3GB limit at 11pm, then their speed will be capped for four hours until 3am.

Personally, I’m quite disappointed by this as I regularly download more than 3GB during ‘peak’ and I wouldn’t even classify my usage as heavy. I’ve also been a big champion of Cable’s unlimited policy in the past and this feels like a big let-down.

The Virgin Media FAQ tries to make out that many users will benefit from the upcoming 20Mbps upgrade (although looking at the timetable it looks like the dates have slipped already), but most users don’t need more speed - they want unlimited downloads.

taken from http://www.connectedinternet.co.uk/2...ce-speed-caps/

I agree with the above.

How can I check what we have downloaded in a multi users setup with out changing the firmware in my WRT54G?

[Weetabix]

Virgin links to this;

http://www.hageltech.com/dumeter/

[Jay]

Virgin links to this;


http://www.hageltech.com/dumeter/

well that is going to be an issue. My server that I use to download torrents also streams my HD content around the house. This is going to give me a false reading.

[jamin]

It's not a business, nor is it hosted by VM. It's a hobby from which I don't make a cent. Anyway's that's besides the point. I used that as an example of one of the million ways anyone can easily use up the meager limit they imposed. Joost perhaps? Vuze? The VM XL package is one of the most expensive home packages going, why shouldn't we expect a little extra?

Ok... The way you put it originally, it came across as if you were running a server which in the eyes of an ISP is business use. I find it hard to believe that a joost user would rack up 3gb of downloads in an evening mate.... As for getting a little extra, you pay for a service. What extra do you want? I pay for a window cleaner but I don't expect him to cut my lawn...

Blueyonder has never been the cheap option.

Granted, but you have taken my comment out of context. I was commenting about the business packages not being restricted in the manner of residential packages.

How about you take a leaf out of your own book and don't sell bandwidth you don't have?

Eh? I'm not selling a service....... What are you on about?

[Weetabix]

I find it hard to believe that a joost user would rack up 3gb of downloads in an evening mate....

Not on it's own, you've taken that a little literally. It does use a fair bit of bandwidth, so it can use up a chunk of you 3 gig before you download some hd trailers or whatever.

As for getting a little extra, you pay for a service. What extra do you want? I pay for a window cleaner but I don't expect him to cut my lawn...

I was comparing VM to other ISPs. VM customers pay more than for an equivalent ADSL service, and therefore should expect a better service. ie no restrictions, or at the very least, lesser restrictions than what has been imposed. I wouldn't be too bothered if I was shaped to 10 meg, but 5 is taking the urine slightly imho.

Eh? I'm not selling a service....... What are you on about?

Again, I was talking about VM taking the cheap option. We lost Sky1 etc because VM didn't want to pass on the extra cost to the customer; fair enough. So VM saved itself a good few million; didn't see the savings reflected in my bill despite my reduced service. Perhaps they re-invested that money in upgraded kit?

Now you can stand there from now till doomsday and tell me this traffic shaping is meant to improve the service for others. Let's face it, it's a thinly disguised method of extending the life of your current hardware thus cutting costs and milking your customers a bit more. It's far from the 'fair' that 'fair usage' implies.

[jamin]

I'm finished on this topic...... You are blurring your arguments and you aren't reading whats being said mate.....

[Weetabix]

I'm finished on this topic...... You are blurring your arguments and you aren't reading whats being said mate.....

?

[BlackAle]

I'm quite happy with the changes, those who say they should be able to use it as they like, obviously don't realise they're buying a contended product.

If you want to have maximum availability I suggest a 1:1 leased line, I suggest you go look at the prices of those, before complaining about not getting the service you've paid for.

[Weetabix]

So why not try shaping P2P traffic first and see how that works before slapping everyone with this? Anyways, I'm done.........