plusnet broadband - dont signup!!

[bsodmike]

Woah, who are you with :-o

That's awesome hehe!

[s29feb]

Just because something is written in a contract and you sign it, doesnt mean you are
bound to it. If there is something unfair then it cant be applied.

I forget the correct terminology for that.

Funny but I don't remeber actually signing anyhting for plusnet it was all done online?

Does an email informing you about changes to T&C's work this way also?

I'm severly hacked off, BT will not go above 10KB in the evening GGGRRRRRR

[dangel]

Woah, who are you with :-o

That's awesome hehe!

UK Online. 500gig is only a guideline too..
PM me if you decide to go that way

[badass]

Badass: WTF does some dodgy 2nd hand cars salesman writing on a receipt have to do with a large telecoms provider changing their T+Cs?

They are both covered by consumer law

This has been brought up time and time again, was brought up when BT changed their dialup timeout to 2hrs. Was brought up when dialup co's started banning people for overuse. Was brought up when broadband providers started to disconnect people for overuse. Was brought up when NTL introduced caps. And now we're seeing caps etc. on ADSL.

When they banned people, they stopped charging them
What we are looking at here is him cancelling as a result of the contract changing. Something he is well within his rights to do.

Check out ADSLguide for posts like yours - threating to bring down the law on them. Nothing happened.

There is no threat to bring down the law on them. There is a defence if tehy try to bring the law down on him. That is a big difference since in all likelyhood, they wont bother to chase him beyond a few letters.

I think Agent is right - it's all about "reasonable" changes. Allowing capping will defo be seen as reasonable because so many providers have done the exact same thing in the past.

Thats like defending yourself for theft using the excuse "many have done it in the past"
If a service is advertised as unlimited and you sign up and they then change the contract to make it not unlimited I dont think it would be hard to argue in court those changes are unreasonable, and a perfect reason to end the contract, paying no further.

Law is based on past cases.
Case closed.

This statement proves just how little you know.
You are presumably talking about case law. i.e. cases which set precedants.
There have been no cases of this kind, so no precedant has been set.
Why is this? Because any case of this kind will start at the County court. These cannot set precedants full stop. Only when it goes to crown court or further. The only way for something like this to go to crown court if is there is enough money involved - something that isn't going to happen for am years worth of broadband connection or if the defendant appeals. Very unlikely as fees start getting large.

The point is you have no experience of consumer law and have never been to court. I have both. You are arguing you know better based on the contents of some web forum.
Thats not very clever.

[badass]

Badass, re: the debt recovery...could they have stuck a black mark against your credit rating for none payment?

That potential problem is dealt with in one of my earlier posts.

[Ramedge]

If you sign up to an "Unlimited Connection" then thats what you get, because thats what you signed up for.. Yes?

if your provider goes and changes the Terms and conditions and then contacts you saying that you now no longer have an "Unlimited Connection" then I would say that your ISP needs to make sure the customer agrees to these new Terms or if not the provider should provide the user with an alturnitive or their MAC code.

If Plus net break the contract in any way then you should be allowed to leave with out paying a fee for leaving early and because you havent yet argreed to these new terms and conditions i would see that as a breach of contract on plus.nets half.

I am no legal expert (nor will i pretend to be) so sorry if I am totally wrong. Its just that this is the way I see it.

btw: My mate managed to get off of BT by just making sure he used the most bandwidth he could untill they kicked him off.
Worth a try as a last resort huh ?

[bertie]

I'm tempted to do that with plusnet - they are absolute weasels and pass everything off as trying to make the broadband experience better, but woe betide those who try to use it for anything other than basic browsing etc.
As someone else said they are just cheapskates who won't buy more capacity so are CONSTANTLY changing their traffic management and capping policies.
I was experiencing terrible speeds until JUST recently, and they said they weren't obliged to provide me with ANY service according to the contract!
A shame as they used to be a good ISP but now there are nothing but complaints, partially due to BT changing the way bandwidth is allocated I think but I have not yet seen another ISP take traffic management and capping to this extreme level, and gone so far out of their way to deceive the customer.


By the way very nice post badass, a good read

[badass]

By the way very nice post badass, a good read

Should you decide to do this to get off your contract, get anything they say on the phone confirmed by email and keep me posted at every stage of the way so I can help you avoid any avoidable problems.

[s29feb]

This is the email they sent in September to tell everyone of the changes to their accounts, I did read thsi but I saw nowhere in the email - We are now going to cap your coonection and throttle your bandwith at peak times?

Dear Mr John Barber,

This email is to let you know that we are making some changes to your PlusNet Terms and Conditions. We are making them shorter and easier to understand, as well as introducing some new features to our network.


Summary of changes:

We have made a number of changes aimed at improving our relationship with our customers.

- Ensuring that our Terms and Conditions comply fully with the Consumer Protection (Distance Selling) Regulations 2000, giving you peace of mind when buying from us.
- Reinforcement of our commitment to giving you 'reasonable notice' of any changes, upgrades or alterations to the service.

We have also made a number of changes to the Acceptable Use Policy. The changes mean that we can continue to provide our customers with an excellent quality broadband experience, particularly during peak hours.

- Introduction of 'idle time-outs' for Broadband Plus and ADSL Home Surf customers only. This means that we will disconnect any sessions that are inactive for a period of thirty minutes. As long as your connection is in active use, you will not be disconnected. If you are disconnected you will be able to reconnect straight away. Please note that idle-timeouts will not be implemented on Premier, Pay As You go or Business accounts.
- Introduction of traffic prioritisation techniques to all broadband accounts. This will ensure that we can continue to deliver an excellent and consistent service, particularly at peak times, for customers using time-sensitive applications such as VoIP, email, web browsing and gaming.


You can view the new Terms and Conditions and Acceptable Use Policy at http://www.plus.net/info2/legal/index.html

These new Terms and Conditions will replace all existing Terms and Conditions on Friday 16th September 2005. We will assume that you accept these new Terms and Conditions unless you contact us by this date to indicate otherwise. If you do not wish to accept these new Terms and Conditions please use the Contact Us tool.

If you would like to understand more about our pricing, products and how we manage our network to ensure the best customer experience please visit our Member Centre at http://portal.plus.net/

We would like to take this opportunity to thank you for your continued custom.

Kind Regards,
PlusNet Customer Support

[s29feb]

From the first mail they said:

Actioned : Dear Mr Barber,
You are in an annual contract but this can be waivered in this instance.

However deffered fees must be paid, which currently total 83.75

The Terms & Conditions of all accounts were changed in early september last year, notification was sent out of this at the end of august.

The new T&C's advise that we will manage our network as we need to. All customers had the chance to leave us also.

The Traffic Management will be lifted from your account on Feb 7th - your next billing date.

Regards,
Andrew Bunker

I replied

Hi,

I have now looked at the email sent in September, which I now remember reading and I have enclosed below. You can see that nowhere in the email do you state that you are now going to cap the uncapped service that I signed for, nor did it mention that you are going to throttle certain types of downloads at peak times, therefore in my stupidity I never read the whole terms and conditions, as I once again point out that I signed for an uncapped service and this is what I expected.

In fact I find it despicable that a short time ago you market yourselves as an uncapped service offering premiun contention knowing that high usage individauals will sign for it, then in a complete turnaround change the terms and conditions. Hiding behind your weasely excuse of trying to make the "broadband experience" better for everyone, when infact most serious internet users (check many forums) now view you as cheapskates who don't buy enough capacity and think it is okay to move the goalposts to suit your game.

I would like to point out, and will infact do so at every opportunity I have that I signed for an uncapped service, you claim to have notified me of these changes (check for words capped and throttled in the below email, can you find them?) using "prioritisation techniques" on my "premium" low contention advertised connection.

You have changed yur terms and condtions, but I entered into a spefic contract were when agreed I expect an uncapped unthrotteld service. I would view that compliancy in this instance is a a mutual thing, yes you have the right at any time to notify me of changes, but at anytime therafter I feel I should be allowed to cancel my contract with no penalty at anytime. If it's good enough for Plusnet then why is not good enough for your customers?

All the best

John

[Agent]

UK Online. 500gig is only a guideline too..
PM me if you decide to go that way

UKOnline are now uncapped

[s29feb]

Dunno if anyone cares but the saga continues... and will do so forever ha ha ha!

Plusnet:

IN August we changed our terms and conditions we gave every customer the chance to cancel or migrate away. As you have stayed since then, that means you have accepted the new terms and conditions.
To cancel you need to pay for the remainder of your contract and for deferred activation/hardware.
Regards,
Muhit Khan

Me:

Yes I see you changed your terms and conditions, however the email which I read did not say "capped" or "throttled" or words to that effect.

You are still an underhand bunch of weasels who change the goalposts to suit your penny pinching game of not having to purchase enough capactiy and masquerading it as a "better broadband experience".

I wanted to purchase an uncapped and unrestricted service, which I did, and which you have subsequently changed?

Please answer me this, did I or did I not originally enter into an service that offered uncapped unlimited usage?

The email you sent to say the terms and conditions had changed, funny thing is I cannot see anything in the summary withe the big bold words saying YOU ARE NOW ON A CAPPED SERVICE

I thought about a new slogan for your service

Plusnet - The smarter way to shaft internet users?

As always healthy regards

John

[s29feb]

Their T&C's

3. The Service

3.1 Subject to these Conditions PlusNet will provide the Services and/or Equipment specified in the Customer Order.

31. General

31.1 Nothing in these Conditions affects your statutory rights as a consumer.

Other T&C's basicalyl say we can bugger you with a splintery brush pole anytime we want but hopefull the above 2 will lead to something?

[s29feb]

Please see:

http://forums.hexus.net/showthread.p...623#post686623

[bsodmike]

Well these biotches want £47 off me now, and I think they will give me my MAC for this. Is there anyway to get these weasels to not charge this

[badass]

They notified everyone of their changes several months ago? :-\
That changes things. Completely.
The impresion I got here was that they had just announced the changes.
By continuing to use the service you signify an acceptance of those changes. That email had a link to their terms and conditions in full.
You cant carry on using their service, and then 3 months later decide that you dont like the changes and so you want out of the contract
Its too late.

Secondly, to enter into a contract you do not have to sign anything. Usually paying for it signifies the consumers acceptance of any contract/terms and conditions they may have (provided they are legal)
The acceptance of the contract on the sellers part is when either they accept the money or they communicate acceptance to you in some other way.
Why has everyone waited for months before doing anything about this?