Eye Strain & Injury? - PLEASE HELP!

[WoLFe]

Hello. This is quite a serious topic, so please bear with me if this is a long opener. I will try to make this as rant-less as possible...

I recently (ish) purchased a nicely spec'd Mesh Computer, with a Nvidia 9600GT and "Chimei CMV223D 22" Wide Screen LCD" monitor. For reference, here is the EXACT monitor and card I am currently using.

http://www.scan.co.uk/product.aspx?ProductId=22640

http://www.***********.net/reviews.p...g94_unveiled/2

As you can see, nice gear (in theory, right?)

Like many, I have experienced the stressful "No signal" issue with Nvidia/Vista (Though let's be honest, the issue covers a wide range of Nvidia cards, Monitor brands and models and even OS).

With little support from Mesh - The only way I have managed to get a picture is by running a VGA cable to the monitor, with a VGA/DVI converter in the back of the graphics card. "True" DVI or a DVI connection doesn't work or is extremely unreliable. Only yesterday the resolution I was running "1680x1050" is now no longer available. I was using it at 60hz refresh rate. I am now using 1440x900 at 75hz, which SEEMS to be smoother. Games are CERTAINLY smoother with this setting and the higher refresh rate.

Now, there is much confusion around LCD monitors. Some people say HZ rate doesn't come into consideration. Is this true, even when running an analogue/VGA connection? My old CRT, which was a trusty Mitsubishi 19inch wide, ran at 120hz refresh rate in 1024x768 and 100 in the one slightly higher than that. I never seem to remember having these problems.

I have noticed when I scroll down on certain websites, for example... www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum a slight shimmering affect in the textured back areas of the screen.

I have been to the doctor about this, had an eye test - all come back fine. Infact my vision is super good, but my eye muscles are slightly weak.

Is it possible I am experiencing this eye strain and unpleasant feeling due to a LCD monitor and graphics card designed for DVI having to output a VGA/analogue signal? Is it possible I just don't agree with this monitor? I used my brothers LCD monitor (19inch regular, few years old) and I didn't get on great with that either.

I've spoken to my dad about this and he claims the quality of LCDs and flatscreens is a gimmic, con and less than traditional sets and monitors. I am not here to argue that, but I really want some of your opinions. Am I over-reacting or is there an obvious solution? I can't just throw money at a new monitor and/or a graphics card.

If any more information is needed I'm happy to post it. Thank you.

EDIT - Now I have had to use this resolution and I'm using a 75hz refresh rate the experience is smoother, but text is less sharp - I assume this is because it is not the native resolution, or God knows what...

A final point... In the Nvidia Control Panel, under the Display > Change Resolution tab, the monitor is now known as a "Analogue Display" - until yesterday it had the name CVV200 Or something like that, not sure exactly.

Also, under properties it is known as a "Generic PnP Monitor on NVIDIA 9600 GT"

[WoLFe]

Just to update, it is now working with a DVI-D cable.. on 1680x1050, and its forced at 60hz right? It looks good, and I have the text size/overall size at DPI 120 (default is 96) but my eyes still itch!

[Webby]

First the easiest point to answer is that yes your text is blurry due to not being at native resolution.

The refresh rate is based on a couple of things one is the bandwidth of a DVI cable which is why the refresh goes up as the resolution goes down (less information is being sent per packet, so more packets can be sent in a given time period) then past that is the response time of the pixels. I would only expect it to look smoother in games and this will be due to higher frame rates rather than the actual refresh rate of the monitor, on general desktop you shouldn't notice a difference as only when a pixels colour is updated does it actually change.

As to why your eyes hurt have you tried turning the brightness down? In normal lighting conditions you want your monitor to be providing ~120 cd/m2 all monitors can exceed this value, so turning down the brightness really can help, unfortunately without a screen calibration tool you will be unable to determine the exact values. If your brightness is currently at 100% (a lot of monitors have this as default) then try turning it down to 75% it will take a while to get used to it but through personal experience makes using a monitor for prolonged periods a lot easier.

[WoLFe]

Thanks for the reply Webby I currently have the brightness on 18 out of 100, and the contrast on 8 out of 100.. That sounds really low, but much higher and it doesn't appear to look right.

I've increased the text size to 120DPI and I prefer it now. I'm going to be taking a big break from the PC shortly. The refresh rate on DVI seems to stay at 60hz no matter what, and most of the lower resolutions look blurry too.

[Webby]

Yeah any resolution lower than native will be blurry (apart from one with the same aspect ratio and 1/4 the total resolution that will just look blocky ) because the LCD has actual pixels and when you lower the resolution it stretches the image to fill the screen making 1 pixel fill 1.3 pixels for example but what colour should the pixels be since most are a combination of 2 or more.

Yeah if the brightness is down at 8% then you can't really go a lot lower, to little is bad as well of course so you could try raising it up a little.

If you want to make sure the monitor is at the right settings you could purchase a suitable monitor calibration tool, but these are expensive with the cheapest models being ~£60 and the professional ones £300, the cheapest that I know of that would give you all the relevant information about luminescence is the X-Rite eye-one display 2 which sells for £130-170. This seems like a lot of money to spend if you don't need the colour calibration it will also provide.

[WoLFe]

Thanks so far, I will just take a break from it for now and see what happens over the next few days.

If anyone has anything to add, please do.. cheers!

[WoLFe]

I still feel I need help with this, anyone?

[ed^chigliak]

If the screen is 16.2m colours then it uses a dithering technique to trick the eye into seeing the full colour range of 16.7m colours. Screens which are capable of 16.7m colours without any trickery are imo easier on the eyes. My first experience with LCDs having a shimmering when panning / scrolling was annoying and an irritation when trying to read scrolling text. Don't read when scrolling or panning and wait for a static screen which with LCD panels tends to be pin sharp and and improvement over CRT. DVI is better than D-SUB for sharpness. 60Hz seems to be irrelevant on the LCD and is not a problem in my opinion. 60Hz on CRT was god awful and gave me a stinking headache.

My latest screen is TN with wide colour gamut with 2ms response rate on DVI @ 60Hz. It does not shimmer when scrolling like my previous screens before it.

[EndlessWaves]

If the screen is 16.2m colours then it uses a dithering technique to trick the eye into seeing the full colour range of 16.7m colours.

Actually, there's no such thing as a screen that can do 16.2m colours natively, home LCDs are either 8-bit (16.7m colours) or 6-bit with dithering (262,144 colours dithered to either 16.2m or 16.7m depending on the dithering used).

Refresh rate doesn't affect flicking on an LCD monitor. LCDs do flicker for a couple of reasons (temportal dithering & pixel polarity inversion) but that's not affected by the refresh rate.

However, refresh rate is how many images are displayed per second. And increasing the refresh rate will allow more images to be displayed per second which can make motion smoother which may be what you're seeing in games. You do have to be a little careful with this though, as some LCDs will accept higher refresh rates but drop frames and only display the content at their standard refresh rate (usually 60hz/fps).

You do probably want brightness turned down but contrast is usually best left on it's default value.

I have recently switched to an LCD from a CRT as well and while I'm not getting actual eyestrain (once I'd turned the brightness down) it does seem less nice to view than my previous CRT.

[ed^chigliak]

OK I stand corrected. The 6 bit panels uses the dithering technique to trick the eye into seeing 16.2m colours which is the figure commonly quoted hence the confusion. Certain colours can shimmer when scrolling on a 6 bit (bogus 16.2m colour) LCD.

[WoLFe]

I've turned the brightness down to 10 now, and I'm even using shades now. Is it possible it is the UV Floresent backlighting giving me all or most of the problem/s?

I don't think I get on very well with those energy saving floresent bulbs either, so I'm stocking up on the old style bayonet 60watts variety.

[shadowmaster]

No harm in trying the old style bulbs I prefer them over the energy saving ones. I know they are more power greedy but the health of eyes are more important then the elecy bill (well its my parents bill )

[WoLFe]

Glad to know I'm not the only one! I heard they are going to be harder to get after March - it'll be a shame if there is little choice available..

[EndlessWaves]

I don't think I get on very well with those energy saving floresent bulbs either, so I'm stocking up on the old style bayonet 60watts variety.

Have you tried LED bulbs?

[CountStex]

On your point about the eye muscles being weak. This will not be to do with the LCD, but just computer use in general. Constantly focusing at a fixed distance, eye to screen, for long periods each day is an unnatural thing for the eye to do. Out in the 'real world' the eye is constantly moving from near to far focal points as you look around, and this keeps the eyes muscles fit and healthy. There are exercises you can do to help maintain the muscles in the eye, and I believe just 10 minutes or so a day of this can really help, although I am speaking theoretically here as I fail to do this myself! Thankful it's effects are minor for me, and a very light prescription (0.75) is required to fix this, which means I only need wear glasses for driving and I prefer them when watching TV.
As well as the brightness of the screen, how do you light the room when using the PC? A lot of people tend to darken a room when gaming/movie watching, and whilst this do allow you to concentrate more on the screen, it can lead to stain also. I believe this is due to the darkened surroundings forcing the pupil to open wider, but then the bright light source of the monitor has a greater area to enter the eye. For normal use I would recommend staying in a well lit environment. A once a week trip to the cinema to watch movies in the dark is ok, several hours a day is another matter..

[WoLFe]

Thanks for the continued replies. I have actually moved the PC to a much nicer room now. I have the choice of a 60 watt or 100 watt bulb but the 60 watt seems bright enough for me.

I have turned the brightness down to 0 now and I am using shades. I have looked at filters but not sure there are any suitable for a 22" widescreen format. They are very expensive. I have heard someone claimed to have got some tinted/quality glass specially cut and placed infront of the screen.

Do I have any other options? Thank you.